I remember him! At that point, before our entente with mainland China, his name was styled Fou Tsong, I believe, and I remember reading about him in the paper. If I recall correctly, he expressed similar sentiments in an interview once. I had forgotten that he married Menuhin's daughter. How great that you got to meet both of them! As a music buff, I am very envious of you.
Michelle Attends U.S. State Dinner for China President Hu Jintao
- Thread starter demarinis5
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I remember him! At that point, before our entente with mainland China, his name was styled Fou Tsong, I believe, and I remember reading about him in the paper. If I recall correctly, he expressed similar sentiments in an interview once. I had forgotten that he married Menuhin's daughter. How great that you got to meet both of them! As a music buff, I am very envious of you.
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LOL! Come on,I didnt claim I know queens english, I only meant that we learnt the formal language, for example how to write the Mayor a letter or a newspaper political article, or how we address to a court, we learn all the Cambridge dictionary idioms by heart BUT we dont learn how to disagree on Golden SKates.
You see how I cant even explain what I wanted to say??By the way the last few years students have the option to take the Michigan language exams instead of Cambridge, they ´re supposed to be more modern and updated but not when i was in school.
Mathman you know Chinese?? You learnt it so you could impress the Kwan?
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Wow I just love this blog entry. It is utterly amusing to note that out all of the important people in that room, and the important things being discussed at this historical dinner that may impact the next few years that worth billions of dollars in trade, all it took is a lady in a gold dress to steal the show and charm its guest.... It is rather deja vous if you study Chinese Dynasty dinners with foreign dignitaries throughout history and the unofficial role/power of the single charming female.
The irony is Michelle is still only a master student, when she may very well ends in tomorrow's history books and study herself had she continues her doctorate, or her teachers will.
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Seniorita, yes when you mean Cambridge, you are probably talking about the Cambridge ESOL certification, I am thinking about getting one myself, actually it is not that hard to get and everybody's standard on this skating board is good enough.
Wow SkateFiguring, you know Yehudi Menuhin and Fu Chong. Are you around the Royal Academic of Music / College of Music classical world crowd by any chance?
As for politics, I think most overseas Chinese are just internally frustrated and really terribly sad with the political situation, but they will never publicly denounce the communist regime in the hope that it will work itself out, and they will be allowed to go back to mainland one day. Patriotism is very much intact but the culture is one that does't expresses its feverish passion outwardly in public - at least that is how I interpret my fathers and grandfather's generation. Many of them left because they had no choice. I find this very rare people are willing to talk about this openly in the public unless you are speaking to another Chinese may be, loose face is still very much a taboo in the culture.
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Mathman you know Chinese?? You learnt it so you could impress the Kwan?
I studied Chinese for a little while in college, but I never mastered the spoken part at all. As an undergraduate student, I was interested in many things and changed my major every semester or so. But I always signed up for one mathematics course as an elective to fill out my schedule. When I got to be a senior, mathematics was the only subject that I had enough credits to graduate in, so I had to take a degree in mathematics.
All of this took me seven years to get through four years of college.
But I still beat Michelle. She always says she went to college on the ten year plan.
Anyway, I expect that Michelle will want to consult me for help with the statistical aspects of her master's thesis. The phone will ring any minute now...
Truly! If I were one of Michelle's professors, doing professional research on Chinerse-American diplomatic history, I would be grilling Michelle every day to get material for my next book.
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Yes the ESOLS exams, actually the firsts levels are ok but the CPE I found it quite difficult and it took me two years of intense studying. Maybe taking the exam in older age would have been easier. But then again maybe it is easy nfor other people, I m just not much disciplined in languages learning.
well if you had to..
Your system is so much different than ours where you have to decide beforehand since high school what exactly you want to study and when you succeed the exams for entering university but you change your mind for your subject in the meantime..too bad! Many students have become doctors like this, without wanting it at the end!
When you talk to Michelle ask her from where she buys her dresses please
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When you talk to Michelle ask her from where she buys her dresses please
If you wanted to know, she was wearing a Herve Leger by Max Azria dress.
