When will Mao Be Joyful Again?

bethissoawesome · Feb 26, 2010

pshla said:
Mao just seems really different under TaT compared to before, and I'm not really sure I like the difference. I think TaT could be capable of being encouraging and inspiring. Isn't that why Yagudin loves her so much? I just don't think she really understands Mao. It's important to have a coach who "gets" you - your weaknesses, strengths, goals and fears. I don't think TaT can do that for Mao.

I know Mao did have an agrument with TaT this season over the 3A... TaT wanted to take it out, but as her coach, she really should have seen how important that one jump is to Mao. Mao cried in an interview over the possibility of not being able to show her fans that she can still do the jump.

theresa said:
At the beginning of the season, I didnt think tht the whole match-up of Mao and TAT was working out, but ever since yesterday I have started to think differently. Although I am not against the notion of getting back Artunian as her coach, Mao has really grew and matured under TAT. Mao is skating to more expressive music, has strengthened her stamina, and has developed more consistency with her 3A. If Mao can put all her skills together and gain back tht 3-3 combo, Mao will not have to worry about being joyful again.

I think Mao's main concern was losing her 3A and/or not being able to show her fans that she could still do it. Now that she has done that, the door is open for her to show that she can do other things as well. She's competed with two 3-3 combinations in her program before, and her stamina and athleticism seem higher now than a year ago... and with Yu-Na winning with her 3Lz+3T, I don't think Mao will settle for not having a 3-3 in her program as well. My guess would be that this season, she will work on putting the 3Lz back into her program and either 3F+3T or 3F+3Lo back in as well. I could imagine Mao having a jump layout something like...

3A
3A+2T
3Lz
3F+2Lo+2Lo
3Lo
3F+3Lo
3T or 2A

yunasashafan · Feb 26, 2010

theresa said:
At the beginning of the season, I didnt think tht the whole match-up of Mao and TAT was working out, but ever since yesterday I have started to think differently. Although I am not against the notion of getting back Artunian as her coach, Mao has really grew and matured under TAT. Mao is skating to more expressive music, has strengthened her stamina, and has developed more consistency with her 3A. If Mao can put all her skills together and gain back tht 3-3 combo, Mao will not have to worry about being joyful again.

I would give credit for those accomplishments to Mao herself, not to Tatiana. I don't think Tatiana did anything beyond what a choreographer typically does with a skater. My hat's off to Mao for sticking with her plan and making it work.

BlackAxel · Feb 26, 2010

yunasashafan said:
I would give credit for those accomplishments to Mao herself, not to Tatiana. I don't think Tatiana did anything beyond what a choreographer typically does with a skater. My hat's off to Mao for sticking with her plan and making it work.

Actually, I disagree with that. Compare the programs that TAT has choreographed to the ones that Lori Nichols has created for Mao, there is a big difference. With TAT as a choreographer and coach, she has been skating to mature music and has impoved upon her footwork and stamina. The only plan that Mao was insistent upon sticking with was her 3A, as mentioned by the previous poster.

Spun Silver · Feb 26, 2010

bethissoawesome said:
I could imagine Mao having a jump layout something like...

3A
3A+2T
3Lz
3F+2Lo+2Lo
3Lo
3F+3Lo
3T or 2A

Yes, and her music could be La Valse - you know, where the young girl dances herself to death! Jeez.

J/K... or maybe not.

yunasashafan · Feb 26, 2010

theresa said:
Actually, I disagree with that. Compare the programs that TAT has choreographed to the ones that Lori Nichols has created for Mao, there is a big difference. With TAT as a choreographer and coach, she has been skating to mature music and has impoved upon her footwork and stamina. The only plan that Mao was insistent upon sticking with was her 3A, as mentioned by the previous poster.

Hence what I meant by Tatiana being more a choreographer than a coach. The choreographer is the one responsilble for the design of the footwork. And once that was decided, Mao put in the work required to increase her stamina to match it. I am sorry, I just don't understand how Tatiana is coaching Mao long distance. If anyone should get coaching credit, it's Folle, not Tat. But I still think that's minimal.

kyla2 · Feb 26, 2010

Some of you are not very "warm and fuzzy" i.e. "if you don't like the heat get out of the kitchen." Geesh. Take your Prozac and show some compassion.

For the Japanese, losing the gold to the South Koreans is just losing. Of course, I totally disagree and personally, I loved what Mao did on the ice MORE than Yu Na. Her silver medal is something to be very proud of, but she will have to discover that for herself. I believe this will motivate Mao to do even better. Her triple axels were things of beauty and a major highlight for me. They are undervalued imo. But that is a discussion for another day.

I hope Mao realizes how much we love her skating. It is brilliant and she needs to recognize that and build on it.

