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Thread: Michelle Kwan's 1998 Olympic Long Program

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    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    Michelle Kwan's 1998 Olympic Long Program

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtKGP...eature=related

    I think this has got to be one of the most beautiful skates in the history of figure skating. I do hope one day the IOC would give Michelle Kwan an Olympic Gold Medal for the high quality of both her short and long programs. She was simply ethereal in this free skate.

    I also love Tara's joyous program and I also think she is truly worthy of that gold.

    But Michelle was simply gorgeous!!!!!!!!!!

    It was also perfection in my opinion. The maturity, the artistry, musicality and emotionality has been truly sensational in my opinion. I wish they do award her that Olympic Gold because she really equally deserved it in Nagano.

    If I were the judge

    i would have marked Tara 5.9, 5.8
    Michelle Kwan 5.8, 5.9 (6.0)
    Last edited by Mathman; 10-20-2010 at 08:51 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by christinaskater View Post
    I do hope one day the IOC would give Michelle Kwan an Olympic Gold Medal for the high quality of both her short and long programs.
    Um, that's not going to happen in a million years. Unlike the pairs competition in 2002, there was no judging scandal in 1998. Some of the audience and viewers thought Tara rightly won; others opted for Michelle. But the judges chose Tara (and not even by 5-4). The IOC doesn't retrospectively award additional gold medals just because some people think that the judges' decision was wrong.

    For what it's worth, I thought Michelle looked slow and tentative that night, though I wouldn't argue with the beauty of the performance.
    Last edited by goldenpleasures; 10-20-2010 at 05:20 AM.

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    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    Hay! I do hope one day she would be awarded an Olympic Gold even though it seems unrealistic hehehe

    I did love Tara's programs

    It became a battle of beauty vs. Joy. I guess the joy represents the Olympics more but nonetheless, both are worthy Olympic champions.

    My friend told me would you rather follow the route of Tara, where she won the Worlds and then the Olympics and retired after that or Michelle, she won Olympic silver and bronze, 5 World titles (5 gold, 3-silvers, 1-bronze), 9 US titles
    Last edited by Mathman; 10-20-2010 at 08:51 AM.

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    Please don't let this thread turn into a Tara vs. Michelle battle. That's been done to death already.

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    To keep it on Michelle, I didn't watch that program for years, because it stung so much that she didn't win. Then just this year, I started watching "Lyra Angelica," but the one she skated at Nationals. It's a gorgeous program, both technically demanding and artistically compelling. Now it's one of my favorites, along with the 2001 "Black Swan" program. It's the kind of skating I wish would be encouraged nowadays: unique, innovative, musical.

    In 1998 it really mattered to me that Michelle hadn't won gold, but as time passed and I watched the amazing career this girl had, I realized that she had somehow transcended Olympic ranking. Interesting that Kwan and Browning are many people's two favorite skaters (obviously mine as well), and neither has an OGM despite several attempts. I always liken it to the list of immortal actors who have not won an Oscar. This list includes Garbo, Fred Astaire, and Cary Grant. I believe the latter two won special Academy Awards but never won for a role in a specific film.

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    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    I know, I wouldn't have witnessed "The Red Violin", "East of Eden", "Song of the Black Swan", "Concierto de Aranjuez", "The Feeling Begins", "Tosca", "Scheherazade" etc. She is and will be considered one of the greatest figure skaters of all time and in my rule book I think she is the greatest figure skater of all time!

    I really love Song of the black swan, tosca, aranjuez, salome and lyra

    The 2002 World's LP of MK was also stunning. She would have been WC had she landed the triple triple
    Last edited by Mathman; 10-20-2010 at 08:52 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by christinaskater View Post
    The 2002 World's LP of MK was also stunning. She would have been WC had she landed the triple triple
    No, she wouldn't. Slutskaya only had to finish 2nd in the FS to win overall.

    Repeatedly posting about Kwan's greatness sounds rather obsessive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by goldenpleasures View Post
    No, she wouldn't. Slutskaya only had to finish 2nd in the FS to win overall.

    Repeatedly posting about Kwan's greatness sounds rather obsessive.
    You COULD choose to not come into this thread, y'know.

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    *shrug* I was hoping that a thread on Kwan's Nagano FS would be or would turn into something more than a gushfest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by goldenpleasures View Post
    No, she wouldn't. Slutskaya only had to finish 2nd in the FS to win overall.

    Repeatedly posting about Kwan's greatness sounds rather obsessive.
    Not that I'm the one to ask, but it seems to me that it's only obsessive if one thinks that only Michelle was great. Most of us who gush over her have also enthused (repeatedly, with some of us) over other memorable skaters, including other ladies singles skaters. I think I'm just of a gushing cast of mind, and skating brings it out in me. As Edith Piaf has said, je ne regrette rien (I regret nothing). To a great extent, that may be what skating is for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    Not that I'm the one to ask, but it seems to me that it's only obsessive if one thinks that only Michelle was great. Most of us who gush over her have also enthused (repeatedly, with some of us) over other memorable skaters, including other ladies singles skaters. I think I'm just of a gushing cast of mind, and skating brings it out in me. As Edith Piaf has said, je ne regrette rien (I regret nothing). To a great extent, that may be what skating is for.
    Olympia, I think your thoughts about skaters are true for many of us.

    It is hard to place a value on memories that last a lifetime. It doesn't matter so much now who won '96 Worlds. Michelle and LuLu were both fantastic and for me memorable. What a a nice thing it is to be able to watch their programs on YouTube and relive those memories.

