Miki Ando's triple-triple combinations video

Bartek · Jan 3, 2011

Hi! Finally I managed to upload the video with Miki's triple-triples. It's here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUcZWY_uB6w

Please enjouy, commen and share. And again, if you know any other triple-triple done by Miki please let me know if this thread, I will add it to video and reupload it.

Here are links to previous videos:
Irina Slutskaya's triple-triples http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxFjlJpi5MY
Miki Ando's quad salchow attempts http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hh93A8xR_IQ

reynycpr · Jan 3, 2011

Thanks for the Vids!

Blades of Passion · Jan 3, 2011

Very disappointing judging with regards to her difficult jump combinations. The 3Lutz-3Loop< at Cup of China this season should have been at least +1 GOE, but received -GOE instead. The 3Lutz was huge and the 3Loop was right at the quarter turn mark, maybe one or two degrees short, with clean outflow on the landing. The 3Lutz-3Loop<< call at the GPF was undeserved, it should have only been <.

Several undeserved calls during the 2009 season. The call at 2009 Worlds SP was actually fair, but there should have been +GOE for the huge jumps and clean outflow (and the system was more flawed back then so the base value should have been been higher too). It was ridiculous when Ando placed below Rochette in that SP.

Ando isn't attempting the 3-3 at all anymore because of this poor judging. Why bother when you're likely going to be slapped with -GOE for a BIG, CLEAN jump combination? The way the judges are scoring, her 3Lutz-2Loop gets just as much points and for far less risk. Boring.

3Lutz-3Loop is incredibly hard. The secret with Loop combinations, btw, is to land a little bit short on the first jump and for the arc of the first jump to cater a little more towards distance than you might normally jump (rather than height). This maximizes the inertia created by the landing of the blade when you swing around into the Loop.

Miki often gets into "trouble" in terms of the rotation of the second part of her 3Lutz-3Loop simply because the first jump is so BIG. Jumping that high and getting all the way around in the air (which is normally ideal) before landing doesn't leave you with as much of a snap to get back up into the 3Loop, as opposed to getting more distance on the jump and landing just a little bit short to allow the blade to keep turning on the ice and use the momentum from the first jump to get off the ice on the Loop.

Anyway, yeah, the 3Lutz-3Loop is literally Miki's best element and yet she is so frequently snubbed when she tries it and doesn't get the credit she deserves.

silverlake22 · Jan 3, 2011

^^ I agree. Her 3lz-3lo is amazing. The fact that the judges don't recognize that and are so stingy about giving her credit for her amazing athleticism is just bull :rolleye:

pangtongfan · Jan 3, 2011

Blades of Passion said:
Very disappointing judging with regards to her difficult jump combinations. The 3Lutz-3Loop< at Cup of China this season should have been at least +1 GOE, but received -GOE instead. The 3Lutz was huge and the 3Loop was right at the quarter turn mark, maybe one or two degrees short, with clean outflow on the landing. The 3Lutz-3Loop<< call at the GPF was undeserved, it should have only been <.

Several undeserved calls during the 2009 season. The call at 2009 Worlds SP was actually fair, but there should have been +GOE for the huge jumps and clean outflow (and the system was more flawed back then so the base value should have been been higher too). It was ridiculous when Ando placed below Rochette in that SP.

Ando isn't attempting the 3-3 at all anymore because of this poor judging. Why bother when you're likely going to be slapped with -GOE for a BIG, CLEAN jump combination? The way the judges are scoring, her 3Lutz-2Loop gets just as much points and for far less risk. Boring.

3Lutz-3Loop is incredibly hard. The secret with Loop combinations, btw, is to land a little bit short on the first jump and for the arc of the first jump to cater a little more towards distance than you might normally jump (rather than height). This maximizes the inertia created by the landing of the blade when you swing around into the Loop.

Miki often gets into "trouble" in terms of the rotation of the second part of her 3Lutz-3Loop simply because the first jump is so BIG. Jumping that high and getting all the way around in the air (which is normally ideal) before landing doesn't leave you with as much of a snap to get back up into the 3Loop, as opposed to getting more distance on the jump and landing just a little bit short to allow the blade to keep turning on the ice and use the momentum from the first jump to get off the ice on the Loop.

Anyway, yeah, the 3Lutz-3Loop is literally Miki's best element and yet she is so frequently snubbed when she tries it and doesn't get the credit she deserves.

Yeah the judging on Ando is crazy often times. Discredited for perfectly able triple-triple
combinations and yet given inflated PCS and non jump element GOEs she doesnt deserve.

evangeline · Jan 4, 2011

Blades of Passion said:
Very disappointing judging with regards to her difficult jump combinations. The 3Lutz-3Loop< at Cup of China this season should have been at least +1 GOE, but received -GOE instead. The 3Lutz was huge and the 3Loop was right at the quarter turn mark, maybe one or two degrees short, with clean outflow on the landing. The 3Lutz-3Loop<< call at the GPF was undeserved, it should have only been <.