Bennett · Feb 26, 2010

millie said:
There is a familiar quote that can appy to this post "If you can't stand the heat you should get out of the kitchen". Same goes for Mao. If she can't take the competitions and the concept of losing to the other competitors, she should retire and go on with something that will make her happier than she is now. Until then, she is going to wait like the other skater, for Yu-na to retire.

The next day, she says that she is very happy to land three 3As and get the silver and wants to show the medal to people when she goes home, first to her mom

She had a very refreshing smile. Quite a good recovery.

Bennett · Feb 26, 2010

iluvtodd said:
I hope the Japanese Federation will not treat her Olympic silver medal as a failure. Winning silver is a great accomplishment. I can't forget how Midori Ito felt like she had to apologize to the Japanese people for winning silver in 1992. I am so proud of Mao and how she skated at these Olympics (and that she won Japanese nationals).

I don't think so. Midori was the favorite to win. But Mao struggled throughout the season and people even doubted if she could make the Olympic team. It was a great accomplishment to get out of the slump without the coach and get the Silver.
I really hope that she leaves TAT. It was the first time for them to meet up at the Olys since CoR which was many months ago.

visaliakid · Feb 26, 2010

Dee4707 said:
Why does Mao have to leave Tat???

Because Tat is nothing but "dark, dark, dark in her music choices"! How the hell can any skater exhibit joy in their skating when your team has you skating to this dark, overpowering music. IMHO, Get her the hell away from Tarasova and to someone who can infuse her skating with joyful music.

Tinymavy15 · Feb 27, 2010

visaliakid said:
Because Tat is nothing but "dark, dark, dark in her music choices"! How the hell can any skater exhibit joy in their skating when your team has you skating to this dark, overpowering music. IMHO, Get her the hell away from Tarasova and to someone who can infuse her skating with joyful music.

and ugly costumes. Usually skaters become artists under Tat, but not Mao, her artistry is much worse than it was before.

miki88 · Feb 27, 2010

Tinymavy15 said:
and ugly costumes. Usually skaters become artists under Tat, but not Mao, her artistry is much worse than it was before.

I don't think so. I think Mao has improved a lot in her expressions and actually feeling the music. In the past, she always had a serious expression throughout her programs. But she's more passionate now. However, the programs themselves are not as pleasing as those piano pieces in the past. It's just a different type of music and perhaps it's not as suited for Mao. I don't think it's true that Mao has not made any improvements in recent years. She has improved in her spins and spirals, holding them longer to achieve higher levels. She has also improved in her footwork sequences. The one area that she hasn't been struggling is in her jumping technique which may have overshadowed the improvements she did made. But that doesn't mean she didn't improve.

rtureck · Feb 27, 2010

bethissoawesome said:
I know Mao did have an agrument with TaT this season over the 3A... TaT wanted to take it out, but as her coach, she really should have seen how important that one jump is to Mao. Mao cried in an interview over the possibility of not being able to show her fans that she can still do the jump.

I think her fans love her not for the triple axel maybe not even that much for her jumping abilities, many of them love her for her etheral style and her pure joy skating

I think Mao's main concern was losing her 3A and/or not being able to show her fans that she could still do it. Now that she has done that, the door is open for her to show that she can do other things as well. She's competed with two 3-3 combinations in her program before, and her stamina and athleticism seem higher now than a year ago... and with Yu-Na winning with her 3Lz+3T, I don't think Mao will settle for not having a 3-3 in her program as well. My guess would be that this season, she will work on putting the 3Lz back into her program and either 3F+3T or 3F+3Lo back in as well. I could imagine Mao having a jump layout something like...

3A
3A+2T
3Lz
3F+2Lo+2Lo
3Lo
3F+3Lo
3T or 2A

WOW that is a very ambitious jump layout. I think she needs to fix her lutz (flutz). I am noit sure about 3f/3l, since she was downgraded on the 3l in the past, but she has ratified 3f/3t. I prefer she put the 3t as a combo with 3f, and I am sure she will keep the 2a. I still don't understand why she does not do a triple sal

tralfamadorian · Feb 27, 2010

miki88 - ITA about your points about Mao's artistry. I don't think her programs were "too dark" or that she lost because of this. Actually, in the beginning of the season I felt these programs were maybe too much for her, but by Olympics, she "grew into" them for me. (And afaik it's Mao herself who wanted to go in this direction, it was not forced on her.)

You had two brilliant ladies here, and either one of them would have deserved to win, but alas, only one can be in first place, so one of them had to lose and it was going to be a huge disappointment for one of them. I think if the situation was reveresed Yuna would be just as disappointed, it's completely normal. Imagine working a whole year (and the rest of your life basically) only for those four minutes and then missing your goal by just that little bit.

