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Thread: Japanese Nationals Dec. 24 to 26

  1. #466
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Wow I didnt realize Miki received that many points for GOE on her non jump elements. That is indeed absurd (and yes I did see her performance). It is clear the Japanese federation sees her as there #1 over Mao and trying to politik her with ridiculous scores. I guess they dont trust Mao totally again yet.

    I guess I was being kind to Miki. She probably didnt deserve to win over Mao at all, all things considered.
    Well maybe not by 8 points or so. But by 1-2 points is reasonable. Mao left a lot of points on the table. two footed 3A, no Lutzs, double salcow and no 3+2+2 combo. I think maybe JFS, let Miki win so it will give Mao motivation to ontinue to work on her jumps technique. Lets face it, Miki maybe not be the most talented one in term of non jump wise, but she sure work hard to be above average.

  2. #467
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    I don't understand all this disdain for Miki. I prefer Mao but Miki had 6 ratified triples compared to Mao's two-footed 3A, flutz, two flips and doubled salchow. Yes, Mao has better spins and choreography but Miki clearly outjumped her and deserved to win. Probably not by 10 points - Miki should have won by only a handful, but still the victory was deserving.

  3. #468
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    Quote Originally Posted by wonderlen3000 View Post
    Well maybe not by 8 points or so. But by 1-2 points is reasonable. Mao left a lot of points on the table. two footed 3A, no Lutzs, double salcow and no 3+2+2 combo. I think maybe JFS, let Miki win so it will give Mao motivation to ontinue to work on her jumps technique. Lets face it, Miki maybe not be the most talented one in term of non jump wise, but she sure work hard to be above average.
    Plus I'm sure the JSF can't ignore the fact that Miki has been scoring well internationally. Her last two FS has scored her 120+ and she's currently No. 5 on the Season's best list.

  4. #469
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Funny how things work out. Since the 1968 Olympics Emmerich Danzer has had a full and admirable life both in and out of skating. Schwarz is in prison for kidnapping women in eastern Europe for prostitution.

    Lol, Mathman you use the same words as Olympia did, but hers was in regard to Sarah Hughes.

    Btw, I also noted that about Wolfgang Schwarz, but didn't feel it was appropriate to mention it.

    On a *positive* note, regards two of three Olympic Champions that did not win their Nationals (btw I'm not including Paul Wylie, as they did on the US Nationals thread, because he was never an Olympic Champion to begin with):

    Alexei Yagudin returned to Russia in 2005 and settled in his hometown of St. Petersburg, and is now engaged/married to another Olympic Champion, Tatiana Totmianina, and they have one beautiful daughter together, Elizaveta. He also tours and performs regularly throughout the world. p.s. and on another +++ note he & Zhenya have long settled their rivalry, with Alexei even being in attendance when Evgeni came back to skate at Rostelecom Cup last year, cheering him on in the stands, and also predicting that he will be Olympic Champion in Sochi in 2014. (:^)

    Sarah Hughes graduated from Yale University in May, 2009, with a degree in American studies with a concentration in US politics & communities. She also took one year off from college to tour with SOI. And she's only 25 yrs. old, her book is yet to be written, which incidentally just may include getting engaged/married to Andrew Giuliani in future.


    Now back to Japanese Nationals, I'm a fan of both Miki & Mao, so am honestly pleased with how things turned out! Miki rightfully won, and Mao came back strong from a dismal GP series to win the silver medal! All's well that ends well. And Mao still has plenty of years ahead of her to attain her goal of winning Nationals 10 times, right now she has 4 of them, and she's only 20 yrs. old. Her book is yet to be written as well...

  5. #470
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    p.s. I've decided to stop, for now, looking up National Record Holders in Singles F.S. because there are way too many countries out there, seriously! Look here (scroll down to bottom where it mentions participating nations):

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Figure_...inter_Olympics

    What I did though, thus far, was look up countries that have medalled at either the Olympics or Worlds, or there was a familiar name I recalled. Still, if you are from a country wherein your National Champion has a history of longevity of 9/10/11+ wins, please feel free to add to the list. Thanks!