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Great points. I think these are really important to recognize - although I still don't see why this post is on the Edge - South eastern Chinese seem to have this very unapproachable aspect to their language that seem hypocritical but likely just ingrained into their brains how superior their language is. I was speaking with a girl from Guangzhou who was upset about her experience at the store asking the clerk for a "fla." After she repeated it 6 times and finally used hands to show waving motion in the wind I understood she was asking for a "flag." This is the same person who laughs and says don't bother trying when I attempt to learn a new word or to try and show respect and say her name in Chinese rather than here "self given" English name. It is either that Americans are extremely accepting to having to decipher variations in pronunciation or there is an inability to convey or understand that the english that is spoken by a majority of Asians (not A.B.A.s) requires thought and association to figure out what is being said. It is pronunciation / accent or whatever, but it defiantly does not get reciprocated by a majority of the Asians I meet from Southern Asian countries.
That's interesting, Seanibu. I gather that native French speakers also tend to look down on outsiders attempting to speak their language. Well, their language is a work of art, after all. I suppose one develops a certain pride in speaking such a beautiful language. It must be the same in other countries, too.
Depending on where one is in the U.S., people are very much used to all sorts of accents because Americans come from so many countries. In my own office one day, I walked down the hall and heard someone chatting in I think Taisanese to a grandparent and someone else issuing directives in Ukrainian to a daughter. Both of these people are completely fluent in English as well. Now we have someone who chats in Dutch to her mother and someone else who addresses family in Catalan and friends and associates in Spanish. Granted I live in a city, but there are smaller areas where communities from all over the place have made their homes. English is also a packrat language, with vocabulary and constructions borrowed from many other languages. We don't have the equivalent of an Academie Francaise, which rules on the acceptability of new words. New words just appear and are taken in. That's how we got the words sandal, shampoo, mattress, tea, boondocks, hammock, coach, and limousine. I think I've read somewhere that partly due to that, English has one of the largest vocabularies of any language.
Believe it or not, English isn't even the official language of the U.S. It's the de facto national language in the sense that it's the main one spoken, but there's no law mandating English as the official language. Periodically some group tries to legislate English as the official language, but so far that hasn't happened. I kind of like that motley aspect of English.
Depending on where one is in the U.S., people are very much used to all sorts of accents because Americans come from so many countries. In my own office one day, I walked down the hall and heard someone chatting in I think Taisanese to a grandparent and someone else issuing directives in Ukrainian to a daughter. Both of these people are completely fluent in English as well. Now we have someone who chats in Dutch to her mother and someone else who addresses family in Catalan and friends and associates in Spanish. Granted I live in a city, but there are smaller areas where communities from all over the place have made their homes. English is also a packrat language, with vocabulary and constructions borrowed from many other languages. We don't have the equivalent of an Academie Francaise, which rules on the acceptability of new words. New words just appear and are taken in. That's how we got the words sandal, shampoo, mattress, tea, boondocks, hammock, coach, and limousine. I think I've read somewhere that partly due to that, English has one of the largest vocabularies of any language.
Believe it or not, English isn't even the official language of the U.S. It's the de facto national language in the sense that it's the main one spoken, but there's no law mandating English as the official language. Periodically some group tries to legislate English as the official language, but so far that hasn't happened. I kind of like that motley aspect of English.
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Well said, I did not however experience any derogatory actions from native French speakers when I was learning it in Jr. High. However there is French in my family so maybe I had a knack for it. ??lol
But yes I think it has to do with "pride" and individuality. I think governments are starting to understand there is a place for tradition and that is NOT world politics and economics. a.k.a glorified "clicks."
And I did a little research on the aspect of Taiwan having a different dialect than "main land" Chinese providences and from personal conversation with Chinese and looking on-line there is a Taiwan dialect without question. It is under the same "push" to adapt Mandarin as the language (as CHN government is dictating for all the country) and promote it as the dialect regardless of what people speak.
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As far as I knmow, many Taiwanese speak Fujianhua and Mandarin (both hail from the mainland). Other than that, there are the indigeneous languages of the native Taiwanese people.
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Good, more to that point. Most Chinese seem to know Mandarin that were born after 1980. What is odd is how it seems that if the "native regional dialects" are spoken, the understanding of other regions is so little - pointless. Compared to America where a majority of English speaking people understand each other no matter what part of the country they are from (at least can get a general understanding). I think throughout the evolution of China there COULD have been a time where providence's did not want others providence to understand each other and this sentiment still carries through from the populous and not the government that is attempting to bring the country together as a whole - and again good luck with Tibet, China.
But kudoos for "team spirit." 
