Pairs Long Program

[aftertherain]

2010 worlds pairs lp small medal award ceremony.avi
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BrLtzNgI3g

[mousepotato]

My first post, please be gentle...

With that being said, I'm not sure why there is so much hate for K/S. It's one thing to not like a style or a certain program, but to dismiss and entire long program because of two falls is not the reality in judging and certainly not fair. They have so much difficulty on that program the base score is 60 vs. 56 and 55 for S/S and M/T.

The reason K/S are ranked #1 in Russia is because they are better than M/T. Out of over 15 competitions where they competed against each other M/T have only beat K/S twice. GPF 2009 where M/T were 4th and K/S 5th and Euros in 2008 when M/T were silver and K/S got bronze. K/S have their issues...I hate every time she crashes into him on the split twist (she is going to dislocate HIS shoulder!) but I like the athleticism they have, he is strong and she is flexible. I appreciate the fact that they tried the quad knowing she might fall and they both seemed to shake off the mistakes and skate clean the rest of the program. Unlike the Olympics where it effected them the whole time. They seem to have a dedication M/T don't have. Especially judging by the interviews they both give.

I saw them skate at Euros this year and the biggest difference between K/S and S/S is the speed and coverage over the ice. K/S were so fast and covered so much ice it was like watching a tennis match but S/S were slow like they were skating in mud. They were elegant and beautiful but watching them was like watching an ice show not a competition. I think both Russian pairs will improve but I think S/S have done as much as they can unless they step it up.

As for M/T, my Russian is really poor but from what I can gather, he seems like a real jerk. My heart went out to him after the short program at the Olympics, his reaction was heartbreaking. But he seems to be his own worst enemy. If he wants to be #1 in Russia he needs to work, not talk. If it's his partner...change partners, if it's the coach...get rid of him. If he wants it bad enough, he should make the changes. It's not fair to Maria or his next partner should they break up. I hope they stay together I don't think Tatiana is any better than Maria. IMO I don't think Tatiana is that great. If they pair up they will still be around 4th place. I don't see them getting good enough for gold.

At any rate I think they all need long vacations.

[watchvancouver]

I saw them skate at Euros this year and the biggest difference between K/S and S/S is the speed and coverage over the ice. K/S were so fast and covered so much ice it was like watching a tennis match but S/S were slow like they were skating in mud. .

K/S are faster than S/S and have better ice coverage? Gosh, everybody seems to have his/her own stop watch. I guess if K/S stayed on moon, they would definitely skate faster than S/S on earth.

[FlattFan]

K/S are faster than S/S and have better ice coverage? Gosh, everybody seems to have his/her own stop watch. I guess if K/S stayed on moon, they would definitely skate faster than S/S on earth.

Did you not watch the programs? S/S were so slow in both programs. Didn't need a stop watch to see that.

[herios]

My first post, please be gentle...

With that being said, I'm not sure why there is so much hate for K/S. It's one thing to not like a style or a certain program, but to dismiss and entire long program because of two falls is not the reality in judging and certainly not fair. They have so much difficulty on that program the base score is 60 vs. 56 and 55 for S/S and M/T.

The reason K/S are ranked #1 in Russia is because they are better than M/T. Out of over 15 competitions where they competed against each other M/T have only beat K/S twice. GPF 2009 where M/T were 4th and K/S 5th and Euros in 2008 when M/T were silver and K/S got bronze. K/S have their issues...I hate every time she crashes into him on the split twist (she is going to dislocate HIS shoulder!) but I like the athleticism they have, he is strong and she is flexible. I appreciate the fact that they tried the quad knowing she might fall and they both seemed to shake off the mistakes and skate clean the rest of the program. Unlike the Olympics where it effected them the whole time. They seem to have a dedication M/T don't have. Especially judging by the interviews they both give.

