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Thread: Men - Short Program

  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by museksk8r View Post
    I don't care for Jeremy's hair or costume; he could do so much better! The only costumes of this mens' SP that I did like was Tomas Verner's and Samuel Contesti's.

    I wish Abbott would wear a shirt and pants similar to his Nationals LP costume last season, but instead of royal blue, the shirt could be red with black pants. Or, he could wear the same style as his current SP costume, but have it be solid black without the white. He should wear his hair naturally without the slicked back gel look. JMO.
    His hair is that way because his music is a tango. His hair isn't slicked down for the FS.

  2. #152
    Rink Rat i love to skate's Avatar
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    What a beauty 4T-3T by Patrick! His jumps looked infinitely better here than they did at Skate Canada and he looked much more settled into the ice. Now if he could only get that axel figured out...

  3. #153
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    Chan's been trying to 'figure out' the 3A since his first GP season (2006-2007). This is now his 5th GP season and he's seems to be farther away from the solution than ever. So far this season, he's attempted the 3A four times and landed just one.

  4. #154
    Custom Title Kutien's Avatar
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  5. #155
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    I'm wondering why Chan's coach can't fix his 3A like the 4T. 4T-3T and beautifully executed, no kidding. He couldn't do a 4t alone last year.

  6. #156
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    At Skate Canada, after getting a shockingly high score for a SP with 3 falls, he said the judges wanted to give him the marks because they saw his practices and knew he could do the jumps. He then said that stressed the importance of practices (at a competition)!!!??!.
    In that, however, he was only telling the truth. Granted, it is a truth that the ISU does not want to be made public, but the truth none the less.

    Practices are very important, as are the meetings between coaches and judges where the judges tell the coaches what they want the skaters to do next time to get higher scores.

    "Winning the parctices" has always been a factor. At the 2006 Olympics Shizuka Arakawa creamed Irina Slutskaya and Sasha Cohen in the practices. When it came to the actual competition, it was a cakewalk.

    One skater who knew this well was Michelle Kwan. At competitions, every practice was a performance, both for the judges and for whatever audience attended. She understood that she was always on stage and always being judged.
    Last edited by Mathman; 11-19-2010 at 08:45 PM.

  7. #157
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    4T is basically 3T with an extra revolution, which requires more spring, but the jump itself isn't that different. The 3A requires a forward takeoff and that seems to be Chan's nemesis.

    Of course, he could just as well abandon 3A and do 4T, 4T+3T and two 2As. Lambiel won many a competition with that layout. But then Lambiel's SS were comparable to Chan's and in addition, Lambiel was a much more accomplished musical interpreter and he always established a strong rapport with the audience. Chan is lacking in the latter two areas.

  8. #158
    Rink Rat i love to skate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    4T is basically 3T with an extra revolution

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    4T is basically 3T with an extra revolution, which requires more spring, but the jump itself isn't that different. The 3A requires a forward takeoff and that seems to be Chan's nemesis.

    Of course, he could just as well abandon 3A and do 4T, 4T+3T and two 2As. Lambiel won many a competition with that layout. But then Lambiel's SS were comparable to Chan's and in addition, Lambiel was a much more accomplished musical interpreter and he always established a strong rapport with the audience. Chan is lacking in the latter two areas.
    Lambiel didnt have a strong and heavily politikal federation buying his marks though.

  10. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Part of the reason why some people feel such outrage about Chan's inflated marks is that Chan himself has alienated many of former admirers by his remarks in the media. He has dished other skaters (Plushenko, Joubert) and commented negatively about Johnny Weir's wearing a wreath put on his head by a fan in the KnC at the Olympics. He has boasted about his own skating while taking potshots at other skaters.

    At Skate Canada, after getting a shockingly high score for a SP with 3 falls, he said the judges wanted to give him the marks because they saw his practices and knew he could do the jumps. He then said that stressed the importance of practices (at a competition)!!!??!.

