Could Lysacek repeat as Olympic Champion? | Golden Skate

Could Lysacek repeat as Olympic Champion?

pangtongfan

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Jun 16, 2010
If Evan returns to competitive skating what are his chances of defending his Olympic title in 2014. I personally think he would have a great chance and probably be the skater to beat. This would make him the first skater since Dick Button to manage the feat.
 

pangtongfan

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Jun 16, 2010
:laugh: You are so funny. Well, bring it on.

How many times has Evan proven his critics wrong. People laughed at the idea of him even ever winning Worlds only 2 years ago. After his World bronze in 2005 most said it was a huge fluke, yet he nearly medals at the Olympics (even with bombing the SP) and medals at the next Worlds. After being 3rd at Nationals in 2009 everyone laughed at the idea of him even winning another medal of any color at Worlds ever again. And if all Evan has to beat is Chan with 5 falls, since apparently nobody else today can, then he might actually have it pretty easy to win if things stay like they are now.
 

ImaginaryPogue

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Joined
Jun 3, 2009
If Evan returns to competitive skating what are his chances of defending his Olympic title in 2014. I personally think he would have a great chance and probably be the skater to beat. This would make him the first skater since Dick Button to manage the feat.

Taking it seriously.

No, I don't think it is plausible.

a) The recent revamp in rules was due to a quadless champion. Given that he's lost the quad, what are the odds of him actually getting one back for Sochi? And what are the odds of a quadless champion? The new rules in place for Vancouver means that Plushenko is the two time OGM, fwiw.

b) This presumes that the current field doesn't improve beyond what we're seeing now: that Chan doesn't gain (regain?) a level of consistency in international competition. Returns are rare, and rarely successful. Plushenko's was successful for a number of reasons, not least of which was the dearth of depth in Russian men. The USA doesn't have that lack.

c) Lysacek won over a mediocre competition. His Worlds victory was clear and deserving, but I think you've given him a reputation for dominance he simply doesn't have.
 

evangeline

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Nov 7, 2007
pangtongfan, you're just trolling at this point, aren't you? :laugh:

On a more serious note, Lysacek came to win his Olympic gold only in a perfect storm of certain circumstances: his rivals were mostly either too injured and/or washed up by the time the Olympics rolled around, and the younger generation were just coming onto the scene and not quite ready yet.

Even so, Lysacek only won by a measly point or so despite having the competition to him practically delivered on a platter.

In fact, I think Plushenko, despite his current ineligibility and the fact that he'll be ancient by 2014, will have more of a chance to win the 2014 Olympic gold than Lysacek (and I really don't think Plushenko has much of a chance at all).
 

seniorita

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Jun 3, 2008
This would make him the first skater since Dick Button to manage the feat.

I m sure Mr Button will be t h r i l l e d....literally

On more serious note, I ll start rooting for Chan right about now!
 

Tonichelle

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Jun 27, 2003
Even so, Lysacek only won by a measly point or so despite having the competition to him practically delivered on a platter.

That's because when he skated his LP he was skating for silver. You could tell in his body language that he pretty much thought Plushenko had the gold in the bag. His shock when it was announced that he won kinda proved that.

That being said - my selfish desire is that Evan would come back and defend his title making him the first man since Dick Button and all. Could he do it? It'd be a huge feat no matter who it was. Evan isn't as well liked as some of the others, but IF he were able to stay injury free (not likely with his body's track record.) and play his cards right he could at least be on the podium.
 

seniorita

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Jun 3, 2008
That being said - my selfish desire is that Evan would come back and defend his title making him the first man since Dick Button and all. Could he do it? It'd be a huge feat no matter who it was.

hmm, so you were also thrilled in the prospect of someone else repeating it in Vancouver?;)

I, for one, will immediately commence sacrificing a goat everyday for Daisuke Takahashi to continue skating until 2014.
Thats cool idea, my grandad has plenty of goats! I ll start doing the same for Dai if he is to continue, he deserves a second medal. MAybe I choose another animal cause otherwise i foresee goat species in extiction? :) :)
 

Jaana

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Jul 27, 2003
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c) Lysacek won over a mediocre competition.

What makes an event mediocre? Besides, it definetely is not Lysacek´s (or any champion´s) fault if his nearest competitors were not able to give better performances, LOL.

About Evan competing in next Olympics, I doubt it. Besides, he would be 28 or something like that. Of course a lot would depend on his health and on the fact whether the injury he has been suffering from would be totally healed and he could start practicing the quad seriously again. If that could happen, he sure might have a chance to be on the podium.
 
