Tarasova on working with Asada | Golden Skate

Tarasova on working with Asada

Ptichka

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http://ptichkafs.livejournal.com/51239.html
This is an exerpt from an interview Tarasova gave Vaitsekhovskaya before her mother's death on working with Asada again.

TT: Also, Mao Asada came to me.

I know. I was greatly surprised to see you work with her again. It seemed that after the Vancouver Games, you did not intend to continue working with her.

That was my intention, that’s true. Then, though, I got two letters from Kyoko, Mao’s mom. And… In short, having read the letters, I realized it is completely wrong to put your own ambitions above professional growth of a uniquely talented person who needs your help. I said they could come.

The problem is that I only had three days to put together and choreograph two exhibitions programs and a short. I took my time preparing for those three days. I was very nervous. Lena Vodorezova even said she’s never seen my like that. I took my former student Ira Nikolaeva as an assistant. With her, I talked through every single step Mao had to take on the ice. After I was done with the programs, Lena Kustarova spent two full days going over them as well. I really wanted to work with her because I could see that over the last few years Lena has grown into a real master. After all this, we all knew in detail what exactly we would do when Asada finally did come to Moscow. On the first day, we put together the whole short program, from the first to the last move, with consideration for all new rules and regulations. Moreover, we had three versions for each element so we could easily choose the ones that fit best. I was very happy with the work we managed to do in those three days.

Do you regret parting ways with this athlete in spring?

I never have any regrets. The problem is not with Asada. The problem is that I cannot dedicate my life to her fully. My mom and my husband are very sick. I cannot afford to come to the ice ten times a week, and another ten times to off-ice training. Without this commitment, it won’t work. I only come to the rink when I’m asked to. I know I can give someone the necessary push, point out their mistakes, or perhaps choreograph a program or a footwork sequence. I don’t just do it for the athletes; I do it for myself as I want to keep a hold on my coaching profession.

Asada and her mom were very happy with the work we did in Moscow. However, as they were leaving for Japan, I insisted they look for a Japanese coach.

Why?

I think Japanese skaters should work on the basics with Japanese coaches. Languages barrier prevents a coach from imparting certain nuances on the athlete. Training often demands a special eye-to-eye contact. Japanese culture is very different from ours, as are their views on many things. There are things you’ll never be able to explain unless you grew up in that culture as well. No interpreter will do the trick. Perhaps I’m talking like a coach of a previous generation, but that’s my opinion.
 

janetfan

Match Penalty
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May 15, 2009
Thanks for translating and posting Tat's interview Ptichka. It's always interesting to hear her thoughts about working with skaters.
Sorry to hear she has had such a tough year and best wishes to her.
 

Layfan

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Nov 5, 2009
Thanks so much for this. Tarasova sounds like quite a lady. My heart goes out to her for her mom and her husband - hope he is doing okay! What she said about coaching Mao was very straight forward and it sounds like she acted with the skater's best interests at heart.
 

Nadine

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Oct 3, 2003
Thanks for the interview, and for translating it. :)

Two things I found interesting, or actually three:

1.) I've always known Mao's mom is a huge fan of TAT, which has been the main reason why they've worked together, but it was nice to see it confirmed by Tatiana via the letter from Kyoko. :)^)

2.) I feel the same way as Tatiana, for the most part, about how coaches & skaters from the same country/culture should work together, not only for language's sake (language is key!), but also for the little nuances that only another person from the same country & culture could understand. But that said, I am grateful when they do share their gifts, because the result can be outstanding!

