Questions raised over ice dance judging panel | Page 2 | Golden Skate

Questions raised over ice dance judging panel

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
MSNBC just reported this issue... so you can bet it's going to be brought up by Tom Hammond and Bob Costas at some point tonight :sheesh: :no:

nevermind the Russian athletes work just as hard and are just as good as the others, it's the country that counts.

See, here's the thing. MSNBC/The Globe and Mail have really just pre-emptively struck when they need to wait. They're gonna presume unfairness right off the bat and when it could go either way, we're gonna assume chicanery. Of course, when you have people at Golden Skate suggesting that Lysacek won so the ISU could have easier access to USA coiffers, I suppose it's hard to get riled about anything.
 

KKonas

Medalist
Joined
Oct 31, 2009

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
it's the whole "crying before your hurt"

however, if they don't say something before hand about the judges being such and such then it looks like they're whining because they lost... it's a lose lose situation in any case...

it's a way for the media to continue the whole drama element... no Russian pairs on the podium - the end of a dynasty and upset (no, it's not an upset, Russia just didn't have a podium worthy team this season, teh cycle has finally come full circle)... Evan pulls an upset with Evgeny - shocking when it was just all about Russia getting gold again (nevermind Evgeni was just a fantastic competitor... instead of making it USA v Russia it should have been about two men who are great COMPETITORS, not great artists or skaters edge wise)... now it's ice dance and we ALL know those cheating Russians have ALWAYS cheated in this event... :sheesh: it's just how it's always been here so most don't see it as wrong, or disagree...

it's poor journalism, but I don't think our media has done much JOURNALISM as they do TABLOID. Tabloids sell more.
 

watchvancouver

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
it's a way for the media to continue the whole drama element... no Russian pairs on the podium .

No Russian pairs on the podium does not mean Russian mafia did not try. The suddent ascendancy of K&S in their PCS on par with S&Z and S&S is a joke. S&S could have beaten any pair by a mille in previous years no matter how horribly they skated. They were in shock by losing to K&S despite skating decently at Euros.

If K&S only made minor mistakes instead of collapse in the LP at Olys, they would have definitely beat P&T no matter how wonderfully they would have skated.

K&S are an absolute hot mess. Maybe judges are hypnotised by Moskvina's magic wands?
 

watchvancouver

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
Don't know who "Aunt Joyce" is but seems like just a bunch of nonsense - rumors and gosssip only. I've known Frank for 30 years, if he was so powerful politicallly Kwan would have two Olympic gold medals.

Well, Aunt Joyce divulged Sasha would withdraw from SA long based on inside information before the official announcement.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
I don't believe there is any case for conspiracy, but from what the article assumes is that there is a gathering of the Russo clan from where ever they are who will vote in unisome. You have to believe if any of the 'Stans' are on the panel they will not be muslims but former Russians or their families sent to a stan for the service of the USSR. How much other States, e,g, Hungary, are still beholding to the USSR and therefore Russia is moot. There is no denying that the North Americans are not held in esteem in other countries. And for that reason, I do not believe V/M, D/W, and B/A have a chance for gold. It will be Russia's one chance for gold. The North Americans will get silver and bronze as a token of fairness.

I was hoping someone would answer Realtor Girl's question, on how the selection of judges are made for each phase of the contest. I would also like someone to confirm, if a judge has been found guilty of cheating, that they can continue to judge.

Anyone?
 

watchvancouver

Match Penalty
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
I How much other States, e,g, Hungary, are still beholding to the USSR and therefore Russia is moot.

Many former U.S.S.R apologists are making the case that those countries are actually hostile to Russia in terms of geopolitics. I think this is very misleading and disingenous. Geopolitics plays very little role in how they'd bloc vote in figure skating events. It's more a cultural kinship that bonds them together. Many of these former satellite countries still believe Russia is superior, and they're just so accustomed to their former 'master' in terms of cultural influence. They genuiely believe figure skaters from countries other than Russia are always inferior.
 

Cadiva

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 4, 2006
I don't believe there is any case for conspiracy, but from what the article assumes is that there is a gathering of the Russo clan from where ever they are who will vote in unisome. You have to believe if any of the 'Stans' are on the panel they will not be muslims but former Russians or their families sent to a stan for the service of the USSR. How much other States, e,g, Hungary, are still beholding to the USSR and therefore Russia is moot. There is no denying that the North Americans are not held in esteem in other countries. And for that reason, I do not believe V/M, D/W, and B/A have a chance for gold. It will be Russia's one chance for gold. The North Americans will get silver and bronze as a token of fairness.

I was hoping someone would answer Realtor Girl's question, on how the selection of judges are made for each phase of the contest. I would also like someone to confirm, if a judge has been found guilty of cheating, that they can continue to judge.

Anyone?

No-one's been found guilty of cheating that's sat on the panel so unsure as to the point of this question? One of the judges' on the panel has had a poor assessment over the level of her English as far as I am aware not being punished for cheating. The only judge alleged to have cheated was banned after the 2002 Olympics.

