Men's Free Skate - 12/11

[SkateFiguring]

Interesting notes and perspectives from Oda.

[ImaginaryPogue]

Takahashi's thoughts

Man, this part was a little heartbreaking

" Kozuka accidentally clattered into Takahashi and sent him crashing to the ice during practice on Thursday and was on the verge of tears during Saturday's press conference, blaming himself for what he believed had damaged Takahashi's bid for glory.

But speaking to Kyodo News after taking part in Sunday's closing exhibition, Takahashi, who was left with a sore neck and lower back, insisted he only had himself to blame for failing to land the title.

"I had the chance to win the final but I blew it and this has made me painfully aware that I'm not a good enough skater. I've just got to regroup and put in the work in practice," said Takahashi. "

I really do hope this was a translating miscue or something. And Kozuka's sadness is heartwrending.

[mot]

ImaginaryPogue

As for Daisuke's comment, it doesn't sound as bad in Japanese as it does in English. It's a cultural difference, I think, that cannot translate well sometimes. He just meant he should be better than what he is now and needs to work harder and improve. It's very classy of him to own it all up and not to make the accident an excuse for his sub-par performance at GPF though. He's always like that - rarely self-congratulatory and makes no excuses for poor performances - and that's the reason why he is well respected in Japan.

Yes, Takahiko seems to be blaming himself too harshly for what really was an unfortunate accident, even in Japanese standard. Poor soul. He once said he was influenced a lot by Daisuke while spending time with each other in Vancouver - they shared a room in the athlete village, and Daisuke called Takahiko 'Japan's hope for Sochi' in one of their TV appearances. They seem pretty close and he must have read / heard Daisuke's interview, in which he said he was really hoping to win the GPF title this season as it was one of the two remaining titles he hasn't won in his career.

[Layfan]

ImaginaryPogue

As for Daisuke's comment, it doesn't sound as bad in Japanese as it does in English. It's a cultural difference, I think, that cannot translate well sometimes. He just meant he should be better than what he is now and needs to work harder and improve. It's very classy of him to own it all up and not to make the accident an excuse for his sub-par performance at GPF though. He's always like that - rarely self-congratulatory and makes no excuses for poor performances - and that's the reason why he is well respected in Japan.

Yes, Takahiko seems to be blaming himself too harshly for what really was an unfortunate accident, even in Japanese standard. Poor soul. He once said he was influenced a lot by Daisuke while spending time with each other in Vancouver - they shared a room in the athlete village, and Daisuke called Takahiko 'Japan's hope for Sochi' in one of their TV appearances. They seem pretty close and he must have read / heard Daisuke's interview, in which he said he was really hoping to win the GPF title this season as it was one of the two remaining titles he hasn't won in his career.

Awwww. Those two guys have totally won me over. At least Daisuke is an Olympic bronze medalist and a world champion forever. ... maybe a two-time world champion ... hopefully. Fingers crossed. Go Dai!!!

[Tinymavy15]

Awwww. Those two guys have totally won me over. At least Daisuke is an Olympic bronze medalist and a world champion forever. ... maybe a two-time world champion ... hopefully. Fingers crossed. Go Dai!!!

What class from both men. Here's hoping they go 1/2 at worlds.

[genki]

I hear what you're saying, but what touches one person's heart can be quite different from what touches another's. Very subjective.

It is only subjenctive when two performance compared are very close in quality. For example, which performance touches peoples' heart more, or let's say draws in audience more? D/W' or V/M? This is very subjunctive, if you ask 100 people, you may get 50/50.

But Chan's and Dai's. ? I agree Chan's program is choreographed well and packed with difficult moves, but he does not skate to the audience, He does not draw audience in as much as Dai does. It is not only my opinion , but i know many others agree with me.

Please compare these two and let me know what you think. Which one draws you in?

Dai's phantom
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m1627N_mJDc

Chan;s phantom
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3DX6q-HELU

[Tinymavy15]

Dai's phanton easily. Of course it helps that his music cuts are much more dramatic and effective.

[stickle]

I watched the two videos and I have to say I liked both programs. It was hard not to be influenced by the commentators who during Dai's performance were falling all over themselves saying how wonderful it was while during Chan's they sang a completely different tune. I didn't see Dai doing anything to draw the audience in. It looked to me like he was completely skating within himself which is what such a dramatic performance requires. He wasn't playing to the audience and smiling and playing them up. Neither was Patrick. They both looked pretty similar to me in that regard.

I was more drawn to Patrick's performance because I like his skating more. He's lighter on his feet and in his body demeanor than Dai was and his arm movement is in context to the character he's portraying whereas I find Dai an arm waver which has always annoyed me regardless of who the skater is. Patrick's spins were way better than Dai's in these videos and Patrick has more difficult content between the jumps. For sure, this was a marvelous performance by Dai and I don't mean to diminish it but you asked which one we preferred and I prefer Patrick's.

[skatinginbc]

I hope that somebody here can give me some counseling. I have eagerly defended for Patrick Chan in the past, but tonight I watched a special interview on CTV Face Time about Johnny Weir, who explicitly stated that he disliked Chan and would love to smack him on the face. That statement profoundly changed my attitude. All of a sudden, I realize why so many people would watch Chan's performance through colored glasses, and I am now one of them and can no longer appreciate his skating in the same way as I did. And the worst of all, there is an evil part of me wishing for his demise in his skating career. Gosh, it is so hard to just watch skating without projecting personal bias into it.