Several undeserved calls during the 2009 season. The call at 2009 Worlds SP was actually fair, but there should have been +GOE for the huge jumps and clean outflow (and the system was more flawed back then so the base value should have been been higher too). It was ridiculous when Ando placed below Rochette in that SP.

Ando isn't attempting the 3-3 at all anymore because of this poor judging. Why bother when you're likely going to be slapped with -GOE for a BIG, CLEAN jump combination? The way the judges are scoring, her 3Lutz-2Loop gets just as much points and for far less risk. Boring.

3Lutz-3Loop is incredibly hard. The secret with Loop combinations, btw, is to land a little bit short on the first jump and for the arc of the first jump to cater a little more towards distance than you might normally jump (rather than height). This maximizes the inertia created by the landing of the blade when you swing around into the Loop.

Miki often gets into "trouble" in terms of the rotation of the second part of her 3Lutz-3Loop simply because the first jump is so BIG. Jumping that high and getting all the way around in the air (which is normally ideal) before landing doesn't leave you with as much of a snap to get back up into the 3Loop, as opposed to getting more distance on the jump and landing just a little bit short to allow the blade to keep turning on the ice and use the momentum from the first jump to get off the ice on the Loop.

Anyway, yeah, the 3Lutz-3Loop is literally Miki's best element and yet she is so frequently snubbed when she tries it and doesn't get the credit she deserves.

:thumbsup:

I hate how the ISU's puritanical crackdown on underrotations have more or less killed jump combinations with the 3Lo on the back end.

Nadine · Jan 4, 2011

A little off-topic, but still somewhat related, I have to say after watching Adelina Sotnikova the other day (yeah, I said previously I wouldn't watch the young Russians phenoms until they entered Seniors, but changed my mind out of curiousity, lol). Anyhow, after watching Adelina Sotnikova at the most recent Russian Nationals, I have to say EVERYBODY has to watch out for her, including Yuna Kim.

Nobody else impressed me, not even Elizaveta, they all look & are built juniorish, whereas Adelina has successfully matured into her new body. She has it all ~ gorgeous HIGH big beautiful fully rotated jumps, including 3/3s, ala Yuna Kim ~ and she also has presentation, et al. Not really my cup of tea, but obviously the best out there.

Right now I feel she is the only one whom can compete with Yuna Kim jump for jump, including 3/3s. I was literally blown away by her 3lutz. I think that's the highest jump I've ever seen by anyone, man or woman.

Miki Ando & Mao Asada, et al, have to watch out. Adelina is definitely the now, not the future. She makes me worried for Mao most of all, my favorite out of all the lady skaters skating today.

hikki · Jan 4, 2011

Bartkek thanks for the video! Also check out:

2002 Japanese Nationals SP (Arguably the BEST 3lz/3lp!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-S61dB74GE&feature=related

*Couldn't find the LP but she succeeded with the combo there too.

2002 Worlds Jr LP
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc7FZGol7hQ

Watching the vid reminds me how I miss the +loop combos. Especially for Miki, it must be more than just a point getter but rather a signature move that gives her a kick, pride, much like a 3axel or a quad. As a skating fan I certainly used to get such adrenalin. It looks as though the judges had a secret meeting after 2007 Worlds to specifically target ANY +3loop combos. (Blades of Passion, ITA with you)

I'm puzzled about the calls for:
2007 SA 3t/3l
2008 FC
2008 SA
2008 JP
2010 CC

and even 2009 WC SP which I thought was less than 1/4 short, especially considering Mao's 3flip/3loop got credit.

*There was an interesting discussion about this topic earlier last year
http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/showthread.php?32111-3loop-combos-thing-of-the-past-under-CoP

*Check out Shizuka's 3luz/3loop from August 2010 (yes she STILL does it)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPQun-K9rQs#t=0m34s

pangtongfan · Jan 10, 2011

As overrated as Miki Ando is in PCS and many of her other marks she has been underrated in the past in triple-triples. She has had many unfairly downgraded which unfortunately have led to her often not even trying them now. Her triple-triples are much better than Irina Slutskayas which almost never got downgraded. Shows how much favortism there is going around in the sport.

Blades of Passion · Jan 11, 2011

Not really a fair comparison considering Slutskaya hasn't been competing in this era of strict calls. She only tried the Triple-Triple a total of 3 times under CoP anyway and they all happened to be very good attempts that probably deserved to be ratified.

Miki Ando's triple-triple combinations video

Bartek

reynycpr

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be

silverlake22

pangtongfan

Match Penalty

evangeline

Nadine

hikki

pangtongfan

Match Penalty

Blades of Passion

Skating is Art, if you let it be

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