I saw them skate at Euros this year and the biggest difference between K/S and S/S is the speed and coverage over the ice. K/S were so fast and covered so much ice it was like watching a tennis match but S/S were slow like they were skating in mud. They were elegant and beautiful but watching them was like watching an ice show not a competition. I think both Russian pairs will improve but I think S/S have done as much as they can unless they step it up.

As for M/T, my Russian is really poor but from what I can gather, he seems like a real jerk. My heart went out to him after the short program at the Olympics, his reaction was heartbreaking. But he seems to be his own worst enemy. If he wants to be #1 in Russia he needs to work, not talk. If it's his partner...change partners, if it's the coach...get rid of him. If he wants it bad enough, he should make the changes. It's not fair to Maria or his next partner should they break up. I hope they stay together I don't think Tatiana is any better than Maria. IMO I don't think Tatiana is that great. If they pair up they will still be around 4th place. I don't see them getting good enough for gold.

At any rate I think they all need long vacations.

OK, I will be very gentle

Could you explain to me, how K/S ended up defeating M/T in the SP by 2 points? I am sorry to say this but it looked to me an pre-arranged ranking between these two teams. M/T were absolutely flawless, while K / S were not. I personally prefer M // T long lines and shapes to K / S. but that is an opinion, however, I cannot accept glitches overloked with one team, which were not sever, but should have lowered the grade of execution of those elements, but the judges take the PCS weapon and re-arrange the ranking as they wish.

[FlattFan]

OK, I will be very gentle

Could you explain to me, how K/S ended up defeating M/T in the SP by 2 points? I am sorry to say this but it looked to me an pre-arranged ranking between these two teams. M/T were absolutely flawless, while K / S were not. I personally prefer M // T long lines and shapes to K / S. but that is an opinion, however, I cannot accept glitches overloked with one team, which were not sever, but should have lowered the grade of execution of those elements, but the judges take the PCS weapon and re-arrange the ranking as they wish.

M/T M twofooted the triple toe, then single toe on her combo.
T fell on one of the two throw.
Flawless?

[hikki]

As much as I thought Pang & Tong deserved Gold in Vancouver, I much preferred Savchenko & Szolkowy's performances here.What beautiful programs, what beautiful skaters. They blend CoP elements so effectively with the music while showing so much gentle emotion. Love them!

[mousepotato]

I hardly look at M/T SP as being flawless, I saw many small inconsistancies in lifts and spins that I didn't see in K/S. Not to mention the base value of each has to be taken into account. I do think their score were low and they should have easily been in front of S/S who skated a terrible SP. M/T footwork wasn't as nearly nice to watch as the top teams and if the difficulty is not there just skating around and looking elegant won't cut it.

If there was such blantant bias going on with the judges they would have had S/S in second and not third. I personally think they should have been fourth.

[CPWest]

Sorry about the double posting. Forgot to attach the quote. Totally agreed. Yes, P/T didn't repeat their OLY performance this time, which is a bit disappointing. But they never won because of "a strong federation" (this works better for K/S) or any favors. They fought so hard for so long to improve their standing in the judges' minds. S/S happened to do well on their long program this time, but they are not consistent skaters at all. That's why they always faltered whenever S/Z, the true dominant pair, is in the same competition.