Plus add to this that they come from a very different culture. I don't know about South Korea but in Japan meeting expectations and success/failure is viewed a matter of honour/duty, they relate very differently to these things in that culture. I think Mao might feel that she let the Japanese people (and herself) down by not giving a perfect peformance and that's why she (or in the past Midori Ito) apologize for their "failure". Not that I think anyone actually will think of Mao as a failure, because she's obviously not, but still, this is part of their culture.

Both of these girls were under enormous pressure because of the very high expectations put on them. (So please, whoever thinks Mao can't t take the heat, please think again, both of these girls were taking so much heat it's almost a miracle they held up as well as they did)

Hope Mao feels better by now, my heart was breaking for her when I saw her interview.

Nadine · Feb 27, 2010

I must say, regards the title of this thread, what an obtuse question & a leading one. *wink*

Nadine · Feb 27, 2010

Addendum:

What I find interesting is the re-writing of history in regards to Mao's free skate -- Mao *did not* skate her best (thus the tears in her interview afterwards) -- yet so many boards seem to be claiming she did, somehow justifying iin their minds that the womens final was one for the ages.

I disagree, and not only in regards to Mao, as Joannie was tight & had several little mishaps here & there, as well Miki Ando didn't skate her best either. Yes, all three stood up on their jumps, but it wasn't their best. The only ones that really skated their best was Miriai Nagasu & Yuna Kim, and I guess Rachael Flatt.

So back to Mao, thus her tears in her interview afterwards, wherein she stated "she did what she was capable of", but "it wasn't her best". Personally, I think her best was at 2009 WTT where she landed both of her triple axels & everything else in her program, and also the 2008 GPF wherein she made history by landing both of her triple axels in the FS for the first time ever! In comparison, her 2010 Olympic FS doesn't even come close. Thus, I understand her disappointment, and hope she skates clean (including both her triple axels & the rest of her triples) at 2010 Worlds without stumbles/mishaps/stepouts/pops/singles/et al.

Bennett · Feb 27, 2010

Nadine said:
Addendum:

What I find interesting is the re-writing of history in regards to Mao's free skate -- Mao *did not* skate her best (thus the tears in her interview afterwards) -- yet so many boards seem to be claiming she did, somehow justifying iin their minds that the womens final was one for the ages.

I disagree, and not only in regards to Mao, as Joannie was tight & had several little mishaps here & there, as well Miki Ando didn't skate her best either. Yes, all three stood up on their jumps, but it wasn't their best. The only ones that really skated their best was Miriai Nagasu & Yuna Kim, and I guess Rachael Flatt.

So back to Mao, thus her tears in her interview afterwards, wherein she stated "she did what she was capable of", but "it wasn't her best". Personally, I think her best was at 2009 WTT where she landed both of her triple axels & everything else in her program, and also the 2008 GPF wherein she made history by landing both of her triple axels in the FS for the first time ever! In comparison, her 2010 Olympic FS doesn't even come close. Thus, I understand her disappointment, and hope she skates clean (including both her triple axels & the rest of her triples) at 2010 Worlds without stumbles/mishaps/stepouts/pops/singles/et al.

Yeah, she made it clear that she's disappointed in her performance. The flip has been giving her some trouble so that it might not have been unexpected. Yet, the edge trouble with 3T disrupted the flow. If she went on jumping and fell, it may have felt better even though she may have lost more points by getting minus one. I wonder if she meant she prepared everything as much as she could (and made mistakes on something that she could have done better), rather than she delivered everything that she could.

hellcat · Feb 27, 2010

She needs to fix her flutz, UR for loop and get her salchow back.

That's the only way to be a true perfectionist. W/o fixing those 3, adding more 3As will be padding the missing triples.

She used to have beautiful salchows and I don't know what happened to it.

☆Genie · Feb 27, 2010

hellcat said:
She needs to fix her flutz, UR for loop and get her salchow back.

That's the only way to be a true perfectionist. W/o fixing those 3, adding more 3As will be padding the missing triples.

She used to have beautiful salchows and I don't know what happened to it.

She never was consistent with the salchow. Its like YuNa and the loop.

miki88 · Feb 27, 2010

Mao has tried the salchow a couple of times though in competition. Maybe she doesn't like it that much, but I think her record with that jump is not too bad. Her loop is her most consistent jump IMAO. It's only when she does it in a combo, that she tends to get UR. But her loop by itself is pretty consistent.

When will Mao Be Joyful Again?

bethissoawesome

yunasashafan

BlackAxel

Spun Silver

yunasashafan

kyla2

Bennett

Bennett

visaliakid

Tinymavy15

Sinnerman for the win

miki88

rtureck

tralfamadorian

Nadine

Nadine

Bennett

hellcat

☆Genie

miki88

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