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Thread: Flatt should go to school, her peak is already in the past

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    Flatt should go to school, her peak is already in the past

    I personally think Rachael Flatt should go to Stanford now. What a great opportunity that is for the very bright young lady after a fine skating career. Given her obviously limited talents she has had herself a very nice career and has overachieved to do the things she has- a 5th place at Worlds, 7th at Olympics, U.S title, two U.S silvers, a World Junior title, a slew of international medals. Things are not going to get better for her from her, in fact I doubt very much she will even make the U.S World team this year. She could always do some show skating or coaching on the side.

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    I don't know for certain that her best days are behind her. It seems like her struggles this season have been due to her foot injury and then downgrades, which she probably wouldn't be getting had she not been issued those controversial downgrades in Vancouver which gave her a reputation as an "under-rotater". I think she should continue if she wants to, and if she doesn't want to then I hope she enjoys being a normal college kid at Stanford next fall. The choice is hers. Looking at what happened to Joannie and Alissa, success can come later in one's career sometimes.

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    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silverlake22 View Post
    The choice is hers. Looking at what happened to Joannie and Alissa, success can come later in one's career sometimes.
    I agree. Latebloomers do exist in this sport. In our rush to push the best junior into being the next skating great, we shouldn't forget that older skaters can be great, too, like Joannie.

    Lesley Hawker of Canada, who never made it to the Olympics didn't land her first triple salchow until she was 18. Now that's a late bloomer! She retired in her late twenties, having landed the triple lutz (having qualified to nationals only as a senior).

    Rachael may surprise you yet. Besides, she's young! She's only 18!

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    Of course skaters can develop at different rates. Flatt though was a World Junior winner and almost a U.S Champion at 15. Sorry but she is not going to be a late bloomer, that much is obvious.

    I think she has already gone as far as she can go since she doesnt have the potential to be a World medalist or even top 5 at Worlds again unless others majorly screw up. She doesnt have the powerful and really strong jumps despite her consistency, the spins, the spirals, the basic skating, the speed, the excitement, the personality, the line, the musicality, the choreography, anything really. She is just a solid and consistent skater even at her best. The best thing you ever hear about her even for her best skates is she gets the job done.

    With Nagasu with alot more talent than she has and seemingly on the right track, with Czisny who has alot more standout qualities in her skating than Flatt coming into her own this season, with Wagner still with alot of potential, and with all the youngsters like Gao coming up from behind, she is going to have a hard time even making a U.S World team in the coming years, including this year. That is why I am thinking it might well be a good time to move on. Really a U.S title, 5th at Worlds, 7th at the Olympics, it is hard to see her ever doing better than that, that is a great career which maximized her true potential and beyond. She is a very bright kid who can really do well in her new life as a student and a future career.

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    I have learned never to make judgments about whether a skater is through or not, Paul Wylie (age about 26 in Albertville) being the teaching moment for me.

    Even if Rachael's greatest days are behind her, she deserves the same chance anyone else has to try for the team. Look, they're not going to hand it to her. She's not taking away a place that rightfully belongs to a better skater. A better skater, if any exists, will get a better mark. If Rachael can't skate as well as, say, Mirai or Alissa, she's not going to be on the World team; it's as simple as that. So go for it, Rachael! If you win, cheers from my part of the forum. If you don't, thanks for representing us American skating fans so well for these past years. And whenever you decide to go to Stanford, best of luck in your studies!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    I have learned never to make judgments about whether a skater is through or not, Paul Wylie (age about 26 in Albertville) being the teaching moment for me.

    Even if Rachael's greatest days are behind her, she deserves the same chance anyone else has to try for the team. Look, they're not going to hand it to her. She's not taking away a place that rightfully belongs to a better skater. A better skater, if any exists, will get a better mark. If Rachael can't skate as well as, say, Mirai or Alissa, she's not going to be on the World team; it's as simple as that. So go for it, Rachael! If you win, cheers from my part of the forum. If you don't, thanks for representing us American skating fans so well for these past years. And whenever you decide to go to Stanford, best of luck in your studies!


    First I hope she won't take account some strangers in a forum or some sports writer from a newspaper when she's considering her future.

    Second, I think that if Rachel has the resources and the willingness to compete why not. Look it's clear Rachael enjoys skating. And while I think she enjoys competing, I think she enjoys skating. Who knows maybe she will have a second break through?

    My teaching lesson here is Todd Eldredge. This man has been through up and downs. Winning his first two Nationals titles in 1990 and 1991 and earning a Worlds bronze medal right before his 20th birthday. Everyone was ready to write him off after placing sixth and fourth at the 1993 and 1994 U.S. Nationals but then went and won his third title in 1995 at age 23. He then went on to win two more U.S. titles (1997 and 1998) a bunch of World medals and then came back for the 2002 Olympics with his SIXTH title at the age of 30.

    That's what I never count a skater out.
    Last edited by Mrs. P; 12-31-2010 at 03:54 PM.