  6. #471
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    Mao didn't two-foot her 3A in the LP. Why have multiple people now said that? Here's the exact scores I would have given. You can list your protocols too! What fun.

    MAO ASADA
    1. 3A< --- 6.00 ---> +1 GOE ---> 7.00
    2. 3F+2Lo --- 7.10 ---> +1 GOE ---> 7.80
    3. 3Lz --- 6.00 ---> -1 goe ---> 5.30
    4. CCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> +2 GOE ---> 4.50
    5. 2A+2T --- 5.17x ---> +1 GOE ---> 5.67
    6. 3F+2Lo --- 7.81x ---> 0 GOE ---> 7.81
    7. ChSp1 --- 2.00 ---> +3 GOE ---> 5.00
    8. 2S --- 1.54x ---> 0 GOE ---> 1.54
    9. FSSp4 --- 3.00 ---> +1 GOE ---> 3.50
    10. SlSt3 --- 3.30 ---> +2 GOE ---> 4.30
    11. 3Lo --- 5.61x ---> +1 GOE ---> 6.31
    12. FCCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> +1 GOE ---> 4.00

    Skating Skills ---> 8.50
    Transitions/Linking Footwork/Movements ---> 7.75
    Performance/Execution ---> 8.25
    Choreography/Composition ---> 8.50
    Interpretation ---> 8.25

    Total Technical Score -- 62.73
    Total Program Components Score (factorized) -- 66.00

    TOTAL SCORE -- 128.73

    MIKI ANDO
    1. 3Lz+2Lo --- 7.80 ---> +1 GOE ---> 8.50
    2. 3Lo --- 5.10 ---> +1 GOE ---> 5.80
    3. FSSp4 --- 3.00 ---> 0 GOE ---> 3.00
    4. CCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> 0 GOE ---> 3.50
    5. ChSp1 --- 2.00 ---> 0 GOE ---> 2.00
    6. 2A+3T --- 8.14x ---> +1 GOE ---> 8.84
    7. 3Lz --- 6.60x ---> +1 GOE ---> 7.30
    8. 3S --- 4.62x ---> 0 GOE ---> 4.62
    9. 3T --- 4.51x ---> +1 GOE ---> 5.21
    10. 2A+2Lo+2Lo --- 7.59x ---> +1 GOE ---> 8.09
    11. SlSt2 --- 2.30 ---> +1 GOE ---> 2.80
    12. FCCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> 0 GOE ---> 3.50

    Skating Skills ---> 8.00
    Transitions/Linking Footwork/Movements ---> 7.50
    Performance/Execution ---> 7.75
    Choreography/Composition ---> 6.50
    Interpretation ---> 6.50

    Total Technical Score -- 63.16
    Total Program Components Score (factorized) -- 58.00

    TOTAL SCORE -- 121.16

  7. #472
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Mao didn't two-foot her 3A in the LP. Why have multiple people now said that? Here's the exact scores I would have given. You can list your protocols too! What fun.

    MAO ASADA
    1. 3A< --- 6.00 ---> +1 GOE ---> 7.00
    2. 3F+2Lo --- 7.10 ---> +1 GOE ---> 7.80
    3. 3Lz --- 6.00 ---> -1 goe ---> 5.30
    4. CCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> +2 GOE ---> 4.50
    5. 2A+2T --- 5.17x ---> +1 GOE ---> 5.67
    6. 3F+2Lo --- 7.81x ---> 0 GOE ---> 7.81
    7. ChSp1 --- 2.00 ---> +3 GOE ---> 5.00
    8. 2S --- 1.54x ---> 0 GOE ---> 1.54
    9. FSSp4 --- 3.00 ---> +1 GOE ---> 3.50
    10. SlSt3 --- 3.30 ---> +2 GOE ---> 4.30
    11. 3Lo --- 5.61x ---> +1 GOE ---> 6.31
    12. FCCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> +1 GOE ---> 4.00