3.) the eye-to-eye contact that Tatiana mentioned being crucial immediately brought to mind Japan's views on such, which is looked down upon -- http://www.all-about-teaching-english-in-japan.com/japaneseetiquette.html


I wish both Tatiana & Mao well, and the rest of their team, including Mr. Sato. :)
 

hikki

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Thank you for sharing and translating the interview, Ptichka. Her professionalism is evident in this interview and I absolutely love what she's done with the short and exhibition programs this season.
 

let`s talk

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Sep 10, 2009
I think Japanese skaters should work on the basics with Japanese coaches. Languages barrier prevents a coach from imparting certain nuances on the athlete. Training often demands a special eye-to-eye contact. Japanese culture is very different from ours, as are their views on many things. There are things you’ll never be able to explain unless you grew up in that culture as well. No interpreter will do the trick. Perhaps I’m talking like a coach of a previous generation, but that’s my opinion.
The languages barrier sounds like a strange explanation or an excuse. Many skaters work with coaches from foreign backgrounds and sometimes a coach and a skater speak to each other in a language that is foreign to both of them. Including Japanese skaters.
 

hurrah

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Aug 8, 2009
The languages barrier sounds like a strange explanation or an excuse. Many skaters work with coaches from foreign backgrounds and sometimes a coach and a skater speak to each other in a language that is foreign to both of them. Including Japanese skaters.

You clearly have no international or multicultural experience if you think language barrier is a strange explanation.
 

mishieru07

On the Ice
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Oct 23, 2009
The languages barrier sounds like a strange explanation or an excuse. Many skaters work with coaches from foreign backgrounds and sometimes a coach and a skater speak to each other in a language that is foreign to both of them. Including Japanese skaters.

It's more a cultural barrier than a pure language barrier. Not to say that it's impossible to overcome, but it is difficult, especily since Tat cannot coach Mao full-time and Mao wishes to remain in Japan. It would be best for her to have a Japanese coach.

Ptichka, thanks for the translation! Tat is a professional lady indeed, and I wish her all the best!
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Thanks so much, Ptichka! What an interesting interview. It casts a new light on last season as well as on Tat herself and Asada. Although I didn't like the orchestration of Asada's program, I appreciate the fact that Tarasova is a wonderful influence on any student, from any country, and I'm glad Asada had the opportunity to work with her, even if Tat couldn't devote her full-time energies to the process.
 

Ptichka

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Jul 28, 2003
3.) the eye-to-eye contact that Tatiana mentioned being crucial immediately brought to mind Japan's views on such, which is looked down upon -- http://www.all-about-teaching-english-in-japan.com/japaneseetiquette.html

Very interesting! And, of course, Tarasova is one of the most emotional and tactile coaches out there, displaying over-the-top emotions and hugging her students half to death. :laugh:

However, there is another side to this I guess - figure skating is essentially judged by Western standards. Perhaps a Western teacher is needed to teach an Asian skater to perform in a way deemed "artistic" and "emotional" by international judges?
 
Joined
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Very interesting! And, of course, Tarasova is one of the most emotional and tactile coaches out there, displaying over-the-top emotions and hugging her students half to death. :laugh:

However, there is another side to this I guess - figure skating is essentially judged by Western standards. Perhaps a Western teacher is needed to teach an Asian skater to perform in a way deemed "artistic" and "emotional" by international judges?

Good point about the judging standards...but if any Asian skater is an exception in that regard, it's Asada. She is both artistic and great at expressing emotions, it seems to me, though of course being coached by Tarasova would improve her capacity in both those areas. Look how much Arakawa and Yagudin benefited from her coaching!

By the way, if I may ask for clarification--are you using "Western" to mean anyone non-Asian (meaning including Tarasova) or in the sense it has often been used to differentiate Western Europe and North America from Russia (meaning that Tarasova wouldn't count as Western in this sense)? I guess this is another example of how different cultures interpret the same words and concepts!
 