B.O.T with MK, NO MENTION AT ALL of her on QQ headlines. Jackie Chan is the only person the worlds most visited website (yeh probably because of the shear number of Chinese alive in the world and it is an encompassing site like Yahoo) mentioned being there. Her influence that generates from Chinese in China really appears to be squaller outside of the skating community there. They're missing out hunh? :sheesh:- great, I just used the term "skating community" hence giving some validation for this not being in the politics or Le Café.
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Can you explain what you mean by that?
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~ Taiwanese do have their own dialects and it appeared you were adding to that point. And English speaking has it's different dialects as well. But with comparison to understanding of dialects through out a county, Americans seem to understand each other regardless of dialect better than in Chinese. example - the understanding of someone from Louisiana talking to someone from Montana in their common dialect is a greater possibility than someone from Shanghai understanding to someone from Guangzhou in their dialect. Regardless of adaptation by government.
Seems like there was a comment from someone saying there is not a different dialect of Chinese spoken in Taiwan.??? That is what I commented to in the first place.
I think there was a comment somewhere in here also that said "Cantonese is the second most..." Which technically is not correct either. Cantonese by definition is a conglomerate of different dialects that are more similar to each other than to Mandarin so they are all "lumped together as "Cantonese." And there are by far more Cantonese "speaking" Chinese than Mandarin YET Mandarin is the most commonly presented Chinese language. There are dialects of Cantonese that DO NOT understand each other although they are still considered / accepted as "Cantonese." I mean think about it, Mandarin is used so 2 people who natively both speak Cantonese from different regions can understand each other.
There is some conversation here about "butchering of language" and I just wan to point out this is an issue that people have accepted by adding words to definitions and allowing it to "procreate" the English language. At the point in time where we said the words " exactly, precisely, specifically" have the same meaning or can be interchange with the same meaning in conversation is the point where English went down the tubes. Well that and accepting different pronunciations (the old potato / potato thing). We set our youth up for making it worse and I believe we are only blaming them for what was stated at least a century ago. Entities like Webster's perpetuates misunderstanding and inconsistency of language and then will come out and say "oh we'll just add that word because everyone keeps using it anyway so...." Our children and use of tax dollars are not to blame - it is copisetic nature. Nice and friendly. But there is only one English word for an Orange the same should be true of a Automobile. j.m.o
But alas, where did the conversation about MK go - any skating she is doing? Is she starting a "get out and skate presidential campaign?" I know she could have influence and promote good relations with China, but she seems to have been put into the "token Asian" category to present America as an Asian friendly county. I think Jintao is aware of this by the number of visas and green cards being issued. And I know I am always the one to go out on a limb and say anything even remotely derogatory about the Kween, But having someone represent our country to a government like China that looks at a 4 year degree as a 10 year to accomplish is most likely NOT going to be looked at favorably by a country like China. I don't think there is anything wrong with her opinion of duration of time to gain her degree however I am guessing that is not a shared view of Jintao and myself. lol
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I'm not sure we have different dialects... accents, yes, but America is such a melting pot of words and languages that I don't think any state/region has its own dialect...
Maybe, Seanibu, but consider these points as well:
I don't think MK was the only person of Chinese heritage at such a dinner. I am sure there were physicists, medical doctors, musicians, a cross-section of Chinese-American achievers. Some of them doubtless got their college degree in four years, or even three. All of those people will give a good impression of the United States as a country favorable to people of Asian descent.
Michelle's qualifications are different: international experience unusual for someone of her young age. She brings this benefit to the encounter, as would any Chinese-American athlete with world-level credentials. (We MK fans like to think that she brings something extra, as well!)
And don't knock the influence of sports achievement at such a time! Remember Yao Ming at the Beijing Olympics? He may be Chinese born, but he plays for the NBA--and I'm not sure of his college grade point average, or whether China even cares. Make no mistake: sports is a crucial bridge between countries, and has been since long before Katia Gordeyeva made the Soviet Union look friendly.
Besides, national pride is an instinct that brings people together when someone of their "tribe" makes good anywhere in the world. I have Bulgarian friends, and their excitement about Albena Denkova, as well as any Bulgarian opera singer, is a delight to behold. Michelle may not be as well known in China outside of the skating world as she is to skate fans, but any in China who hear of her being so successful in America will surely feel a thrill of pride.
I don't think MK was the only person of Chinese heritage at such a dinner. I am sure there were physicists, medical doctors, musicians, a cross-section of Chinese-American achievers. Some of them doubtless got their college degree in four years, or even three. All of those people will give a good impression of the United States as a country favorable to people of Asian descent.
