02-22-2010, 06:39 PM
Worshipping at the temple of Severus Snape
Why should I give it a rest? You can't change the facts that he said all those things just because you don't like it.
Originally Posted by amateur
He is not mature, he has no class - at the moment. So yes, nobody is perfect, and yes every young person has things to learn. But if you say he has things to learn then you yourself are in fact saying he is not acting as he should.
So if he isn't acting as he should then there is something wrong. And enough with this young people nonsense! There are plenty of young people who do not act like this at that age. Fame hit him in the head, and hit him hard, not the first, not the last - somebody should give him a little shake, metaphorically, and get him to wise up.
Heck even Evan Lysacek put him down, hard, last year about his statements. Not that it did him any good, as it keeps on repeating and repeating and repeating.
One lapse in judgement happens. Two, sure. But this just goes on and on with Chan. But he's young right, so it's ok
02-22-2010, 06:58 PM
If I may enter the fray *wink*, I just want to say that Patrick Chan doesn't offend me at all, what he does do is make me LOL!
Seriously, how can you not laugh at some of the statements he has made. I mean come on it's great theater. *smile*
02-22-2010, 07:23 PM
Patrick's smile makes everything better He's such a cutie I can't not like him.
02-25-2010, 02:31 AM
Stojko: "The Night They Killed Figure Skating." (Are quads undervalued?)
02-25-2010, 08:05 AM
I disagree. He's not bitter, just stating his opinion based on the facts as he sees them. I don't totally disagree with him, either. The irony of showing Evan actually doing a quad on an interview after the fact actually validates Elvis, because Evan didn't bring it when it counted which would require risk and courage.
02-25-2010, 08:07 AM
Good, a gold medal for Evan validates Elvis then. :D
Originally Posted by taikwan
02-25-2010, 08:09 AM
Columnists are supposed to be opinionated and drive attention/traffic to the newspaper/website. It may seem "bitter" because of his history, and there may be some truth to that, but I don't think that is what is driving him to take these latest stances. The more attention that Stojko gets for articles like this, the more he gets rewarded.
02-25-2010, 08:42 AM
Just because someone 'can' do something, doesn't mean they 'must', especially if it's hazardous to their health, as it would have been to Evan's foot. I mean, I'm sure I could jump off a 50 foot cliff into the ocean, but I'm not going to because maybe I'll land on a rock.
Originally Posted by taikwan
Personally I think it took courage for Evan NOT to do the quad, knowing the flack he'd probably receive for it. But he did what was best for him, regardless of the criticism, and has been nothing but completely gracious and solid in his acknowledgement of the fact that while he didn't do the quad, it was the best decision for him.
02-25-2010, 09:23 AM
The part where Elvis is correct, is that the Elements are not being understood for their difficulty. Male Senior skaters are quite capable of 8 Triple Jumps. However to execute those jumps with an additional air rotation is extremely difficult. Can you deny that? It means that even those skaters blessed with natural rotation have to work at quads. Elvis feels (and I do also) that they should be rewarded.
I kinda believe Elvis is saying that the rest of the judging should take place only for those who presented a clean Quad in their program. Similarly 3A for the Ladies.
This is not much different than barrel jumping where the referee would continue to add another barrel until a winner was reached. Whether you like it or not, that is SPORT.
Elvis is not negating the rest of the program but he is demanding a Quad for the Men; a 3A for the Ladies. It's kinda like one must do School Figures first and then Free Skate.
There is an Art to figure skating as their is an Art to Ski Jump. I would add don't be overwhelmed with 'artistry'. Young people must learn their craft before artistry comes into view. The only artistry I've seen thus far at the Olympics is in Ice Dance. Virtue and Moir are Artists.
02-25-2010, 09:30 AM
I don't think most of the criticism has been about Evan not having courage. I think it's been more that the current judging system doesn't encourage taking the risk of doing a quad or whatever else is high risk and advancing the sport. Elvis appears to grudgingly acknowledge that Evan won under the current rules. I believe he's hoping that the rules will change with respect to the results in these Olympics because, as he states, the guy who played it safe won where the guy who took a risk and succeeded didn't.
02-25-2010, 09:45 AM
Elvis does seem very bitter to me. I guess from now on, all male skaters must do a quad and all ladies skaters must do a 3A and risk irreversible injuries on one element just to make Elvis Stojko happy That makes perfect sense! Evan did not have the quad, but he and his cheorographers worked the system to his advantage. It's not like Plushenko's quad was perfect either, that landing was very shaky. Plushenko's performance in the fs was not worthy of an Olympic gold medal--quad or not.
Last edited by SweetPea21307; 02-25-2010 at 09:56 AM.
02-25-2010, 09:57 AM
leave no stone unturned
isnt this the same article posted one week before?Or it is Volume II?
In any case what i dont get is why they didnt have the title
"The Night They Killed Seniorita."
02-25-2010, 10:10 AM
Yes, it is the same article which has already had a thread. I am very tired of debating on whether quad is undervalued or not. Rather, I am waiting for the real action of raising the quad values by ISU. I think the quad has to be emphasized more than it has already.
Look at the Ladies' skating! Yu Na Kim and Mao Asada are practically on the same technical level with this "Olympic Men's Champion". Isn't it a joke or what?!
And again, good for Stojko to speak out! Though I have different views from his in the ladies skating. Ladies should skate like ladies, period!
Last edited by jennylovskt; 02-25-2010 at 02:52 PM.
02-25-2010, 10:42 AM
Well, everybody that knows me knows my view on this, as I love *sport* & I love jumps!
And if figure skating wants to be recognized as a real sport it has to continue to progress with the jumps. Fact. Otherwise, remove it from the Olympics, as well as any other legitimate sporting event. Period. Put on shows like they do with the Ice Theatre of New York, or Dancing With The Stars, Disney On Ice, Stars on Ice, Cirque du Soleil. It has no business in the Olympics, or any other judged sport.
And as far as quads for men & triple axels for women go, yes, they must be MORE in points than any other element out there, be it a 3/3 combo. or sequence or a triple after the half way mark, et al. Since the quad is the hardest element for the men, then its value must be the most by far, and the same goes for the women with the triple axel!
As I stated in another thread about the quad, I would like to see a consortium of quadsters come together whom quad with regularity & consistency (e.g. Elvis Stojko, Timothy Goebel, Alexei Yagudin, Evgeni Plushenko, Stephane Lambiel, Brian Joubert) and state their case before a panel of ISU & COP judges/dignitaries/etc. to explain in detail how hard the quad is to master & perform correctly for the men, thus its point value must reflect this to the point its value exceeds anything out there, especially when in combination like a 4/3.
And for the women the 3A is even rarer, and I would like those women whom 3Axeled with somewhat consistency to come together (same as the men) & state their case in detail before the same panel as explained up above. Lol, in this case, the only women that could show up in all honesty would be Tonya Harding, Midori Ito, and Mao Asada. That's it, three, thus reflecting its extreme difficulty (3.5 revolutions; almost 4). It should be way more in points than any 3/3 combo., sequence, triple after the half way mark, etc.
I'm done. I hope this truly comes about somehow, someway. One can only hope...
02-25-2010, 10:49 AM