Any skater with talent and promise like Agnes needs to leave Tom Z. He's great at technical things like jumps but his skaters are horribly slow with no choreography or flair or basic skating skills. Just look at Rachael Flatt or Brandon Mroz. Total snoozefest when they skate. He can only take them so far with their skating.
Last edited by Jammers; 02-03-2011 at 07:19 PM.
You felt the need to express this on a skating board why? Do you think your bias against evangelical Christians is somehow more endearing than expressing bias against blacks or gay people (which I assume you'd find obnoxious)?Originally Posted by ivy
Back on topic, I don't like saddling young Agnes with a comparison to someone with as much baggage as Tonya. Plus, I don't see the resemblance. Tonya was a firecracker, Agnes seems like a steadier jumper. Plus Agnes is already a lot more artistic than Tonya. She comes across as very controlled, also intelligent, IMO - a word I rarely think of applying to skaters (unlike Scott Hamilton!). She's unusual and rather intriguing. I can't type her, at least not yet.
I don't see why you're so upset. Jammers simply stated that he's an atheist, and he's not fond of Colordo's evangelical Christian reputation, which (s)he obviously does find obnoxious. The accusation of racism and homophobia is unneccessary on your part.
Agnes and Tonya don't really mach up together in my head. Tonya was a very strong jumper; her jumps had such great height. Agnes just struck me as a somewhat average, and somewhat consistent jumper.
Moderator's note: Let's hold off on comments about how other people's religions annoy us, OK?
Amen.
Never got the hype about Agnes- she has high jumps, yes, but mentally she has a ways to go. She cannot keep blowing it in the FS- plus I hope she stays healthy.
That said- she's obviously in position to replace, say, Wagner as one of the Top Contenders in the US. Not convinced Zawadki will necessarily have more success, though.
My apologies for causing any offense.
My post was really directed to fairly4, who seems to be saying that Agnes is benefiting, and Christina suffering, from prejudices within the judging panel at Nat'ls this year, having to do with their race and skating clubs. Both of which should be irrelevant the outcome of the Nat'ls.
My poorly made point was trying to say: There are things that might prejudice me against Agnes - the club she trains at and the town where that club is located - both of which should be irrelevant my opinion of her skate. I did enjoy her skate and felt she was fairly placed at Nat'ls.
My hope was fairly4 might think - 'hey, here is someone who is culturally unconnected to Agnes, but thinks the judging was fair, maybe, just maybe, I should reexamine my premises'. You're probably right Spun Silver, I should have left culture out of it, but fairly4's concern is cultural so it felt like the appropriate response.
We all walk around with cultural baggage, whether we're fans or judges, the hope is that we can leave it off ice. I do believe the judges at Nat'ls did that.
And we all learned a valuable lesson in tolerance.
And also in not feeding trolls.
And also that extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. If somebody wants to say that judges are racist, they better bring some real proof, home videos of those judges skating at a Klan meeting or some such. Otherwise, why even bother dignifying the claim?
Most judges aren't corrupt, biased or anything but trying to score competitions as fairly as they can under the system in which they labor. Any unfairness and biases are usually part of that system and not easy to hide.
If I was a judge and I had to score a skater I hated for personal reasons, I would do what any reasonable person would do, root for him/her to splat, then grudgingly score him/her fairly.
As to rivalry comparisons, Christina/Agnes reminds me more of Tonya and Nancy. Christina reminds me of Nancy, in that she isn't as exciting a skater as Tonya is, to me. I don't get a feeling that she is pushing the envelope; she's a very safe skater. Agnes, on the other hand, because of the spring in her jumps, makes me feel excited when i watch her.
Clearly you have no idea what Spun Silver was alluding to. Definitely wasn't accusation of racism or homophobia.
Thank you.
And ivy, I appreciate the handsome apology and explanation.
I thought the exact same thing!! From her jumps to the dress and even that TH swag thing... it was like going back in time. I also appreciated that fearless look in her eye; she had oodles & ooodles of confidence - which when I'm being truly honest about US ladies skating seems to be the key issue. I shall be keeping an eye on this one.Yes, right on!
But I rather view her as the *new & improved* Tonya Harding.Look at those thighs & slightly bowed legs exactly like Tonya, except Agnes is tall & lithe, but those powerful legs are just like Tonya's!
I love this kid, she has the most potential I've ever seen from an American lady since Tonya, can't wait to see what the future holds. But most importantly she's hungry, unlike some of these other pampered ballerinas. (;^)
It's refreshing to have a Tech skater around. I get so bored watching all those faux ballerinas on ice. Agnes, you go girl!
Completely agree. She tears it up. Something I liked about Kat Witt, Taylor Flirth, Danielle Kahle amongst some others, just the first to come to mind, that naughty by nature attitude (at least for the routine). Her "power" didn't really remind me of Tonya though - but I can see where that thought comes from. Best over all US nats I can recall for a long time.
I really enjoy Agnes' skating, what is this family situation that everyone keeps alluding too, and I do not see any resembelance between her and Tonya Harding. Tonya carried a dark cloud and did not have a good reputation within US figure skating, even before the incident. Anges' skating is fresh, clean, and her jumps are very powerful , she is a medal hopeful for Sochi for Team USA, its about time we put an American lady back on the podium.
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