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Thread: Men's Free Skate - 12/11

  1. #61
    - * - blue_idealist's Avatar
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    Haha, this time Patrick Chan actually deserved to win! It was really out of the ordinary that Daisuke would fall twice, and once on a non-jump. Too bad Nobu fell too. I hate Florent Amodio's crotch-grabbing.

  2. #62
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    I guess I'm not surprised. Dai was injured and Oda has to totally be clean or the other skaters (Taka, Chan etc) have to self implode for him to win. He just doesn't have the presence to beat these guys if he's not clean.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by seniorita View Post
    Contesti??? How so? have you seen his last season and this one so far, his scores? He is not a medal contender, since the time he won a medal at Euros in 2008-2009 season I havent seen him on top of his game. Only at Filandia trophy he skated sort of well. And judges have dropped him. I would add Schultheiss rather Contesti on the Euro list.
    Brezina is still injured , i dont know if he is back on ice. But he was watching GPF.
    Yeah Contesti isn't a medal threat at Worlds, at least not this season when the field is so deep. He may have a shot to medal at Euros though depending on how Joubert and Brezina are skating by then.

    Even though Verner didn't skate his best here, that's his 3rd solid FS of the season which is encouraging. Also he got +GOE on both his 3a which is good news because I know sometimes that jump is a bit skary for him. I think he has a very good chance of winning Euros this year, or at least medaling there, and he might not even need to quad to do it if he can keep skating consistently in the LP.

    Amodio was also not his best but was quite good in the FS for the 3rd time this season and also looks poised to medal going into Europeans. I also think at Euros he will get a bit of a PCS boost because he will be one of the best skaters in that field and won't be competing against skaters as strong as most of the ones here there.

    Even though the 2 Europeans were 5th and 6th, I think it was impressive they both made the final and actually think they are in a good position going into Euros. They both skated pretty well here, but they know they can do better which will probably push them to up the training intensity going into Euros and be ready to lay it all down there. I mean do others agree? Or do you think Verner and Amodio placing 5th and 6th here will hurt them and serve as a red flag going into Euros?
    Last edited by silverlake22; 12-11-2010 at 02:52 PM.

  4. #64
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    This is wonderful news.

    Is there any doubt now that a clean Chan will not be beaten ?

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigJohn View Post
    This is wonderful news.

    Is there any doubt now that a clean Chan will not be beaten ?
    Based on the scores Chan has received for subpar skates this season, I don't think anyone ever doubted that a clean Chan can be beaten.

    Whether they agree with this in principle, however, is another matter.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigJohn View Post
    This is wonderful news.

    Is there any doubt now that a clean Chan will not be beaten ?
    Wasn't Chan clean in the SP, and beaten by Oda?

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by evangeline View Post
    Based on the scores Chan has received for subpar skates this season, I don't think anyone ever doubted that a clean Chan can be beaten.

    Whether they agree with this in principle, however, is another matter.
    Could it be that some people don't really like skating?

  8. #68
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    Chan deserved to win this time. But Score? Just a complete joke. PCS 87, haha . Chan's performance never touches my heart as Dai's or Jeremy's do.
    Why it is not reflected in PCS? Can we get old " Artistic Impression" back?

    BTW, it is clear that Dai's injury is much more severe than he admits. I can see it from his skating this time. So hard to watch.
    I hope he takes care of himself well so that he can skate at

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigJohn View Post
    Could it be that some people don't really like skating?
    Or could it be that some people are tired of snide insinuations that they are too unsophisticated (or lack the sufficient Deep and Profound Knowledge of CoP and skating) to understand Chan's greatness?

  10. #70
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    Sorry, my last sentence should have said, so that he can skate at the nationals in perfect condition.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue_idealist View Post
    Wasn't Chan clean in the SP, and beaten by Oda?
    I meant for the whole competition.

    Quote Originally Posted by evangeline View Post
    Or could it be that some people are tired of snide insinuations that they are too unsophisticated (or lack the sufficient Deep and Profound Knowledge of CoP and skating) to understand Chan's greatness?
    I did not insinuate anything, but I'll admit that it was implied.

  12. #72
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    Protocols say that Takahashi tried to go for a quad flip like he did at worlds. He was trying to do something to get back up in the standings.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by genki View Post
    Chan's performance never touches my heart as Dai's or Jeremy's do.
    Why it is not reflected in PCS? Can we get old " Artistic Impression" back?
    I hear what you're saying, but what touches one person's heart can be quite different from what touches another's. Very subjective.