    Skating Skills ---> 8.50
    Transitions/Linking Footwork/Movements ---> 7.75
    Performance/Execution ---> 8.25
    Choreography/Composition ---> 8.50
    Interpretation ---> 8.25

    Total Technical Score -- 62.73
    Total Program Components Score (factorized) -- 66.00

    TOTAL SCORE -- 128.73

    MIKI ANDO
    1. 3Lz+2Lo --- 7.80 ---> +1 GOE ---> 8.50
    2. 3Lo --- 5.10 ---> +1 GOE ---> 5.80
    3. FSSp4 --- 3.00 ---> 0 GOE ---> 3.00
    4. CCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> 0 GOE ---> 3.50
    5. ChSp1 --- 2.00 ---> 0 GOE ---> 2.00
    6. 2A+3T --- 8.14x ---> +1 GOE ---> 8.84
    7. 3Lz --- 6.60x ---> +1 GOE ---> 7.30
    8. 3S --- 4.62x ---> 0 GOE ---> 4.62
    9. 3T --- 4.51x ---> +1 GOE ---> 5.21
    10. 2A+2Lo+2Lo --- 7.59x ---> +1 GOE ---> 8.09
    11. SlSt2 --- 2.30 ---> +1 GOE ---> 2.80
    12. FCCoSp4 --- 3.50 ---> 0 GOE ---> 3.50

    Skating Skills ---> 8.00
    Transitions/Linking Footwork/Movements ---> 7.50
    Performance/Execution ---> 7.75
    Choreography/Composition ---> 6.50
    Interpretation ---> 6.50

    Total Technical Score -- 63.16
    Total Program Components Score (factorized) -- 58.00

    TOTAL SCORE -- 121.16
    I would agree with you here. Miki's jumps were good, but did not deserve +2 goes like she got. Her spins were acceptable, so 0s are enough, not the +1s and +2s she received. Miki's PCS should be lowest for choreo, because it is obviously just choreographed to do a bunch of stuff until the 2:00 mark, do 5 jumps and receive the 10% bonus. The score you gave Mao was similar to the score she received, which I would agree with, and the score you gave Miki better represented the program she skated.

  8. #473
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    Whether Miki deserved to win over Mao or not (and obviously there are varying opinions on that here) it seems we are all in agreement on one thing. Miki was clearly overscored even under inflated National scoring, and in no way deserved the huge margin of victory she had. The scoring was not accurate to performance and likely based on some alterior factors. It is a shame that suspect judging in singles continues to tarnish the credability of the sport as it has all season. I cant remember a season ever with either worse overall skating or even moreso worse judging in singles than 2010-2011.

  9. #474
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    Lol, since I'm iced in I decided to do a complete list of Figure Skating National Record Holders in ALL disciplines, as follows (btw here's my source of reference ~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...gure_skating):

    MEN

    Ivan Dinev (BULGARIA) = 14 (btw bio says 11, but Nationals site states 14; he's also the 1st Bulgarian to land a quad in competition and the 1st to medal at a GP event; he coaches now and is married to Angela Nikodinov of the USA).

    *Honorable Mentions with 11 =
    J. Ferguson Page (BRITISH)
    Oliver Honer (SWISS)
    Werner Rittberger (GERMANY; creator of the 3R jump).

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Carlo Fassi (ITALY)
    Nobuo Sato (JAPAN)
    Bo Mathander (SWEDISH)
    Hans Landh (SWEDISH)
    Alain Giletti (FRANCE)
    Laszlo Vajda (HUNGARY)
    Marcus Nikkanen (FINLAND)
    Gregor Urbas (SLOVENIA)
    Martin Stixrud (NORWAY; at 44 yrs. old he is the oldest person to ever win an Olympic Medal in an individual winter sport; he also coached Sonja Henie).