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Tonichelle

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hmm, so you were also thrilled in the prospect of someone else repeating it in Vancouver?;)

The history of it, no matter who it is/was, yes is exciting and I'd love to see it. That being said I want to see it being deserved on that night, not on reputation... which is what I was worried was going to happen in Vancouver.
 

seniorita

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Jun 3, 2008
The history of it, no matter who it is/was, yes is exciting and I'd love to see it. That being said I want to see it being deserved on that night, not on reputation... which is what I was worried was going to happen in Vancouver.
I guess reputation wont happen in Sochi then, as much as it didnt happen tn Vancouver :)..and you wont need to worry
Anyway that was funny thread, but there is only so much humor I can take.:cool:
 

gmyers

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Mar 6, 2010
I was just googling something having to do with Lysacek and 2009 worlds and the columnist for the NY Daily News who covered figure skating wrote that Lysacek neeeded a quad to win the title -that it was ridiculous to even consider Lysacek winning without a quad and everyone knows what happened there! I am skeptical of the quads will be necessary in 2014 talk because talk of the quad being necessary ever since the adoption of COP hasn't panned out. Worlds 2008 with Buttle and worlds 2009 with Lysacek and Olympics 2010 with Lysacek and kind of Takahashi 2010 worlds. Right now because of the rule changes more quads are being done but they are still really hard to do! Extrememly hard to do and it was only Cup of Russia but Tomas Verner. The system just isn't set up in such a way that quads are necessary. It is all up o the skaters. Like judges at the 2002 Olympics had it so that all the medalists did quads. That was the standard. Will COP in 2014 require quads to win the Olympics? It can't be said that it will! It is up to the skaters to do them. Could Lysacek win the Olympics again quadlessly? I don't see why that's an impossibility. Look at the ultra conservatism that swept men's skating during the 2009-2010 season. Who is to say that ultra conservatism quadless mindset wont happen again? Quads are hard and you may fall a lot and if you want judges to see you as great and give you Olympic gold you should be clean as much as possible. Ultra conservatism could win the day again and there is Lysacek with his clean quadless Olympic gold from 2010 winning again in 2014 in a possible similar ultra conservative environment. Now with the Olympics being Russia would that make skaters more likely to do quads? will it even matter a little? Maybe not if the same ultra conservatism sweeps the sport again.
 

janetfan

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May 15, 2009
I guess reputation wont happen in Sochi then, as much as it didnt happen tn Vancouver :)..and you wont need to worry
Anyway that was funny thread, but there is only so much humor I can take.:cool:

If Plushy could not defend his title I doubt that Evan could either. But Evan could probably comeback and win Silver the same as Plushy did :biggrin: ;)
 
Joined
Aug 16, 2009
This thread was worth it just for the image of someone making a burnt offering on Daisuke's behalf. It's grueling at work today, but I'll get through it with a laugh, thanks to that.

If someone at the office asks me what I'm chuckling about, what on earth will I say?
 

herios

Medalist
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Jan 25, 2004
Worst thread I've ever seen in my life.

Worst thread ever and PangTongfan is really ...bored!

At almost 30, a male skater will not be able to land day in day out that well all his jumps, like a 20-25 year old. That is life.
You cannot fight biology, no matter how determined you are.
 

Nadine

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Oct 3, 2003
I originally thought you were a troll, pangtonfan, but your posts since have proven me wrong. You are just very opinionated like several of us on here, lol, and I enjoy your threads, especially the last one, which had me writing a thesis! :laugh:

Now as to this other excellent thread question you pose, I say most definitely "YES". Evan is the hardest working male skater out there and I don't see why he cannot come back in 4 yrs. and try to reclaim his Olympic Title, just as others throughout history have tried to do so as well (e.g. Brian Boitano & Evgeni Plushenko). But my only concern for him, as I mentioned in that other thread last month, is will he be able to keep up his work ethic? Because it seems to me he won because of his incredible work ethic to the point of OCD (similar to Tara Lipinski), so imho his only obstacle would be if he were *not* able to work as hard this time due to injury & age, as the constant repetitiveness of jumps must take their toll on the body, especially as one gets older. And in fact the only reason why I think Zhenya was able to come back after a 4-year layoff and do as well as he did (only missing the gold by 1 point) was because he is a natural athlete, and as a result could afford not to overwork his body. Which is why he landed a quad & 3Axel on his first time out in competition at COR in 2009.

I honestly would loooooooooooooooooove :love: to see a rematch of Evgeni & Evan at the next Olympics. It would be like two prize fighters going at it once again to see whom will win the Heavyweight Champion of the World Title this time around. :party: It would be one for the ages, just like this past Olympics was imho, but this time the setting would be in Russia, not North America/Canada.