    Also, I don't have any nostalgia for 6.0. It was more intuitive for the audience, but the subjectivity created incredible scope for manipulation. In ice dance, remember when placements in the CD (which were generally based on prior rankings, dues paid, etc.) dictated placements in all of the remaining competition segments, regardless of how anyone executed on the day?

    In singles, it was a little better, since errors are more obvious to the general audience, but artistic impression marks were routinely used to prop up skaters on the basis of their reputation (and other factors). The new judging system will continue to be refined over time, but 6.0 was a mess.
    Just think - what if the Internet and chat boards like this one had made worldwide mass communication between fans possible back in the heyday of 6.0? There would have been a firestorm of outrage over many of the results.

    Also, regarding Chan's marks - whether or not he touches a particular person's heart (he may touch another's), his programs are jam-packed with moves that allow him to accumulate points under the marking system. And it's tough to do...level 4 spins and footwork, jumps with difficult entrances, transitions galore...not everyone can pull that off (not even him, so he makes his share of errors too). But I don't think people should blame him for understanding the marking system, packing a lot of difficulty into his programs and scoring well as a result.

  14. #74
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    A lot of people seem really frustrated by the fact that Chan's posted near record breaking scores. I thought it was worth mentioning that...

    1. Quad toes are now worth 1.3 points MORE than they were when Takahashi posted his score.
    2. Triple Axels are worth 1 point more.
    3. That despite the loss of the level-step sequence, the raising of GOE's for the choreographed step sequence means that it's potentially a HUGE points earner, regardless.

    So Chan's working with about a five point advantage. Then mention the fact that judges are clearly more comfortable operating within the higher regions of the PCS (three teams scoring tens last year) and the general fact that points trend upwards in general, this skate would probably be a good 8-10 points behind Takahashi's were they compared on the same system/playing field.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by evangeline View Post
    Or could it be that some people are tired of snide insinuations that they are too unsophisticated (or lack the sufficient Deep and Profound Knowledge of CoP and skating) to understand Chan's greatness?
    I wish there was a signature option again, I would put this in mine right away, voila.take a goat for this. First thing my sister-who is more casual viewer- noticed once is that fs audience is rather snobbish comparing to the gymnastics one.Mocking someone for his preferences in a sport is far from sophisticated attitude in my book.
    I watched the vids again on youtube, Dai is Mr Personality for me, and demands attention like none. Falls and all, he is unique, I dont feel he is checking the boxes just. Kozuka is just a joy to watch, he skates free and he is so special in the way he moves. I also enjoned Amodio's Lp, while it is nothing like last season the boy has presence and flies there. He is my fav to win euros. I probably enjoy his skating cause Iam shallow and uneducuted by the einstein's standars of posters here.
    I want to see the scientifc survey for the idiocity that has been implied here many times that female audience in figure skating is satisfied with pelevic thrusts and all that, and appreciates skates like Dai's or Joubs sp for example for this reason and their programs are worthy to collect the girl audience screams, and male audience are all for the rachmaninofs and gershwins.

    Quote Originally Posted by silverlake22 View Post
    Even though the 2 Europeans were 5th and 6th, I think it was impressive they both made the final and actually think they are in a good position going into Euros. They both skated pretty well here, but they know they can do better which will probably push them to up the training intensity going into Euros and be ready to lay it all down there. I mean do others agree? Or do you think Verner and Amodio placing 5th and 6th here will hurt them and serve as a red flag going into Euros?
    I agree. And I think it is a good thing their GPF participation and it only adds, they had a decent skate against the top of world right now that is Chan, Oda, Dai and Kozuka. I mean these 4 skaters it was clear in Gp series they are the frontrunners. I think also VErner might win euros this year. And Amodio seems more consistent under Morozov coaching, he has done huge steps in that aspect since last season, and the whole touring in the off season did miracles to his confidence, and judges seem to like him, he is a crowd favorite also, I m sure at Euros he will rock the arena. Besides the whole field is not so deep, apart from Joubert, Brezina, Tomas and Amodio it is only Fernandez and Schults, I dont think Contesti, KVDP and Brentsson are contenders for podium unless there is a massive bombing. And i dont know who Russia will sent, I guess Arthur and who else? Voronov or Borodulin health issues I dont know them.
    Last edited by seniorita; 12-11-2010 at 05:14 PM.

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