Ｓｅｃｏｎｄ　ｔｈｉｓ！！　Ｉ　ａｍ　ｓｏ　ｔｈｒｉｌｌｅｄ　ｔｈａｔ　Ｐａｎｄ　ａｎｄ　Ｔｏｎｇ　 ｗｏｎ　ｔｈｅ　ｇｏｌｄ　ａｎｄ　ａｌｓｏ　ｇｅｔ　ｒｅｃｏｇｎｉｚｅｄ　ｂｙ　ｊｕｄｇｅｓ　ｔｈｒ ｏｕｇｈ　ｔｈｅｉｒ　ｃｏｎｓｉｓｔｅｎｔ　ｐｅｒｆｏｒｍａｎｃｅｓ　ｄｕｒｉｎｇ　ｔｈｅ　ｐａｓｔ 　ｓｅａｓｏｎ．　Ｔｈｅｙ　ｈａｖｅ　ｂｅｅｎ　ｕｎｄｅｒａｔｅｄ　ｆｏｒ　ｓｏ　ｌｏｎｇ　ａｎｄ　 ｉｆ　ｔｈｅｙ　ｄｉｄ　ｈａｖｅ　ａ　ｓｔｒｏｎｇ　ｆｅｄａｒaｔｉｏｎ　ｌｉｋｅ　Ｋ／ Ｓ　to ｂａｃｋ　ｔｈｅｍ　ｕｐ，　ｔｈｅｙ　ｗｏｕｌｄ　ｈａｖｅ　ｈａｄ　ａ　ｆｅｗ　ｇｏｌｄ　ａｌｒｅａ ｄｙ　ａｎｄ　ｅｖｅｎ　ｔｈｅ　ｏｎｅ　ｉｎ　Ｖａｎｃｏｕｖｅｒ．　Ｈｏｗ　ｏｆｔｅｎ　ｃａｎ　ｙｏ ｕ　ｒｅｍｅｍｂｅｒ　ｔｈａｔ　ＳＳ　ｗｏｕｌｄ　ｈａｖｅ　ａ　ｃｌｅａｎ　ｐｅｒｆｏｒｍａｎｃｅ? 　ｏｎｃｅ　ａ　ｓｅａｓｏｎ　ａｓ　ｉ　ｃａｎ　ｒｅｍｅｍｂｅｒ！！　ＰＴ＇ｓ　ｐｅｒｆｏｒｍａｎｃ ｅｓ　ｉｎ　Ｖａｎｃｏｕｖｅｒ　ｗａｓ　ａｎ　ａｌｌ　ｔｉｍｅ　ｈｉｇｈ　ａｎｄ　ｎｏｔ　ｔｏｏ　ｍ ａｎｙ　ｓｋａｔｅｒｓ　ｃａｎ　skate like that　ｅｖｅｎ　ｏｎｃｅ　ｉｎ　ａ　ｌｉｆｅ　ｔｉｍｅ．　Ｉ　totally understand that it might not come this time, i am just happy they performed the way they did and got the well-deserved gold medal.

[CPWest]

Congrats to Pang and Tong very happy for them. Aliona and Robin skated a great program too.
K/S made the podium they must be happy after placing 4th in Vancouver. I have to say
when their score came up I was very surprised. I thought the Zhangs were undermarked.

Yes, the Zhangs were undermarked right from the SP. They should do their Free Skate in the last group instead of SS. So anybody who complained that SS did not get a higher score in the free skate should remember that the judges already did them a favor to skate in the last group. Otherwise, their score will be probably lower for the same kind of performances.

[CPWest]

I'm upset that the Germans didn't win the free here. On what planet do Pang and Tong have better skating skills, better choregraphy and transitions than the Germans? I understand Pang and Tong winning this due to the short program. But they should not have gotten higher PCS than S/S here. Its pretty clear who has political favor and who does not. Poor S/S clearly they just don't have a powerful federation backing them.

Are you kidding me? Look at the score SS got for the free program in Vancouver!! it was the result of political favor. As many here already pointed out, Pang and Tong were the most underrated skaters in the past few seasons in pair skating. They fought hard and long and finally get the recognition they deserve. I am just glad that they stuck through such hard times.

[CPWest]

Pang and Tong...she doubled a jump and the side by side spins looked off to me. S and S should win in my opinion.

The same with SS in the long program, did u choose not to see that or not too say here?

[CPWest]

saw it coming from a mile, the judges set their minds for the podium already, I'm just glad s/s edged into 2nd

if you only want to mean that the judges wanted to give KS a gift, i agree. Pand and Tong earned their gold medal.