As of now Evan has no competition in America imho nor the world truth be told, none can match his consistency, or his ability to study the COP to such a fault that he knows how to make it work to his advantage (i.e. putting most of his jumps in the second half of the program in order to earn bonus points, tacking on doubles here & there to earn even more points, etc.). And constructing a program that plays to his strengths & gets the crowd involved. That's his winning formula imho, and that's what his nemesis Evgeni Plushenko must watch out for this time around ~ to learn from Evan ~ to create a program that plays to his strengths like Nijinsky did, and most importantly to study the COP to a fault the same way Evan has. Tomas Verner has also learned from Evan's winning formula this season, and is winning competitions by doing the exact same jumps, et al, that Evan has. If he had done this last year he might've been the Olympic Champion. His attempt at quads only caused inconsistency, better to skate a clean program imho, and this goes for ALL the skaters! :)

p.s. that said, I worry too about Zhenya's body holding up this time around as well. He's 3 yrs. older than Evan, and he plans to skate all three years this time leading up to Sochi in 2014. I hope he & Mishin take it very very carefully, only doing COR/Rostelecom Cup, Nationals, Euros, and Worlds (4 competitions per year). If he can just maintain the jumps he has now that should be enough to medal, but most importantly he N-E-E-D-S a program like Nijinsky!!!! The very best competitions are when everybody skates their best and you win (just ask Evan). :)
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
What makes an event mediocre? Besides, it definetely is not Lysacek´s (or any champion´s) fault if his nearest competitors were not able to give better performances, LOL.

About Evan competing in next Olympics, I doubt it. Besides, he would be 28 or something like that. Of course a lot would depend on his health and on the fact whether the injury he has been suffering from would be totally healed and he could start practicing the quad seriously again. If that could happen, he sure might have a chance to be on the podium.

1. No one is arguing that it's Evan's fault the competition didn't live up to the hype. Definitely not. I happen to think his OGM was deserved and was glad he won in that battle.

2. What makes an event mediocre? When very few of the talent skates at or near their best. Lambiel? Every jump was a struggle. Chan? The injury, the coaching change, the pressure all got to him. Takahashi? Fell. Plushenko? The fact that he came so close after three seasons of not competing is remarkable, but only in a disappointing crop would that be possible (counterpoint: Midori Ito, 1995-96 competition).

I was just googling something having to do with Lysacek and 2009 worlds and the columnist for the NY Daily News who covered figure skating wrote that Lysacek neeeded a quad to win the title -that it was ridiculous to even consider Lysacek winning without a quad and everyone knows what happened there! I am skeptical of the quads will be necessary in 2014 talk because talk of the quad being necessary ever since the adoption of COP hasn't panned out. Worlds 2008 with Buttle and worlds 2009 with Lysacek and Olympics 2010 with Lysacek and kind of Takahashi 2010 worlds. Right now because of the rule changes more quads are being done but they are still really hard to do! Extrememly hard to do and it was only Cup of Russia but Tomas Verner. The system just isn't set up in such a way that quads are necessary. It is all up o the skaters. Like judges at the 2002 Olympics had it so that all the medalists did quads. That was the standard. Will COP in 2014 require quads to win the Olympics? It can't be said that it will! It is up to the skaters to do them. Could Lysacek win the Olympics again quadlessly? I don't see why that's an impossibility. Look at the ultra conservatism that swept men's skating during the 2009-2010 season. Who is to say that ultra conservatism quadless mindset wont happen again? Quads are hard and you may fall a lot and if you want judges to see you as great and give you Olympic gold you should be clean as much as possible. Ultra conservatism could win the day again and there is Lysacek with his clean quadless Olympic gold from 2010 winning again in 2014 in a possible similar ultra conservative environment. Now with the Olympics being Russia would that make skaters more likely to do quads? will it even matter a little? Maybe not if the same ultra conservatism sweeps the sport again.

gmyers, a lot is said here, so I'm gonna try to parse it a little.

a) The reason quads didn't matter wasn't because of COP. It was because the quad skaters were either too injured (Takakashi, Lambiel) or prone to making mistakes (Joubert, Takahashi, Verner) or ignored virtually everything else about skating (Plushenko).

b) The ISU really didn't like the fact that the champion didn't have a quad. So they made the quads worth more, some other triples a little less and penalized the mistaken quads a little less as well.

c) Question: Do they backtrack now? I don't think they do. Two skaters (Brezina and Reynolds) have talked about doing TWO quads in the short program, and Reynolds' has clearly attemtped to do that. Skaters that didn't have the quad and maybe still don't are working their collective tale to get it. Mroz is now a Nationals contender because he has the quad. We'll see at the GPF. The top four men could land quads.
 
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