    The '98 Olympics provided memories for a lifetime for some of us. Years go by and the thought of who won Gold, Silver and Bronze becomes secondary. It was a competition for the ages with Tara, Michelle and LuLu all showing they had the heart of a champion.

    I think we saw something pretty special in 2010 as Yuna, Mao and Joannie showed us that there is more to figure skating than winning. They showed us that even under unimaginable pressure the human spirit can triumph and I think that is why many fans love skating and skaters so much.

    I know Yuna and Mao skated better - but I will never forget the courage Joannie showed in Vancouver.

    Going out to center ice alone - with so much on the line and with so many watching what you will do with your four minutes is one of the toughest things I can imagine.

    I don't think there can ever be enough gushing over a skater like Michelle who not only excelled on the ice but who never tried to hide her feelings from us. She was special and there will never be another one like her.

    Yes, we read many posts about "mini-Sashas" and "mini-Yunas" and "mini-Plushenkos."

    Why is it that we never see a post about a "mini-Michelle."
    Last edited by janetfan; 10-20-2010 at 05:30 PM.

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    she takes the audience on her journey of emotions Layfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    Olympia, I think your thoughts about skaters are true for many of us.

    It is hard to place a value on memories that last a lifetime. It doesn't matter so much now who won '96 Worlds. Michelle and LuLu were both fantastic and for me memorable. What a a nice thing it is to be able to watch their programs on YouTube and relive those memories.

    The '98 Olympics provided memories for a lifetime for some of us. Years go by and the thought of who won Gold, Silver and Bronze becomes secondary. It was a competition for the ages with Tara, Michelle and LuLu all showing they had the heart of a champion.

    I think we saw something pretty special in 2010 as Yuna, Mao and Joannie showed us that there is more to figure skating than winning. They showed us that even under unimaginable pressure the human spirit can triumph and I think that is why many fans love skating and skaters so much.

    I know Yuna and Mao skated better - but I will never forget the courage Joannie showed in Vancouver.

    Going out to center ice alone - with so much on the line and with so many watching what you will do with your four minutes is one of the toughest things I can imagine.

    I don't think there can ever be enough gushing over a skater like Michelle who not only excelled on the ice but who never tried to hide her feelings from us. She was special and there will never be another one like her.

    Yes, we read many posts about "mini-Sashas" and "mini-Yunas" and "mini-Plushenkos."

    Why is it that we never see a post about a "mini-Michelle."
    Ha! That is a very good question. I'd never thought of it that way. There is certainly something unique about Michelle that many have tried to describe. Like I said in another thread, I think Peggy said it best in 1998 nationals when she said that Michelle "takes us on her journey of emotions." She showed so much of herself during her skating, how could any other skater resemble her?

    Here's a program of hers that doesn't seem talked about as much. Too bad about the hard fall on the double axel - strange, I don't remember her missing many of those, particularly during exhibitions or shows. But still, I find a gorgeous program. Not quite as poignant as Fields of Gold in '02 but still beautiful.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2z3Z19DCOsQ

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    can't come down to Earth prettykeys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Layfan View Post
    Here's a program of hers that doesn't seem talked about as much. Too bad about the hard fall on the double axel - strange, I don't remember her missing many of those, particularly during exhibitions or shows. But still, I find a gorgeous program. Not quite as poignant as Fields of Gold in '02 but still beautiful.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2z3Z19DCOsQ
    The music does not go with the skate. As someone who adores Les Miserables (both the musical and the novel/story), there was something disjoint about the whole thing. I don't think that song is meant to be skated to, and there was too much smiling at the wrong moments and with the wrong mood set by the song.

    Ironically, however, the fall on the double axel actually goes with the part of the song where it happens...heh.

    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    Not that I'm the one to ask, but it seems to me that it's only obsessive if one thinks that only Michelle was great. Most of us who gush over her have also enthused (repeatedly, with some of us) over other memorable skaters, including other ladies singles skaters.
    I have no qualms with gushing, but gushing accompanied by statements like "I would have scored them like this" and "Michelle would have won with that" (and implying that Michelle deserved a win over someone else, thereby implying that someone deserved to be taken down a notch) doesn't strike me as fair. And it was done with the example of both Tara and Irina.

    One's favourite performances don't always have to be the winners. I have liked and preferred programs that were not the best competition pieces.

    For the record, and to be on topic, in 1998 I would have scored it
    Tara: 5.9, 5.85
    Michelle: 5.8, 5.9

    And since the 6.0 judging system didn't allow for hundredths, and I feel Tara should have won, I would have given the scores as
    Tara: 5.9, 5.9
    Michelle: 5.8, 5.9

    Michelle had an artistically superior program. I didn't notice it was tentative or slow. But Tara's technical was far too dominant and she skated all-out. I give Tara the edge.
    Last edited by prettykeys; 10-20-2010 at 08:44 PM.

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    Banned janetfan's Avatar
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    Here is a little better clip of this of this program.
    Maybe mathman can put this on his "Kwanliness meter" and see where it ranks.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysu4x...eature=related

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    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by prettykeys View Post
    The music does not go with the skate.
    Well, yes, but is that Michelle's fault or the fault of the composer? Claude-Michael Schonberg should have known that one day Michelle would be skating to his music and composed accordingly.

    Quote Originally Posted by prettykeys
    ...the fall on the double axel .
    A flaw in the Law of Gravity.

    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan
    Here is a little better clip of this of this program.
    Maybe mathman can put this on his "Kwanliness meter" and see where it ranks.
    Blows the top off the old Kwan-o-meter!

    http://heatherw.com/mk/pics/omo/9720610.jpg

    http://heatherw.com/mk/pics/omo/9720611.jpg

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