Ptichka

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I guess I meant "Western" as European-influenced. I didn't want to use "non-Asian" because there is also Africa and Latin America, while Asian countries of the Middle East can be considered part of "Western" culture as well.
 

let`s talk

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Sep 10, 2009
You clearly have no international or multicultural experience if you think language barrier is a strange explanation.
Internet is fun to see how easily people make themselves look ridiculous. Being under 30yo I have been to 27 countries, speak 4 languages, have been residing and working in a foreign country for 6 years and I am married to the person who doesn't belong to my race or nationality and who doesn't speak my native language. I have intenational and multicultural experiences days and nights but no doubt you know better than me what you are saying about me. Probably exactly the "lack" of that experience makes me think that the language barrier is a strange explanaion, especially for professionals. How about Japanese skaters Dai, Oda, Miki who work(ed) with Russian coaches and they speak to each other in English- a foreign language for both J-skaters and R-coaches. Or French dancers who speak English with their coarch Zhulin since Zhulin doesn't speak French and the dancers don't speak Russian well enough. Or Weir and I can continue. Yes, I do find "language barrier" as an unsatisfactory excuse in the modern FS world, especially for professionals as I said already.
It's more a cultural barrier than a pure language barrier.
And why did other skaters/coaches' of international backgrounds business relationships became possible and succesfull? My guess is both TAT and Mao had the personalities barrier and they both were not broad-minded enough to overcome it.
Tat cannot coach Mao full-time and Mao wishes to remain in Japan.
That's true. And it sounds like a reasonable excuse for TAT but not so reasonable for Mao. Her "I want to live in Japan only" is a stone age stuff for the modern FS world.
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
Let's Talk, you've put your finger on one of the things I most love about skating--the fact that it's a world community. This is especially true since the dissolution of the Soviet Union, of course. In recent years, we've had a Russian coaches training Canadians in the U.S., Japanese skaters training in Russia, a Turkish skater training in Canada, and just about the entire Korean figure skating program also training in Canada, not to mention Russians skating for Lithuania and Bulgaria. I always think of Lucinda Ruh in discussions like this: because of her father's business career, she lived and trained in the U.S., Japan, and other countries. She's fluent in at least four languages, including Japanese, which she spoke with Yuka Sato when they trained together. Vive la difference!

For some reason I'm surprised to learn that Alexander Zhulin doesn't speak French. To me he looks like one of those Russian expatriates from the 1920s who lived in Paris and smoked Soubranie cigarettes (hope he doesn't smoke at all, of course!) while dancing the tango with slinky adventuresses in intime little night spots on the Left Bank. I guess this is what skating does to the imagination!
 
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miki88

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Dec 28, 2009
And why did other skaters/coaches' of international backgrounds business relationships became possible and succesfull? My guess is both TAT and Mao had the personalities barrier and they both were not broad-minded enough to overcome it. That's true. And it sounds like a reasonable excuse for TAT but not so reasonable for Mao. Her "I want to live in Japan only" is a stone age stuff for the modern FS world.

There are a lot of high profile coaching arrangements that did not work out. IMAO. There are probably more failed coaching situations than successful ones. Btw, neither TAT nor Mao made any excuses and both took responsibility for the results, so I don't understand why there needs to be blaming going around. They had a contract for two years and in the end they realized it didn't work out and moved on.
 

Morning Glory

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Dec 16, 2008
Thank you so much for posting this interview! Mao (and her mother ) adores TAT, so it's good they are working together again. I love Chopin EX so much.

How about Japanese skaters Dai, Oda, Miki who work(ed) with Russian coaches and they speak to each other in English- a foreign language for both J-skaters and R-coaches.

Even when Dai, Oda, Miki worked with foreign coaches, they had Japanese coaches who could work on the skating basics in Japanese. Utako Nagamitsu for Dai, Yuko Monna for Miki, Noriko Oda for Nobu. But Mao had no one.
 

inskate

On the Ice
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Dec 27, 2007
The languages barrier sounds like a strange explanation or an excuse.
My guess is both TAT and Mao had the personalities barrier and they both were not broad-minded enough to overcome it.

Have you even /read/ the article..? ;)

"The problem is not with Asada. The problem is that I cannot dedicate my life to her fully. My mom and my husband are very sick. I cannot afford to come to the ice ten times a week, and another ten times to off-ice training. Without this commitment, it won’t work."