    Jeff Buttle sometimes got overmarked, but just as often he took a hit when he had a string of off-performances. Jeff never had anything to say one way or the other about other skaters or his own performances. Jeff was a gentleman. Chan is a cocky brat.
    Very well said. I wouldnt be surprised if this fiasco continues if the other mens skaters get together and file a protest about Chan's scores just like they did about Galit Chait's scores in the dance event at the 2002 Worlds.

  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    In that, however, he was only telling the truth. Granted, it is a truth that the ISU does not want to be made public, but the truth none the less.

    Practices are very important, as are the meetings between coaches and judges where the judges tell the coaches what they want the skaters to do next time to get higher scores.

    One skater who knew this well was Michelle Kwan. At competitions, every practice was a performance, both for the judges and for whatever audience attended. She understood that she was always on stage and always being judged.
    And Chan claimed that he could do 4T better than 3A, which was taken by many as boasting. It turned out he was telling the truth, wasn't he? That kid has gotten himself into many troubles for telling the truth. I guess many skating fans don't want to hear the truth, nor can they handle the truth. They want beautiful skating and sugar-coated talk. They want a star or an idol for worship instead of an honest, unsophisticated human being that goes through growing-up pains and missteps as does everybody else.

  12. #162
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    Chan is the only on the top to mess it up here, but the 3a has been quite the thorn in everyone's side this season, hasn't it? I wonder why.

    Almost every "contender" has has issues with it, with even Oda falling on it and Daisuke stepping out of most of his. Abbott and Joubert didn't even do two in the lp because they popped theirs. Of those who made the podium, only Kozuka, Amodio, Mroz, and Oda (at SA with a sequence deduction) landed 3 cleanly.

    I think Chan can get away without it for now, but by Worlds I suspect everyone will be ready.

  13. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    In that, however, he was only telling the truth. Granted, it is a truth that the ISU does not want to be made public, but the truth none the less.

    Practices are very important, as are the meetings between coaches and judges where the judges tell the coaches what they want the skaters to do next time to get higher scores.

    One skater who knew this well was Michelle Kwan. At competitions, every practice was a performance, both for the judges and for whatever audience attended. She understood that she was always on stage and always being judged.
    And Chan claimed that he could do 4T better than 3A, which was taken by many as boasting. It turned out he was telling the truth, wasn't he? That kid has gotten himself into many troubles for telling the truth. I guess many skating fans don't want to hear the truth, nor can they handle the truth. They want beautiful skating and sugar-coated talk. They want a star or an idol for worship instead of an honest, unsophisticated human being that goes through growing-up pains and missteps as does everybody else.

  14. #164
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Chan in no way deserves to be 3 and a half points higher in TES than a clean Abbott with a fall on a triple axel. A quad vs no quad alone in no way justifies that.
    Again you use the term "clean" as if it means perfect (or technically superior).

    Chan's Quad-Triple combination certainly DOES justify a high score even with a fall on the Triple Axel. That is such a difficult combination and the quality with which he did it was higher than the quality of Abbott's combination.

    Chan's spins were a LOT better than Abbott's as well, so he deservedly scored higher on the technical mark. It perhaps shouldn't have been quite AS high, sure, but that's because of the poor judging system and not the judging itself: getting -GOE doesn't take off as many point as it should (although spins also don't receive as much +GOE as they really should, so that actually balances it out -- Chan's technical mark was fair).

    Jeremy's program is improved from NHK, that was very good to see. I would have scored him higher than Chan on Performance and Interpretation. I don't feel that Chan felt his music especially well or put a lot of energy into the actual performance.

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Lambiel didnt have a strong and heavily politikal federation buying his marks though.
    When are you going to actually stop with this? Lambiel was 4th in the Olympics without a 3A and messy quad landings!:sheesh:

    Did you ever consider that the judges gives Chan good marks is because he is actually a good skater!

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