Major Changes Expected in Single Skating in 2010-2011 | Golden Skate

Major Changes Expected in Single Skating in 2010-2011

wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
This is just in this morning, I am still in shock re: a number of changes that are being proposed. There are so many changes, even I haven't been able to digest all of it. But I thought some of you would be extremely interested to know a few major ones that are coming up, especially if you are a Mao or Yu Na fan.

- Ladies will now be allowed to do a Triple Axel in lieu of a Double Axel in the SHORT PROGRAM

I certainly didn't see this coming, as do many other observers.

In addition, the SP will now consist of 7 required elements, as opposed to 8. Men will be doing only 1 step sequence instead of two. Spiral Sequence will now be removed as a required element for ladies in the SP but will be considered as part of transitions if executed. This change will presumably increase the weight of jumps overall, favoring someone like Brian Joubert for example whose relative poor step sequences hold him back against Chan or Takahashi.

Separate proposal is being made to give a 10% bonus base value for jumps done in a jump combination. For example, Triple Lutz + Triple Toe has a Base Value of 6 + 4 = 10. Under the new proposal, it will now receive a 10% bonus for a total base value of 11, prior to the application of GOE.

Another big change is that men will now be allowed to try two different types of Quads in the SP. Previously, if a skater did, say a Quad Salchow + Triple Toe as a jump combo, he will not be able to do another Quad as a solo jump, even if that Quad is not a Salchow. The proposed change will now allow the said skater to do another Quad as a solo jump provided that it is a different type of Quad. This change will likely push men who are able and willing to include two Quads in the SP. Such change will greatly favor men like Kevin Reynolds who consistently lands two different types of Quads, he will be delighted by this kind of change. But I expect more men will now try to do another Quad other than the Toe Loop as well, this is potentially huge for men.

- No change to the number of elements performed or maximum allowed in the Free Skate but the second Step Sequence for Men will now receive a fixed base value ( :think: ), same goes for the Spiral Sequence in the Free Skate for Ladies

- Spiral Sequence (Ladies) in the FS will now have an All or Nothing clause if the requirement is not fully met

This can be potentially be quite serious and scary IMO because it used to be you will still get some points even if the element is downgraded, but someone like Mirai Nagasu who has had trouble meeting all the requirements in her Spiral could see that element be given a zero for instance.

- Double Axel can only be performed a maximum of two times in the Free Skate, as opposed to three

This last change will hurt someone like Yu-Na Kim the most, who heavily relies on three Double Axels to compensate for the lack of a Triple Loop.

- Moves in the field will now be given extra attention in order to reward transitions

Honestly, a vague clause like this will continued to be ignored in practice and someone like Plushenko will continue to receive outrageous transition marks inconsistent with his level of skating

There will also be a cap on the number of actual entries into the World Championships and all skaters must meet a minimum total score internationally in order to be eligible to enter into the Worlds by their federation. Qualifying Round for certain lower rank skaters will be re-introduced so that top skaters will not have to qualify like before.

There is a lot of changes, I am summarizing the major highlights to give you guys a heads up.
 

colleen o'neill

Medalist
Joined
Nov 3, 2006
:unsure: Urk! Some of this could be terrifying..no? Just on the face of it, wouldn't you think it will be fairly splat inducing ?
 

wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
:unsure: Urk! Some of this could be terrifying..no? Just on the face of it, wouldn't you think it will be fairly splat inducing ?

I am troubled by the Triple Axel in Ladies SP proposal. This move is inconsistent with the history of this sport. Such change is generally not introduced until the said skill becomes fairly standard among world level competitors. To me, this decision is driven by the need of $ and marketing where the sport is currently heavily dependent on Asia for its revenue, at the expense of many other considerations, including the well-being of skaters.
 

skatemom1122

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 22, 2009
I like all of the changes. 3A option as the axel jump will put Mao on par with Yu-na if she hits hit. Two quads in the short should be exciting and Reynolds will certainly benefit from this ! Most of all I like the third change. There were just two many entries this year at Worlds, half the skaters in first two groups could not even land a clean double axel. I'm sorry, but to be able to skate at worlds, one must be able to execute that jump. Unfortunately, it does hurt skaters like Clara Peters, who will likely only be able to skate Euros until she, or if she, develops triple jumps.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Thanks for the report Wally. It is alot to digest........

I wuz wondering - anything proposed about URs or other technical aspects of jumps?

ETA: Are the rule changes you listed such as the 3A just proposals - and not adopted yet?

Seems to me if that rule came to a vote alot of money would need to be flying around to get it passed.
With only one Lady currently attempting this jump it seems as you mentioned it's time has not come yet.
 
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jaylee

Medalist
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
wallylutz, thank you for your summary above. Some of these proposals are indeed shocking. Based on your experience, do you think the ones you listed above will all be passed? Is it pretty much a done deal?
 

SamuraiKike

Medalist
Joined
Jan 26, 2008
The new Short Dance is still as vague as ever...


I gotta digest all of this better, but right now I'll say I so hope the proposal for vocal music in Singles and Pairs gets aproved..
 

chloepoco

Medalist
Joined
Nov 1, 2009
Thanks for the report Wally. It is alot to digest........

I wuz wondering - anything proposed about URs or other technical aspects of jumps?

ETA: Are the rule changes you listed such as the 3A just proposals - and not adopted yet?

Seems to me if that rule came to a vote alot of money would need to be flying around to get it passed.
With only one Lady currently attempting this jump it seems as you mentioned it's time has not come yet.

So are you and Wallylutz implying that the Japanese federation are going to be bribing the ISU with money?
 

colleen o'neill

Medalist
Joined
Nov 3, 2006
Wallylutz - You're so right re: the 3A...fears for the skaters' well being was the first thing that came to my mind...but it hasn't been adopted yet, has it? I would imagine ..well, hope that this would meet stiff resistance.
 