As an aside, I'm assuming all those claiming that the judging panel tonight wouldn't be marking fairly are now eating their words given the results of tonight's Original Dance ;)

Many former U.S.S.R apologists are making the case that those countries are actually hostile to Russia in terms of geopolitics. I think this is very misleading and disingenous. Geopolitics plays very little role in how they'd bloc vote in figure skating events. It's more a cultural kinship that bonds them together. Many of these former satellite countries still believe Russia is superior, and they're just so accustomed to their former 'master' in terms of cultural influence. They genuiely believe figure skaters from countries other than Russia are always inferior.

And how, exactly, do you know this? Are you a politican expert based in Europe and regularly visiting these former USSR countries? Certainly from my bit of Europe there is a vast amount of resentment, even to the extent of hatred, from a lot of former Soviet state countries which are now independent.
It's yet another Cold War myth that they'll all run around after "Mother Russia". A lot of those countries are far more akin to their Middle Eastern relatives than they are to the Russian state (any of the 'Stans for example) and many of the Mediterranean bordering former USSR countries have an affinity with the European Union.

The newspaper article in question is grandstanding, pure and simple, and as I said, it's highly unlikely to have ever been published in the UK under our newspaper Code of Practice for factual reporting.

On a side note, can I just say that an unnamed European skating expert that I know pointed out that there was absolutely no evidence whatsoever to say that any of the people involved in the OD judging were favouring Russia.

See, I can make the same disingenuous statement too without actually having to provide any proof to back it up.
 
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Alatariel

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 15, 2010
The fact is that some people will only be pleased ^^ if there are no Russians anywhere in sight, and that has nothing to do with the skaters but with the ebil Ruskies idiocy that has been around for a very long time now.
 

oxade21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 24, 2004
So where are people who claimed this judging panel will favor Russians? LOL and we still not happy.
Anyone who thinks that V/M are going to lose this is delusional. This result is fixed.
 

Nadine

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 3, 2003
Yep, as I said from the beginning, the Canadians got it locked in the bag, so no need to cry or insinuate about the evil Russians, et al. They'll get their gold medal & hopefully shut up. But I know that's asking way too much (flashes back to 2002 Olympics).

It's not enough that the Russians were off the podium in pairs, nor didn't win in mens, but now the North American media & fans will not be satisfied until all the Russians are completely gone or finish last.
 

Nadine

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 3, 2003
ps: and the truly funny thing is I don't give a **** about dance at all. :laugh: Seriously, I wish it would go away, it's not a sport. And it doesn't hold a candle to real ballroom dancing, if that's what it's trying to emulate.
 
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chuckm

Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 31, 2003
Country
United-States
Yep, as I said from the beginning, the Canadians got it locked in the bag, so no need to cry or insinuate about the evil Russians, et al. They'll get their gold medal & hopefully shut up. But I know that's asking way too much (flashes back to 2002 Olympics).

It's not enough that the Russians were off the podium in pairs, nor didn't win in mens, but now the North American media & fans will not be satisfied until all the Russians are completely gone or finish last.

No one would complain about DomShabs' scoring if they skated well and deserved their scores. But their OD was not well skated in comparison even to DelShoes, yet they received only a point and a half less than Davis/White, who skated lights out.

DomShabs were incredibly slow and they were on two feet most of the time, and far apart. I realize that is because Shabalin is unable to skate any other way, but that shouldn't give them a free pass to the podium. If a team from another country had skated the way DomShabs did, they'd be no higher than 6th or 7th place, certainly not 3rd.

The FD panel is fairer than the OD and CD panels: AZE FRA GBR GER HUN ISR ITA JPN UKR. Let's hope for scoring that is commensurate with the performances.
 
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oxade21

Match Penalty
Joined
Mar 24, 2004
ps: and the truly funny thing is I don't give a **** about dance at all. :laugh: Seriously, I wish it would go away, it's not a sport. And it doesn't hold a candle to real ballroom dancing, if that's what it's trying to emulate.

Couldn't agree more. This discipline is a big dirty stain on this sport and drags it down. I hope for another scandal so it gets kicked out already.
 
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Sk8n Mama

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
Anyone who thinks that V/M are going to lose this is delusional. This result is fixed.

Yep, as I said from the beginning, the Canadians got it locked in the bag, so no need to cry or insinuate about the evil Russians, et al. They'll get their gold medal & hopefully shut up. But I know that's asking way too much (flashes back to 2002 Olympics).

There's always one or two party poopers, isn't there?
 

Nadine

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 3, 2003
Well, chuck, thanks for the clarification because in all honesty I haven't watched dance nor do I intend to, and that's the truth. What little pleasure I got from watching it the last year or two at US Nationals has gone. I loved Samuelson & Bates and a few other couples, but now I don't care, I no longer seek to watch them or any dance couple, especially after what happened at 2009 Worlds. That killed whatever joy I got from it, as well as this past season. I didn't watch dance at US Nationals nor here at the Olympics, nor do I intend to. The only disciplines I have watched thus far are mens, that's it, no dance nor pairs, but I'm hoping to watch ladies, though it takes second place to mens IMHO.

Congrats to whomever wins the medals, et al. I apologize if I have offended any dance fans, that wasn't my intention. :)
 
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