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    I'm out. aftertherain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    I personally think Rachael Flatt should go to Stanford now. What a great opportunity that is for the very bright young lady after a fine skating career. Given her obviously limited talents she has had herself a very nice career and has overachieved to do the things she has- a 5th place at Worlds, 7th at Olympics, U.S title, two U.S silvers, a World Junior title, a slew of international medals. Things are not going to get better for her from her, in fact I doubt very much she will even make the U.S World team this year. She could always do some show skating or coaching on the side.
    The problem is, she's what the U.S. needs: a consistent skater with good technical ability, but she doesn't have the spark and spunk that many other skaters seem to have. Maybe if she got a new choreographer ...

    I'm not saying she needs to be like Mirai Nagasu or something; shoot, Mirai is Mirai and Rachael is Rachael. I'm just saying she needs programs that highlight and showcase her personality waaay better.

    Where's FlattFan in this thread when you need her?
    Last edited by aftertherain; 12-31-2010 at 04:26 PM.

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    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    Of course skaters can develop at different rates. Flatt though was a World Junior winner and almost a U.S Champion at 15. Sorry but she is not going to be a late bloomer, that much is obvious.
    As Olympia mentioned - Paul Wylie was one of those "almosts" until "finally making it" in Albertville... when so many went so far as to say he didn't belong on the team at all.

    Rudy Galindo was also one of those skaters that should have just "hung it up" before he "made it" in 1996.

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    Custom Title pista04's Avatar
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    Flatt though was a World Junior winner and almost a U.S Champion at 15. Sorry but she is not going to be a late bloomer, that much is obvious.
    Cynthia Phaneuf was 4CC Silver Medalist in '04 (while 4CC was less competitive then, she did beat Rochette on her way there) and a GP Finalist in '04 before taking a huge step back for years...and coming back to be a top 5 finisher at Worlds in 2010. So it's not mutually exclusive to have success at either the beginning, middle or end of a career.

    And yes, Flatt had a rough time at the Grand Prix Final....but, wait, hold on. She was AT the Grand Prix Final. Who also attempted and was not there? Asada...Nagasu...Korpi....Wagner...Makarova. Rachael should do with what she feels best, but I believe she has a whole lot more Skating in her. I still wish that Meissner had kept with it; I believe with her we lost the next Sasha Cohen, a clear leader of US Ladies Figure Skating.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    She doesnt have the powerful and really strong jumps despite her consistency, the spins, the spirals, the basic skating, the speed, the excitement, the personality, the line, the musicality, the choreography, anything really. She is just a solid and consistent skater even at her best. The best thing you ever hear about her even for her best skates is she gets the job done.


    This actually makes me laugh, because these exact same words (more or less) had been used at around 2008 or so to describe Evan Lysacek. I even remember a poll on FSU that asked if Lysacek was going to end up as just the "next Michael Weiss" (i.e. won 2 world bronzes, then suffer a slow decline down the ranks and passed by better skaters) with the majority of FSUers voting yes (including me).

    And look what Lysacek is today--Olympic and World Champion.

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    she takes the audience on her journey of emotions Layfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    With Nagasu with alot more talent than she has and seemingly on the right track, with Czisny who has alot more standout qualities in her skating than Flatt coming into her own this season,
    This statement makes me giggle. And how many people were saying last year that Czisny was a has-been who should retire? And look at her now - GPF champion. Thank goodness she didn't give up - or we'd have never gotten to see that great skate.

    Alissa DID think about retiring after she finished a disastrous 10th last year.

    Rachael, on the other hand, is an Olympian and the reigning U.S. champion. It is hard for me to imagine a 17-year-old considering retiring right after winning the U.S. title. Rachael was doing just fine before she got injured this season. At any rate, her season has been going no worse (actually far better) than Mirai's the year after SHE won the title. Nobody was suggesting Mirai retire...

    Rachael could very well defend her title or at least make the team - and she could very well get the third spot back for the Americans ladies. I think she's a long shot for a medal, but as one of the few ladies doing five triples, I wouldn't rule it out either.
    Last edited by Layfan; 12-31-2010 at 06:52 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    I personally think Rachael Flatt should go to Stanford now.
    I personally have a problem with a person who uses "should" to describe other person's behavior. It bespeaks more about the one who is speaking. It sort of reminds me of people who complained about Fumie Suguri not retiring "already." Skating is a tough sports with or without talent. Who are we to judge what other skaters do? I'd say, "Let Rachael be."

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    Custom Title MikiAndoFan#1's Avatar
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    What's the point of this thread? Goodness, pangtongfan, just let the skaters do whatever they want.

  14. #14
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Well, not whatever they want. I don't want to read that Miki Ando has killed Morozov after finding him cheating, or that Carolina Kostner has fun running over cats in her convertible during her free time, or that Kira Korpii poisoned Laura Lepisto and that's why she's been out for the season.

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    skating philosopher
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    Well, not whatever they want. I don't want to read that Miki Ando has killed Morozov after finding him cheating, or that Carolina Kostner has fun running over cats in her convertible during her free time, or that Kira Korpii poisoned Laura Lepisto and that's why she's been out for the season.
    LOL, all those scenarios are hillarious to think about.

    That said, I think we all assumed MikiAndoFan's statement came with the understanding of moral code, of course!

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