[bigsisjiejie]

^^ My counsel: watch less skating and more Lady GaGa.

[sunny0760]

skatinginbc, I don't know what you mean. What do you expect from a barely 20 year old, talented skater whom you don't know personally?

I don' know Chan either but I have my own impression about him and I will stick to it until something drastic happens. I am sure it will not be about what Johnny Weir says or does not say.

He is a wholesome and smart guy, I believe. Yes, I know he brought some controversies before.(Maybe because he was too honest, not careful enough. Or his management was not competent enough... or what media translates is always distorting facts to a degree.)

http://www.postcity.com/Post-City-Ma.../Patrick-Chan/
I think that when someone says that Patrick is a wonderful role model for all Canadians, he means it.

http://www.absoluteskating.com/interviews/2010chan.html
And when Patrick himself says he wants to make people happy, his words are genuine, I think.

And it makes me a little sad to know that people are upset, that they are not happy with my skating, because the whole reason I skate is to make people happy. I want people to look up to me and remember me as a good skater...

This makes me a little sad too, having read many harsh comments here and there.
I am certainly one of those who are happy with his skating, especially with winning the GPF.

[Tonichelle]

i guess my council would be todecide for yourself and dont let an attention hog do your thinking. Johnny was giving a sure to be used soundbite just like he used to do about evan. i am not a fan of chan because of what CHAN has said not what orhers have said about him.

[treeloving]

ImaginaryPogue

As for Daisuke's comment, it doesn't sound as bad in Japanese as it does in English. It's a cultural difference, I think, that cannot translate well sometimes. He just meant he should be better than what he is now and needs to work harder and improve. It's very classy of him to own it all up and not to make the accident an excuse for his sub-par performance at GPF though. He's always like that - rarely self-congratulatory and makes no excuses for poor performances - and that's the reason why he is well respected in Japan.

Yes, Takahiko seems to be blaming himself too harshly for what really was an unfortunate accident, even in Japanese standard. Poor soul. He once said he was influenced a lot by Daisuke while spending time with each other in Vancouver - they shared a room in the athlete village, and Daisuke called Takahiko 'Japan's hope for Sochi' in one of their TV appearances. They seem pretty close and he must have read / heard Daisuke's interview, in which he said he was really hoping to win the GPF title this season as it was one of the two remaining titles he hasn't won in his career.

I respect these two guys more and more!!!

[let`s talk]

Yes, Takahiko seems to be blaming himself too harshly for what really was an unfortunate accident, even in Japanese standard. Poor soul. He once said he was influenced a lot by Daisuke while spending time with each other in Vancouver - they shared a room in the athlete village, and Daisuke called Takahiko 'Japan's hope for Sochi' in one of their TV appearances. They seem pretty close and he must have read / heard Daisuke's interview, in which he said he was really hoping to win the GPF title this season as it was one of the two remaining titles he hasn't won in his career.

"Kozuka blamed himself for Takahashi's performance, believing their accidental collision in training earlier in the week had led to his sub-par performance.

"I am happy to be on the podium at the Grand Prix final again but I feel I messed things up for Takahashi," said Kozuka. "I apologized to him and he said not to worry about it. I will have to take a bit more care in the future."

Takahashi said, "That was my worst performance of the season. I didn't practice enough and my legs really felt it. I couldn't control anything and now I have to really work hard as there is not a lot of time between now and the national championship." (from japantoday)

What a gentelmanship! I am kind of tired of reading mean comments coming from some falling winners. How refreshing to see such a grace coming from real Men.

[Kinga]

It is only subjenctive when two performance compared are very close in quality. For example, which performance touches peoples' heart more, or let's say draws in audience more?(...) Chan's or Dai's. ? I agree Chan's program is choreographed well and packed with difficult moves, but he does not skate to the audience, He does not draw audience in as much as Dai does. It is not only my opinion , but i know many others agree with me.

Please compare these two and let me know what you think. Which one draws you in?

I am not so sure about the whole 'drawing in the audience' issue to be so crucial. Some people are showmen and interact with audience, some are not, but they can still be very interesting to watch, very elegant and 'artistic' (could not think of a better word now). Some skaters connect well with audience, by smiling, posing, projecting, some other are more introverted and try to connect with audience by subtle effects of their movements. Thank God there is variety. I would not want everyone to be a showman. I personally prefer this introvertic type of skating, where I discover so many nuances of the movements rather than being 'distracted' with overall strong effects of 'projecting' that sometimes hide/replace the most essential parts of the program. And actually such skaters (like Jeff Buttle, Jeremy Abbott, Kozuka and Chan) draw me in their skating more than those charismatic and showman-like (let say Joubert and Takahashi). But to each of his own and as I said, I am happy that both types of skaters exist.

Yeah, Patrick doesn't really use the music all that well. he skates to it, but with no real emotion or understanding of it.

Hmmmm, what makes you think that he does not understand the music?? I am always so confused when I see a comment like that. Not understanding the music equalls a totally dull performance. Occassionally there are a very very empty performances that include just skating from one board to the other and everyone can see that this particular skater totally ignores the music (and this mostly concerns rather week skaters that have never made any significant careers). But I think it is a huge stretch to say something like that about Patrick. His performances are in completely different league than those poor interpretation-wise programs. Some can still argue that he is not the master of interpretation, but saying that he is totally dull in this area is just too much.


But probably I enjoy his skating (and POTO) cause Iam shallow and uneducuted by the einstein's standars of posters here.