Michelle's qualifications are different: international experience unusual for someone of her young age. She brings this benefit to the encounter, as would any Chinese-American athlete with world-level credentials. (We MK fans like to think that she brings something extra, as well!)
And don't knock the influence of sports achievement at such a time! Remember Yao Ming at the Beijing Olympics? He may be Chinese born, but he plays for the NBA--and I'm not sure of his college grade point average, or whether China even cares. Make no mistake: sports is a crucial bridge between countries, and has been since long before Katia Gordeyeva made the Soviet Union look friendly.
Besides, national pride is an instinct that brings people together when someone of their "tribe" makes good anywhere in the world. I have Bulgarian friends, and their excitement about Albena Denkova, as well as any Bulgarian opera singer, is a delight to behold. Michelle may not be as well known in China outside of the skating world as she is to skate fans, but any in China who hear of her being so successful in America will surely feel a thrill of pride.
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@ Seanibu: Wow. Long explanation.
But the thing is, the different Chinese dialects originated in China which means even though they're all considered "chinese" and have many have some similar pronounciations, they are not the same. English is an "immigrant" language of the U.S.; what I mean by that is that it didn't originate in the Americas, it was brought there by colonizers, so rather than being different "dialects", they're just different "accents". That is why it might be easier for people of the States to understand each other compared to the people of China.
I disagree and agree at the same time. I disagree because there were more people of Asian descent other than she and because she's been to other countries not in Asia. And honestly, I think her trips are more about encouraging children of different nationalities to follow their dreams, work hard, and excercise daily. So I think her diplomacy trips are more sports-ish than political. I do agree that she might be part of the "token Asian" category just because Asians represent a smaller percentage of the population than Caucasians, African-Americans, and Latino-Americans. There are fewer Asian-Americans that are put out in the spotlight than that of the aforementioned, and Michelle seems to be one of them.
But the thing is, the different Chinese dialects originated in China which means even though they're all considered "chinese" and have many have some similar pronounciations, they are not the same. English is an "immigrant" language of the U.S.; what I mean by that is that it didn't originate in the Americas, it was brought there by colonizers, so rather than being different "dialects", they're just different "accents". That is why it might be easier for people of the States to understand each other compared to the people of China.
I disagree and agree at the same time. I disagree because there were more people of Asian descent other than she and because she's been to other countries not in Asia. And honestly, I think her trips are more about encouraging children of different nationalities to follow their dreams, work hard, and excercise daily. So I think her diplomacy trips are more sports-ish than political. I do agree that she might be part of the "token Asian" category just because Asians represent a smaller percentage of the population than Caucasians, African-Americans, and Latino-Americans. There are fewer Asian-Americans that are put out in the spotlight than that of the aforementioned, and Michelle seems to be one of them.
You say it like she's supposed to be the President or some high-ranking international politician. She doesn't get paid for what she does, so I think it's more like a volunteer "mission" or something like it. And I'm pretty sure China isn't dense enough to think that Michelle and Michelle only will improve relations. Politics are much more complicated than that, but I'm sure you know that already. Also, like I said, she's been to other countries. She's not a China-focused diplomacy envoy; she's an international-focused diplomacy envoy.
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You ever been to Louisiana??? ah semantics.
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P.S. I bet some of you don't know this, but English isn't the official language of the U.S.
In fact, the U.S. doesn't have an official language.
Explanation: It's complicated. And the debate to have English as the official language rages on. But we won't get into that (at least I don't want to ...).
In fact, the U.S. doesn't have an official language.
Explanation: It's complicated. And the debate to have English as the official language rages on. But we won't get into that (at least I don't want to ...).
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- Mar 19, 2006
Funny how if anything besides MK is great is said people feel like defending her. lol. And the Tribe thing is exactly all that really appears to be presented here. JSYK I do think MK is great and a fine example of an American. I was talking about the perception of her from China. In the eyes of China it is my opinion that China does not concider her a part of there tribe. And tribes are essentuly the problem anyway. One world one tribe. The programme has changed.
Now would you guys stop making good conversation with me so I can get back to reading "From Axels to Zambonis" LOL. I am on the Judging and scoring part and this really is distracting. J/K. Just having some fun with the last comment.
Now would you guys stop making good conversation with me so I can get back to reading "From Axels to Zambonis" LOL. I am on the Judging and scoring part and this really is distracting. J/K. Just having some fun with the last comment.