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Thread: Pairs - Short Program

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigsisjiejie View Post
    Competently done, and I'm sure they can keep making improvements, but this music is almost too big to skate to. I'm not getting into the mood with this vehicle. I also think it's not going to help them against the other top 2-3 pairs.
    That is a point I am in agreement with. Not a good choice of music, nor the choreography.
    There is a reason why there are only 7 elements in pairs, to give you a chance to use the space with something you could stand out with in choreography and footwork. They didn't make good use of it.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by smia View Post
    Sure, there are different judging panels but at the end of the day, they got higher in France with a fall than they did with a cleaner program in Russia. So what are you basing your bonus theory on?
    40 years of watching Russian skaters being judged.

  3. #33
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    I think E/L are too low and G/E are too high. It shouldn't even be close.

    I think K/S are not given enough credit. She had major shoulder surgery 6 months ago. He had groin problems all of last year and just got over the injury before he sprained his ankle bad and was off the ice for 7 weeks. They didn't start serious practice until the beginning of September. I think their scores a tad to low but with all they went though this summer, they look great.

    I don't like the last lift/ending pose I hope they change it.
    Last edited by mousepotato; 11-19-2010 at 10:51 AM.

  4. #34
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    Amanda EVORA / Mark LADWIG

    2010 Cup of China
    51.46
    TES = 28.69
    PCS = 22.77

    2010 Cup of Russia
    52.58
    TES = 27.38
    PCS = 25.20

  5. #35
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    I don't like kavaguti smirnov program at all...I honestly hate the music...the swan program from last year was so gorgeous, but this year's one doesn't work for me..
    I liked the japanese team a lot!!!!

    Really good performance by the italian team...short time ago stefania had a surgery for an infection and they decided at last minute to go to russia! really good job from them!

  6. #36
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    Kavaguti/Smirnov: this music is HUGE and you can see them straining to it a little. However, the program is nicely spaced and the lift climax could be stunning. The triple twist is really poorly timed, though. I don't think any other team has a chance of skating to this music successfully, so I'm looking forward to seeing where this program peaks.

    Evora/Ladwig: What is with this pair getting deep-sixed overall? They are probably the best American pair out there. Lovely program. Needs a little more fire, but this is probably my favourite pairs SP of hte season.

    Gerboldt/Enbert: Ho hum, boring program. Ho hum, loads of potential. Ho hum, another intriguing pair into the Russian convoy.

    Takahashi/Tran: I LOVE this short program. Mysterious, seductive, alluring - it's a gorgeous program and I like seeing them skate to it. Overall, something was missing but they're a deserving second

    Lawrence/Swiegers: Opening a little too cutesy for my taste; last half much better choreographically but they seemed to lose a lot of energy.

  7. #37
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    I usually don't like K&S, but they're the only team this season in pairs who has really DELIVERED.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigsisjiejie View Post
    40 years of watching Russian skaters being judged.
    Some Russian dance teams are overscored, true, but Russian pairs? See how Iliushechkina/Maisuradze were dumped at Cup of China after winning Skate Canada. Even at Skate Canada they were a bit underscored, getting lower PCS than Moore-Towers/Moscovitch is just fishy. Moore-Towers doesn't even come close to Iliushechkina. Generalizing a bit but Russian pairs tend to have the lines, the elegance and style that happens to be rare in pair skating, that's why they tend to get good scores. Besides some Russian teams, there's Savchenko/Szolkowy and Takahashi/Tran who are very polished but most pairs look a bit sloppy.
    Anyway before you criticise the scoring for Russian pairs perhaps you should look at the scoring for pairs from your own country. Pang/Tong: unextended lift positions, their spins also don't have great positions and unison needs work, and she has wierd posture. And I've also seen it mentioned that their skating is scratchy although I'm not in a position to judge. In any case, they get huge PCS scores as if there's nothing they need to work on. I'm sorry but a great smile is not enough to justify those kinds of presentation scores. Same thing with Shen/Zhao. 2004 Worlds, they botched a lift yet got a stream of 6.0s. At the Olympics they again botched a lift and had poor spins and again got scores as if they'd been perfect.
    Last edited by smia; 11-19-2010 at 03:03 PM.

  9. #39
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    I don't believe that I/K got lower PCS than G/B. When I/K were on they were so much better than G/B.

  10. #40
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    Decent start for K/S in their first event back. Good to see. Hopefully they can improve from here with more training time and more events.

  11. #41
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    Kawaguchi/Smirnov are the only Russian pair that I think are a bit overscored but I really admire Yuko's determination, she's even continued through a dislocated shoulder last season. Hopefully everything is healed now. I don't think they brought the power that's necessary for this kind of music (Kazakova/Dmitriev had a much better program) but K/S's program will probably get better with more mileage.

  12. #42
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    I don't see how you can say E/L were dumped. They struggling with their 3T rotation and element levels is not exactly new, and they got higher PCS than G/E. G/E rotated their 3S and had a harder throw. Besides, if there is one thing Moskvina is really good at is making sure her teams have the highest levels possible.

  13. #43
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    Kavaguti, imo, skates like a wind-up doll, and Smirnov skates in a separate competition. They have absolutely NO RAPPORT with each other. However, the Tech was fine.

    Evora/Ladwiq did a nice job and I hope got a bit of reputation here because so much of Pairs is connected to reputation.

  14. #44
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  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by smia View Post
    Some Russian dance teams are overscored, true, but Russian pairs? See how Iliushechkina/Maisuradze were dumped at Cup of China after winning Skate Canada. Even at Skate Canada they were a bit underscored, getting lower PCS than Moore-Towers/Moscovitch is just fishy. Moore-Towers doesn't even come close to Iliushechkina. Generalizing a bit but Russian pairs tend to have the lines, the elegance and style that happens to be rare in pair skating, that's why they tend to get good scores. Besides some Russian teams, there's Savchenko/Szolkowy and Takahashi/Tran who are very polished but most pairs look a bit sloppy.
    Anyway before you criticise the scoring for Russian pairs perhaps you should look at the scoring for pairs from your own country. Pang/Tong: unextended lift positions, their spins also don't have great positions and unison needs work, and she has wierd posture. And I've also seen it mentioned that their skating is scratchy although I'm not in a position to judge. In any case, they get huge PCS scores as if there's nothing they need to work on. I'm sorry but a great smile is not enough to justify those kinds of presentation scores. Same thing with Shen/Zhao. 2004 Worlds, they botched a lift yet got a stream of 6.0s. At the Olympics they again botched a lift and had poor spins and again got scores as if they'd been perfect.
    I was at Cup of China, and I/M weren't "dumped," they simply weren't quite as good as the ones that ended up in front of them at that particular competition. I thought the placements were correct, based on what I saw. And nobody was clean or perfect. BTW, I may be based in Beijing but am not Chinese, so can only just shrug at the "...scoring for pairs from your own country..." comment and follow-on.

    At this stage of the season, strong clean pairs programs are usually pretty uncommon but of course get better as the season progresses. I didn't find G/E's lines, posture, etc. to make up for their deficiencies. I find their SP music blah and boring, and their rendition is pretty much in keeping with same. E/L had their issues, but the overall package presented should have scored higher than G/E. We'll see what the FS brings...

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