    WOMEN

    Vaike Paduri (ESTONIA) = 14.

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Gabriele Seyfert (EAST GERMANY; 1968 Olympic Silver Medalist)
    Andree Joly (FRANCE; 1928 & 1932 Olympic Gold Medalist in Pairs & 1924 Olympic Bronze Medalist in Pairs)
    Olga Vassiljeva (ESTONIA; btw bio says 4, but Nationals site states 10)
    Mojca Kopac (SLOVENIA)
    Tatiana Malinina (UZBEKISTAN)

    *Honorable Mentions with 9 =
    Maribel Vinson-Owen (USA; 1932 Olympic Bronze Medalist)
    Michelle Kwan (USA; 1998 Olympic Silver Medalist & 2002 Olympic Bronze Medalist)
    Chen Lu (CHINA; 1994 & 1998 Olympic Bronze Medalist; btw bio says 9, but Nationals site states 7 ?)
    Midori Ito (JAPAN; 1992 Olympic Silver Medalist)
    Surya Bonaly (FRANCE)
    Constance Wilson-Samuel (CANADA)
    Anne Karin Dehle (NORWAY)
    Karen Venhuizen (DUTCH)
    Julia Sebestyen (HUNGARY)
    Shirene Human (SOUTH AFRICA; btw bio says 10, but Nationals site states 9)

    PAIRS

    Danielle Carr-McGrath/Stephen Carr (AUSTRALIA) = 19

    *Honorable Mention with 12 =
    Mariusz Siudek (POLAND; with 3 different partners!)

    *Honorable Mention with 11 =
    Andree Joly-Brunet/Pierre Brunet (FRANCE; 1924 Olympic Bronze Medalists and 1928 & 1932 Olympic Gold Medalists!)

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Sarah Abitbol/Stephane Bernadis (FRANCE)
    Alexia Bryn-Schoien/Yngvar Bryn (NORWAY)
    Piotr Sczypa (POLAND; with 3 different partners!)
    Pierette Dubois/Paul Dubois (SWISS)
    Tatiana Granatkina-Tolmacheva/Alexander Tolmachev (USSR; she became one of the founders of the Soviet figure skating school and her husband, Alexander, was the head of the Figure Skating Federation of Moscow)

    ICE DANCE

    Margarita Drobiazko/Povilas Vanagas (LITHUANIA) = 13 (they remain the only figure skaters in history to have competed in 5 Olympiads!)

    *Honorable Mentions with 11 =
    Albena Denkova/Maxim Staviski (BULGARIA; 1st Bulgarians to medal at Worlds)
    Galit Chait/Sergei Sakhnovski (ISRAEL)

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Shae-Lynn Bourne/Victor Kraatz (CANADA)
    Ivan McDonald (NEW ZEALAND; with 4 different partners!)

  10. #475
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nadine View Post
    Lol, since I'm iced in I decided to do a complete list of Figure Skating National Record Holders in ALL disciplines, as follows (btw here's my source of reference ~ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...gure_skating):

    MEN

    Ivan Dinev (BULGARIA) = 14 (btw bio says 11, but Nationals site states 14; he's also the 1st Bulgarian to land a quad in competition and the 1st to medal at a GP event; he coaches now and is married to Angela Nikodinov of the USA).

    *Honorable Mentions with 11 =
    J. Ferguson Page (BRITISH)
    Oliver Honer (SWISS)
    Werner Rittberger (GERMANY; creator of the 3R jump).

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Carlo Fassi (ITALY)
    Nobuo Sato (JAPAN)
    Bo Mathander (SWEDISH)
    Hans Landh (SWEDISH)
    Alain Giletti (FRANCE)
    Laszlo Vajda (HUNGARY)
    Marcus Nikkanen (FINLAND)
    Gregor Urbas (SLOVENIA)
    Martin Stixrud (NORWAY; at 44 yrs. old he is the oldest person to ever win an Olympic Medal in an individual winter sport; he also coached Sonja Henie).

