The Kween and the Queen | Page 18 | Golden Skate

The Kween and the Queen

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
Thanks for the guidelines, Doris. The link is below. I'll summarize some of the points, because this information is really fascinating. It comes from a site called Ballettalk, and unlike Emily Frankel (see that thread in GS), who praises Mao's dancerly qualities but clearly doesn't understand the demands of skating, the posters on this thread are very well informed about skating--far better than I am, certainly!

They discuss the fact that in Curry's ice troupe, a lot of the moves are done very slowly, at school-figure speed, requiring rigorous edge control and (quoting here) "mastery on both feet, both edges of each blade, and both directions, as well as the ability to maintain flow off of single pushes."

Think about one big characteristic of skating: people jump and clockwise, or they jump and spin counterclockwise. Curry wanted his skaters to be more like dancers--able to move in both directions, at the same speed. So the moves were choreographed to execute at the speed of the weaker side.

You see this goal even in Curry's amateur skating. He doesn't jump to both sides, but he does pretty strong spins in both directions. Check the long program from the 1976 Olympics to see what I mean. The last skater I remember doing that in competition is Michelle, in 1998. (Another reason she's now and forever The Kween to me!)

The forum continues with a comparison of Curry with Robin Cousins, another wonderful artistic skater but less dance-based (and, I think, not as strong in school figures as Curry). Here's the link. Doris, please feel free to correct anything I've done wrong in this post.

http://ballettalk.invisionzone.com/lofiversion/index.php/t30189.html

your post is fine, Olympia :) thanks for sharing! :rock:
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Thanks Olympia - I did see a reference from your links that said Cathy Foulkes danced with the Boston Ballet. How interesting that she was not only an accomplished dancer but also a good enough skater to perform in John Curry's troupe.

Changing thoughts I think Michelle fans might find this of interest.
I came across this clip this morning and words from Frank Carroll about Michelle and Maribel Own made me think.....

Imagine that Frank's coach, Maribel won nine US titles - and that Michelle also won nine US titles.
Frank mentions that he hoped Maribel would be proud of the way Michelle skates - and hearing that made me realize what a profound influence Maribel had on US skating.

Of the 12 US skaters at the 1960 Olympics 6 of them were coached by Maribel.

The clip also mentions the great debt US skating owes to Carlo Fassi and John Nicks as they came to the USA after the '61 air crash and were instrumental in helping to rebuild our skating program.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvxOYdSxcnE&feature=related
 

Tonichelle

Idita-Rock-n-Roll
Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
Thanks Olympia - I did see a reference from your links that said Cathy Foulkes danced with the Boston Ballet. How interesting that she was not only an accomplished dancer but also a good enough skater to perform in John Curry's troupe.

Changing thoughts I think Michelle fans might find this of interest.
I came across this clip this morning and words from Frank Carroll about Michelle and Maribel Own made me think.....

Imagine that Frank's coach, Maribel won nine US titles - and that Michelle also won nine US titles.
Frank mentions that he hoped Maribel would be proud of the way Michelle skates - and hearing that made me realize what a profound influence Maribel had on US skating.

Of the 12 US skaters at the 1960 Olympics 6 of them were coached by Maribel.

The clip also mentions the great debt US skating owes to Carlo Fassi and John Nicks as they came to the USA after the '61 air crash and were instrumental in helping to rebuild our skating program.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvxOYdSxcnE&feature=related


if it's the video I'm thinking of, that was part of the ABC coverage of the tribute to the 1961 world team... the show happened while the smoke from the twin tours was still in the air... so it became a show not only for the 1961 team, but for America to heal after the horrific terror attacks. They even had one of the siblings of a man on the flight that went down in the Pensylvania field skate in the show. She'd decided to give up on skating and just focus on school, but donned skates once more to honor her brother (one of the "named heroes" on that flight).
 

Layfan

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Thanks Olympia - I did see a reference from your links that said Cathy Foulkes danced with the Boston Ballet. How interesting that she was not only an accomplished dancer but also a good enough skater to perform in John Curry's troupe.

Changing thoughts I think Michelle fans might find this of interest.
I came across this clip this morning and words from Frank Carroll about Michelle and Maribel Own made me think.....

Imagine that Frank's coach, Maribel won nine US titles - and that Michelle also won nine US titles.
Frank mentions that he hoped Maribel would be proud of the way Michelle skates - and hearing that made me realize what a profound influence Maribel had on US skating.

Of the 12 US skaters at the 1960 Olympics 6 of them were coached by Maribel.

The clip also mentions the great debt US skating owes to Carlo Fassi and John Nicks as they came to the USA after the '61 air crash and were instrumental in helping to rebuild our skating program.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvxOYdSxcnE&feature=related

Janetfan, why did you do that to me??? That clip is so sad. I nearly cried when footage of Michelle and Sasha came on. :cry: It must feel incredible for those skaters to know they are part of this great legacy.

Frank and John Nicks are not so young. Who are the younger coaches who have their same potential for greatness?
 
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janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
Janetfan, why did you do that to me??? That clip is so sad. I nearly cried when footage of Michelle and Sasha came on. :cry: It must feel incredible for those skaters to know they are part of this great legacy.

Frank and John Nicks are not so young. Who are the younger coaches who have their same potential for greatness?

Sure it's sad - but it feels uplifting too.
It does make me wonder if Mirai will be Frank's last girl to make a run at world podiums.

I doubt that Michelle will ever coach - but would not be surprised if Sasha does or becomes a choreographer. I think Sasha is a lifer,,,,,,,,
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
I like your appraisal of Sasha--a lifer. I think you might be right.

