Last edited by Mathman; 02-25-2010 at 06:11 PM.
Elvis Stojko needs to get his head out of his butt, and return back from the Stone Age. All of these "arguments" that he throws out are all just for controversial attention. The result isn't even that close. Kim is nearly 5 points ahead, and if you look at the protocols, technically, their base marks were essentially identical with the except of 3a/2t = 9.5 base marks for Asada and 3z/3t = 10.0 base marks for Kim.
I fully agree with the low GOE for Asada's 3a/2t mostly because the exit out of it was SLOW and the 2t afterward was tiny and ALSO slow. Kim's 3z/3t was FAR superior as far as quality, and if we're going to get into the debate about difficulty. Yes, the 3a is MORE difficult, BUT think about the SECOND half of that combo, you're comparing a whole extra rotation that Kim does. Scott Hamilton made a good point in the SP commentary that a 3a/2t = 5.5 revolutions while a 3z/3t = 6 revolutions. On top of that, Kim opened the combo with the 2nd hardest triple possible, it's not like she was doing a 3s/3t or a 3t/3t.
Everyone needs to read the rules. The problem someone brought up was with the rules, not reading and comprehending the rules.
New to the forum, so if I make any stupid comments or offend anyone, apologies!
I can only catch up by watching what is posted on the internet - mainly European channels - as I live in the UK. Commentaries have been interesting; one of the UK eurosport boys (Chris/Simon) thought he slightly preferred Yuna to Mao & the other (Simon/Chris) thought Yuna was better by a fairly significant margin (didn't say by how many points); the French eurosport thought Yuna was better but by 3 points rather than 5; the Germans said, before Yuna's score came out, she would be ahead by about 5 points (...freaky).
As a complete layman who has been an avid figure skating fan for over 30 years, I find both ladies awsome but in VERY different ways. In my very personal and non-professional opinion, the difference between the two ladies' programmes, certainly for THIS season, is a bit like how a signature dish of an amazing chef comes together. I thought most of Mao's individual components in extreme snapshots (eg. from the moment the blade leaves the ice and lands back on), were superb, like the best ingredients one could find. Some of Yuna's were even better, some equally good and others less so. However, I felt that there was a difference worth 5 points in the way they were executed (cooked) and presented (placed in front of you - voila!) as a PROGRAMME lasting 2 mins 50 secs. I think that reflects the coaches and choreographers behind the programmes rather than the abilities of the two skaters. Even if the scoring system were to be altered by a point or so here and there, I'm not sure it would make that much difference for these particular programmes. Despite all this debate and opinions, including mine, if either makes mistakes tonight, she will lose, though.
I really hope ALL the ladies put up a fantastic event tonight, and really really hope no-one puts up NASTY (eg. "I hope so-and-so bombs tonight", "I'm so glad so-and-so fell") comments here!
One thing I would argue with the jumping protocols for CoP is that they shouldn't necessarily be the same for every discipline. The 3A is the easiest example: you can't be a top mens competitor if you don't have a 3A (unless you have a quad to make up for it), whereas very few ladies can actually do it, and only one pairs team has landed a (throw) 3A in competition. CoP reflects degree of difficulty... the harder the jump, the more points it's worth. CoP would be more accurate if the actual point value of the elements (in this case jumps, since this is really what this discussion is about) reflected the degree of difficult for a specific discipline (ladies, mens, pairs). A jump like a 3A should be worth more in ladies and pairs than it is in mens... perhaps even the 3F and 3Lz should be boosted a bit in ladies as well, since relatively few ladies skaters have both the 3Lz and 3F mastered (and consistently landed) correctly.
Why do they need to be scaled by discipline? They are still the same movements - it's a matter of getting them in the right order of difficulty and alotting the appropriate base points. I would agree if the competiton was amongst all discplines - a handicap to level the playing field since there are limitations due to gender and 2 vs 1 person performing.