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Thread: Speed

  1. #1
    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    Speed

    Throughout the Grand Prix this year (and, mostly, the ladies competition in Skate America), several posters have commented that so-and-so is really fast, or so-and-so is so slow, they nearly come to a stop. The impression I get, however, is that these skaters, whether they are considered fast skaters or slow skaters skate their whole program with this speed. When I first became a fan, skaters changed tempo with their music:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJNs1esR0_Y

    Nowadays, when a skater skates to even the same music, the slow section is completely ignored:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dszUURzhWh4

    Has speed become so important, that skaters, even the most "artistic" ones, are ignoring the tempo?

  2. #2
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    The problem is you can't see the real speed(or tempo) on TV.
    The same performance, but different angle.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rpobi8brofA
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L5sykV_U8Lo

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oU3EDmbs8KA[fancam]
    Last edited by ever; 11-16-2010 at 01:35 PM.

  3. #3
    Sitting Here on Blue Jay Way silver.blades's Avatar
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    Personally, I think that the speed across the ice should always be fast regardless of the music. Skating is about flow and speed. The relation to the music should come with the speed of the steps and the choreography.

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    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Speed is a relative of Entertainment.

  5. #5
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silver.blades View Post
    Personally, I think that the speed across the ice should always be fast regardless of the music. Skating is about flow and speed. The relation to the music should come with the speed of the steps and the choreography.
    Speed =/= tempo. You can gain a lot of speed without stroking quickly

  6. #6
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    High Speed (whatever that is) makes Jumps easier to do. Surya Bonaly opened up with a double axel without gathering any speed. I thought this remarkable because the law of physics insists on speed for jumps. Did she get any extra credit for that? I think not. fans probably thought she was slow.

    I'm confused with fan's making an issue out of speed. It does indeed work with Flow and so does less speed work with Flow. How fast do you want a skater to move when using the Thais Intermezzo? Like a bullet? It doesn't mean slow, it means with the tempo. Otherwise get rid of the music in figure skating.

    It might make sense for compeititive skaters to also take some music lessons as well as the old standbye ballet.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joesitz View Post
    High Speed (whatever that is) makes Jumps easier to do. Surya Bonaly opened up with a double axel without gathering any speed. I thought this remarkable because the law of physics insists on speed for jumps. Did she get any extra credit for that? I think not. fans probably thought she was slow.

    I'm confused with fan's making an issue out of speed. It does indeed work with Flow and so does less speed work with Flow. How fast do you want a skater to move when using the Thais Intermezzo? Like a bullet? It doesn't mean slow, it means with the tempo. Otherwise get rid of the music in figure skating.

    It might make sense for compeititive skaters to also take some music lessons as well as the old standbye ballet.
    High speed is difficult to control, that is why many skaters go slow.

  8. #8
    Sitting Here on Blue Jay Way silver.blades's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mskater93 View Post
    Speed =/= tempo. You can gain a lot of speed without stroking quickly
    I'm aware that speed and tempo are different. The speed in a program should remain more or less constant, while the tempo of the skating should match the music.

  9. #9
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    This wasn't directed at you - this was directed at whoever suggested that a skater should skate slowly in the slow section of the program. The tempo of the skating should match the music, but the skater should still be covering the ice well.

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    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ever View Post
    High speed is difficult to control, that is why many skaters go slow.
    I don't understand the humor in your post, but speed in any gauge is required for FLOW and it is timed to the TEMPO of the music. Do you want the Adagio in Swan Lake to be speedier?

  11. #11
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mskater93 View Post
    This wasn't directed at you - this was directed at whoever suggested that a skater should skate slowly in the slow section of the program. The tempo of the skating should match the music, but the skater should still be covering the ice well.
    Which poster suggested that a skater should skate slowly in the slow section of the program? I didn't read any of that. Have you ever mentioned how fast you would want a skater to skate? Is it as fast as a speed skater or moderate like a figure skater? Should not the figure skater vary his speed while skating his program? It's in the rules. Now how does he do it? by skating fast throughout his program ignoring all the changes in Tempo? Is that correct? If so, there is no need for Music in Figure Skating.

  12. #12
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silver.blades View Post
    I'm aware that speed and tempo are different. The speed in a program should remain more or less constant, while the tempo of the skating should match the music.
    Why then does the CoP ask for variance of speed in a program?

  13. #13
    Sitting Here on Blue Jay Way silver.blades's Avatar
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    I don't object to the use of stops and skids within a program, but the skater should be able to get back up to speed quickley and maintain that speed throughout the majority of the program. I do know quite a few coaches who do beleive that speed should vary in accordance with the music, but I was always taught that you should be at full speed for the entire program.

  14. #14
    Custom Title Joesitz's Avatar
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    OK. If you don't believe in the Variance of Speed in a Program. I'm just questioning how one shows variance in a program without a change in tempo of the music. (I hope skids and stops were not pointed towards me.)

    Maintaining (your word) the same speed, to me at least, is not showing variance in speed. Ok if you don't want to vary speed. There was one of those Swedish gals at SA who used a piece of music that had no change in Tempo, and she did skate without any variance in speed. Unfortunately, her tech was off. I found her boring more for the lack of musicality than for tech errors.

    I'm just one of those guys who likes variety in figure skating.

  15. #15
    Sitting Here on Blue Jay Way silver.blades's Avatar
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    I don't have any problem with changing the tempo of the music and the steps to match the music, but the speed across the ice should always be fast, regardless.

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