Tarasova never said that she parted with Mao doe to communication problems. She said that it was because she could not dedicate her life to her fully, and anyone who followed Mao's training closely last season knows that a few times their training sessions were shortened or called away, because of severe health problms of TAT and her family. Her mother especially was in poor health; she passed away this summer. :(

What TAT did mention is that it would be better if Mao worked on /basics/ with a Japanese coach. She did not work on her basics with TAT much - as TAT mentioned, it was mostly fine-tuning, giving the necessary push, pointing out mistakes, choreographing. There was no time to go back to basics before the Olympics, because it could cause Mao to temporarily lose her jumps. But Mao did want to go back to basics, so TAT adviced her the best as she could. It's not like the concept of a Japanese skater going back to work on basics with a Japanese coach is a novelty - Miki did it after her bad shopwing at Olympics 2006 (working with Yuko Monna), and Takahashi mentioned he worked on basic skating a lot while recovering from his injury (working with Utako Nagamitsu and Takeshi Honda).

One needs to remember that TAT's coaching style is different from Morozov's, or Orser's. She does not go out on the ice, and can't demonstrate the movements for her students. She depends only on verbal explanations. When working on choreography, she could use her assistants Ira and Lena to help. This would be much more difficult to do when working on skater's technique, because even the tiniest difference in body or edge position can make a difference. From what I've seem on practice clips and on my rink, even coaches who share the language with their students sometimes prefer to just demonstrate the movement, or guide the skater into the right position with their hands.

I think that if there were any real problems in their relationship, Mao would not go back to TAT to have her SP and EX choreographed, and TAT would not disrupt her tight schedule to work with Mao again.


Her "I want to live in Japan only" is a stone age stuff for the modern FS world.

Firstly, it's not only Mao's opinion that matters. She is sponsored by Chukyo Uni, and in return they want her to show up at the Uni to boost their image. And then there's the fact that the Chukyo rinks have top-notch equipement and there a lot of classes and training camps organized for the skaters, where the skaters can benefit from working with coaches and choreographers other than their own.

Secondly, I believe that it's the "let's look for a foreign coach!" approach that is becoming outdated. If a given country wants to develop a strong training base, they can't keep sending out their best skaters to foreign coaches. It costs a lot of money that could be spent more wisely, and it prevents the local coaches from gaining confidence and experience as coaches of elite skaters.

It is not beneficial for the very young skaters - they won't get to have a foreign coach until they start winning enough competitions to catch their federation's eye, but their progress might be slowed down by working with a coach that is not experienced enough and does not really have high goals.

It is not beneficial for some of the older skaters, who might have different reasons for wanting to stay in their home country - like Oda, who switched from Morozov to working part-time with Barkell, because he wants to spends as much time as possible with his wife and his newborn son.

It is not beneficial for those skaters who end up feeling so homesick that it impacts their performance (like Miki while she was working with Heiss-Jenkins).

It is not beneficial for those young skaters who could get inspired and learn from the elite skaters if they kept skating at the same rink. And having an Olympian or World Champion skate at the local rink might be quite motivating for a lot of kids to start skating.

I'm not saying that the skaters should stop working with foreign coaches altogether - sometimes it's good to see things from a different point of view, to broaden one's horizons, or just to have an opportunity to work with coaches who are known as masters in some particular aspect of figure skating. But I believe that it should happen when the skaters feel ready to try something new, not because they don't have any good coaching options in their own country.
 

Ptichka

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Jul 28, 2003
Her "I want to live in Japan only" is a stone age stuff for the modern FS world.
Too many skaters have had problems due to psychological issues related to living in a foreign country. Being away from what one knows, not to mention from one's friends and family, can lead to depression - which does nothing for one's skating. I think it's perfectly reasonable for an athlete to choose to live in her home country. However, if she does so, she should make logical subsequent choices such as choosing a coach who is not half a world away.
 
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