As for young coaches: Yuka seems to be getting a fine start, and she has her father's example after all. Her husband Jason Dunjen apparently also coaches. And Brian seems to have a knack for it. An Olympic gold medalist right out of the gate! Look how many years it took Carroll to achieve that with one of his skaters.

Didn't someone say that Lucinda Ruh is now coaching spins? If she could pass on even half of her insight into spin physics, that would be a gift to skating. Did someone also say that Stephane Lambiel is coaching?
 

Layfan

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
I like your appraisal of Sasha--a lifer. I think you might be right.

As for young coaches: Yuka seems to be getting a fine start, and she has her father's example after all. Her husband Jason Dunjen apparently also coaches. And Brian seems to have a knack for it. An Olympic gold medalist right out of the gate! Look how many years it took Carroll to achieve that with one of his skaters.

Didn't someone say that Lucinda Ruh is now coaching spins? If she could pass on even half of her insight into spin physics, that would be a gift to skating. Did someone also say that Stephane Lambiel is coaching?

Brian certainly seems on his way to becoming the "it" coach. :thumbsup:

I hope Sasha stays in the sport, too. Deep inside I think it's what she wants but she needs to come to terms with it and decide she has much to contribute apart from winning medals.
I can think of four ways she should stay in the sport:
1. Choreographer
2. Costume designer
3. Pilates/Yoga teacher for skaters
4. Commentator

Don't know enough about her personality to really know if she would make a good coach.
 
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Lilith11

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 1, 2010
Brian certainly seems on his way to becoming the "it" coach. :thumbsup:

I hope Sasha stays in the sport, too. Deep inside I think it's what she wants but she needs to come to terms with it and decide she has much to contribute apart from winning medals.
I can think of four ways she should stay in the sport:
1. Choreographer
2. Costume designer
3. Pilates/Yoga teacher for skaters
4. Commentator

Don't know enough about her personality to really know if she would make a good coach.

She could always be a spin coach; or school a skater or two on extensions and beautiful lines :3
 

HalfTriple

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 8, 2010
Why is a skater who's not as close to the podium as once was pressed hard to retire? :think:

Give them time to regroup and retrain. I love to see Sasha stay along. In 2010 US national, Sasha still managed to look okay in short.

It's essential for us to have a supportive atmosphere in which skaters can nurture and fulfill what the sport's meant to be by something other than just being highly competitive.
 

Layfan

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Why is a skater who's not as close to the podium as once was pressed hard to retire? :think:

Give them time to regroup and retrain. I love to see Sasha stay along. In 2010 US national, Sasha still managed to look okay in short.

It's essential for us to have a supportive atmosphere in which skaters can nurture and fulfill what the sport's meant to be by something other than just being highly competitive.

I didn't really mean that Sasha should retire. I doubt she'll come back for another season but I'd be psyched if she did.

I just meant that if she does retire from competitive skating, I suspect she'd find much contentment in staying involved in the sport like Peggy and Dick Button and Scott Hamilton and all of those people. Maybe there is something else she wants to do in her life but I suspect her heart lies in staying with the sport.
 

MKFSfan

Medalist
Joined
Mar 15, 2006
I would be SHOCKED to see Sasha take up coaching. I can imagine she would do some choreographing/dress designing for a selected few skaters (meaning, I can't see her being satisfied in a role like Lori Nichol or David Wilson, but would do choreo and dress design for a couple skaters she's close to), but I get the feeling she would prefer to embark on a more self devoted career, like acting, or try to break into fashion somehow. I don't think she'll be a "lifer" like, say, Yuka Sato or Scott Hamilton have been. I think she'll find a secondary niche and pursue that while always keep the door to skating opportunities open, like Michelle.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
Joined
May 15, 2009
I would be SHOCKED to see Sasha take up coaching. I can imagine she would do some choreographing/dress designing for a selected few skaters (meaning, I can't see her being satisfied in a role like Lori Nichol or David Wilson, but would do choreo and dress design for a couple skaters she's close to), but I get the feeling she would prefer to embark on a more self devoted career, like acting, or try to break into fashion somehow. I don't think she'll be a "lifer" like, say, Yuka Sato or Scott Hamilton have been. I think she'll find a secondary niche and pursue that while always keep the door to skating opportunities open, like Michelle.

Hmmm.....compared to Sasha - Michelle really seems to have put skating behind her.

I see almost no similarity to their careers at the moment. Sasha is still heavily involved in skating and Michelle appears to be preparing for a career outside of skating.

I can't predict what the futire holds but it feels like a safe bet to think Sasha will remain more heavily involved in the skating world than Michelle will.

Things could change - Michelle could reach a point in her life and decide she wants to be part of skating but first I think she is going to finish school and then enter the state dept full time.
 

MKFSfan

Medalist
Joined
Mar 15, 2006
What I really meant was I can't see Sasha doing more than headlining tours. I doubt she'll coach or commentate.

I think if there were more single touring shows, we would see more of Michelle, which is why Yu-Na's tour is so perfect for her; Michelle can still pursue her education, and skate in the summer. There has been talk about a similar tour in the US, but now that Yu-Na seems to plan on competing, I bet that will be on hold. With COI, Michelle was such a huge star and very rarely missed a stop. It is selfish on my part to want her back, but I understand between her health and studies, it has to come 3rd...I'm hoping it's just for now!

I think if Sasha's acting career had taken off, she would be there and not skating, but everyone has to make a living! I see Sasha more as a Tara than as a lifer like Yuka. But who knows...I just never get the feeling she LOVES touring, but that she knows she's a good at it and popular. I wonder if she has any aspirations to go to school.
 
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