Figure88

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 3, 2009
These are actual rule changes or just proposals? I thought the ISU meeting isn't until June to decide on new changes. If they are proposals, what's the chance of them being passed? It seems the brunt of the changes are targeted to square the score difference between Yuna and Mao. The 3a proposal doesn't really hurt Yuna very much because of the score cushion she has. It would, however, hurt Mao's close competitors like Joannie, whose scores usually very are close with Mao's. The maximimum 2a requirement will definitely hurt Yuna, as she rarely does a 3lp in competition. She excludes the jump, I believe, because it exacerbates her back injury.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
So are you and Wallylutz implying that the Japanese federation are going to be bribing the ISU with money?

Can't speak for janetfan or the Wallylutz, but I interpreted it as the money spent to lobby to the ISU. My guess is that the Japanese Fed. spent a ton of money in between meetings, research and other related things to get this rule passed. It may also include phone calls, letters to ISU decision makers. Long-distance calls are expensive!

Let's face asking for anything costs lots of money if you're going to convince people to support it and to vote for it. It's just like getting something passed in your national government.
 
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Trewyn

Medalist
Joined
Dec 10, 2008
I'm also confused. So these are just propositions? The new rules concerning spirals and steps are very vague; if they get passed, I'd like to get more in detail about what exactly the changes will be.
I'm not sure what the fuss about the 3A is... Yes it's clear that the Japanese fed is probably pushing for this since it really only concerns Mao Asada; but maybe it will inspire younger skaters to learn the jump? I don't know. The double axel is a pretty boring jump and I'd be interesting that the difficulty of SPs could be boosted. Same for the limit to 2As in the FS. Do more interesting jumps!

Otoh; the whole negativity surrounding COP about it being too demanding, too difficult, creating jumping beans might only get worse if rules like this get passed... So maybe I do have mixed feelings on the subject.
 

wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
These are actual rule changes or just proposals? I thought the ISU meeting isn't until June to decide on new changes.

These are ACTUAL TECHNICAL RULE CHANGES proposed by the Single & Pair Technical Committee, which is not the same as the proposals floated by individual ISU Members. Rule 510 to 521 have actually been re-written and that's what I am summarizing here, NOT the individual proposals of some Members like Denmark, which is asking that all jumps done after the 2 minutes mark in the SP to be given a 1.1 factor bonus.

What this means is while these changes are not official until after the ISU Congress in June, however these are the recommendations of the ISU Technical Committees and they are generally pretty much done deals unless specific Member of ISU (country) specifically objects to the proposed changes and second by at least another Member. Member here means another country. So for example, say South Korea objects to the 3A being allowed in Ladies SP. The ISU will not entertain the objection unless South Korea's position is backed by another country, say China. Even then, South Korea will not be able to submit any amendment, the objection only means the specific proposal can be rejected and therefore, not take effect. In other words, these rule changes will be adopted by silent acclamation without any voting being necessary. Therefore, in most cases, it's pretty safe to assume they will be adopted when the rule changes are being presented under this format, as part of an ISU Technical Committee technical rule change. This is not the same compared to a specific country proposing a rule change via a proposal, in which case, a vote will be necessary (e.g. the 1.1 factor bonus for jumps after 2 minutes in the SP).
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Can't speak for janetfan or the Wallylutz, but I interpreted it as the money spent to lobby to the ISU. My guess is that the Japanese Fed. spent a ton of money in between meetings, research and other related things to get this rule passed. It may also include phone calls, letters to ISU decision makers. Long-distance calls are expensive!

It's not big secret that the Japanese Fed. asked for this.

What about all of these rumors that Mishin is training an army of young Russian Ladies to do 3A's and that they will be unleashed on the skating world in time for Sochi :biggrin:

And wasn't it reported that Rachael is working on a 3A? The other day I saw a clip of 13 year old Mirai practicing a 3A. Maybe it is the Russians and USA who are supporting this ;)

Actually I agree and like you would rather use the word "lobbying" as opposed to "bribery."

Next Spring the Japanese are supposed to host the second WTT event. Japanese TV money basically paid for this event and if Speedy wants to do it again he needs the support of the Japanese Federation.

We should consider the 10% proposed bonus for combination jumps. Nobody has better or more consistent combo jumps than Yuna. Does this mean the Korean federation is behind this proposal?
And if they are so what? Every federation has the right to lobby for rule changes.
 
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wallylutz

Medalist
Joined
Mar 23, 2010
Japan did not submit a proposal to allow ladies to do 3A in the SP. That's why this is shocking. The change came directly from the ISU Technical Committee, which changes the dynamic of this issue entirely. If Japan had submit this as a Member proposal, it will be voted on and many of us suggested such proposal will be voted down in another thread. If Japan has anything to do with this, they certainly did via the smart way - by convincing the ISU Technical Committee to re-write the rule, then submit it to a hearing which basically requires other countries to engage and organize an active opposition or else this will be adopted without even a vote.
 

Figure88

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 3, 2009
Even then, South Korea will not be able to submit any amendment, the objection only means the specific proposal can be rejected and therefore, not take effect. In other words, these rule changes will be adopted by silent acclamation without any voting being necessary. Therefore, in most cases, it's pretty safe to assume they will be adopted when the rule changes are being presented under this format, as part of an ISU Technical Committee technical rule change. This is not the same compared to a specific country proposing a rule change via a proposal, in which case, a vote will be necessary (e.g. the 1.1 factor bonus for jumps after 2 minutes in the SP).

Just to clarify here, although no voting is necessary to adopt the rule changes, if 2 ISU member countries put forth an objection, a specific proposal can still be rejected???
 
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