    WOMEN

    Vaike Paduri (ESTONIA) = 14.

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Gabriele Seyfert (EAST GERMANY; 1968 Olympic Silver Medalist)
    Andree Joly (FRANCE; 1928 & 1932 Olympic Gold Medalist in Pairs & 1924 Olympic Bronze Medalist in Pairs)
    Olga Vassiljeva (ESTONIA; btw bio says 4, but Nationals site states 10)
    Mojca Kopac (SLOVENIA)
    Tatiana Malinina (UZBEKISTAN)

    *Honorable Mentions with 9 =
    Maribel Vinson-Owen (USA; 1932 Olympic Bronze Medalist)
    Michelle Kwan (USA; 1998 Olympic Silver Medalist & 2002 Olympic Bronze Medalist)
    Chen Lu (CHINA; 1994 & 1998 Olympic Bronze Medalist; btw bio says 9, but Nationals site states 7 ?)
    Midori Ito (JAPAN; 1992 Olympic Silver Medalist)
    Surya Bonaly (FRANCE)
    Constance Wilson-Samuel (CANADA)
    Anne Karin Dehle (NORWAY)
    Karen Venhuizen (DUTCH)
    Julia Sebestyen (HUNGARY)
    Shirene Human (SOUTH AFRICA; btw bio says 10, but Nationals site states 9)

    PAIRS

    Danielle Carr-McGrath/Stephen Carr (AUSTRALIA) = 19

    *Honorable Mention with 12 =
    Mariusz Siudek (POLAND; with 3 different partners!)

    *Honorable Mention with 11 =
    Andree Joly-Brunet/Pierre Brunet (FRANCE; 1924 Olympic Bronze Medalists and 1928 & 1932 Olympic Gold Medalists!)

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Sarah Abitbol/Stephane Bernadis (FRANCE)
    Alexia Bryn-Schoien/Yngvar Bryn (NORWAY)
    Piotr Sczypa (POLAND; with 3 different partners!)
    Pierette Dubois/Paul Dubois (SWISS)
    Tatiana Granatkina-Tolmacheva/Alexander Tolmachev (USSR; she became one of the founders of the Soviet figure skating school and her husband, Alexander, was the head of the Figure Skating Federation of Moscow)

    ICE DANCE

    Margarita Drobiazko/Povilas Vanagas (LITHUANIA) = 13 (they remain the only figure skaters in history to have competed in 5 Olympiads!)

    *Honorable Mentions with 11 =
    Albena Denkova/Maxim Staviski (BULGARIA; 1st Bulgarians to medal at Worlds)
    Galit Chait/Sergei Sakhnovski (ISRAEL)

    *Honorable Mentions with 10 =
    Shae-Lynn Bourne/Victor Kraatz (CANADA)
    Ivan McDonald (NEW ZEALAND; with 4 different partners!)
    And what this has to do with the japanese nationals?

  11. #476
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    Quote Originally Posted by herios View Post
    And what this has to do with the japanese nationals?
    I think it's an tangent to earlier conversation about Mao's desire to win 10 national titles during her career.
    But I do think it would be more beneficial, Nadine if this got a thread of its own on The Edge, so we can all analyze it more with you!

  12. #477
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    Good idea, I will do that now!

  13. #478
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    I will always prefer Kim over Asada for reasons I can't really express, but I will always admire Asada for her strength, passion and remarkable abilities. She'll be a real threat at 2011 Worlds - I wouldn't be surprised if she won it! GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO MAO!!!

  14. #479
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    How weird, I feel the *exact* same way as you do, but in reverse, lol. :D But that's what makes us all unique individuals, we all have different tastes, backgrounds, histories, education, life exeriences, and so on. And I wouldn't have it any other way.

    GOOOOOOOOOO YUNA & MAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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