Joubert aiming for Worlds podium | Golden Skate

Joubert aiming for Worlds podium

Violet Bliss

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
Mondiaux: Brian Joubert vise le podium

He is feeling confident and fit, and is including 2 quads and 2 3A in his LP. He has a mental block for his 3Lutz so he's switching to 3F in the SP.

He's not aiming openly for Gold because of the pain on his left knee since December and he will have an operation on it next June. He considers Chan and Takahashi the main contenders for the Worlds title.

He is glad for Florent taking away the intense focus on himself. He compares Florent with himself a little in the article, saying Florent doesn't jump as high but he is fluide. He's seen Florent doing quads in practice.

He hopes to extend his skating career to Sochi Olympics. After that he wishes to coach and to build an "ice school".
 

Tinymavy15

Sinnerman for the win
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 28, 2006
i wish him the best. I don't realistically seeing him medal even if he is reasonably clean the way the other men have pushed the standards, but I do want to see him skate well.
 

mot

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Thanks, SkateFiguring! I really really want Brian to finish this difficult season for him on a high note. I can see so much potential in his long programme and hope he can pull it off in a spectacular fashion in Tokyo. It's also great to know he's motivated enough to consider extending his career until Sochi. Allez Brian!
 

herios

Medalist
Joined
Jan 25, 2004
In one way or another, Brian found his way to the podium every single time at Worlds starting 2006 and also medaled in 2004, therefore he missed the podium only once in 7 tries.
That is why I am not surprised he aims for the podium, everything else would feel like a dissapointment for him.
The only problem I see is he was usually given higher PCS scores than he deserved, and this year his PCS became more pedestrian, so he will have to be squicky clean to win back the judges on his side, medaling with botched jumps like before, might not be in the cards for him anymore.
 
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Violet Bliss

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
At Euro, Joubert fell on his SP 3Lz and sort of bombed it, ending up 7th. He came back with a 4T/2T to win the LP, ending up second overall, behind Amodio who was 1st and 3rd in his programs. His LP Lutz jumps were OK but his 3F got an edge call. It's hard to tell what is more reliable for him, 3Lz or 3F. Maybe the 3Lz mental block is just for the SP.

Very ambitious of him to attempt 2 quads and 2 3As considering he hasn't been very successful with them this season. I guess he will just go for broke at Worlds and it might work.
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Well, with the US men's world team the way it is, Joubert's chances of medaling at Worlds are increased, although it will still be tough. If he actually lands all that content though, it's definitely possible. That's really ambitious though, I'm worried about him running out of steam. I think it's safe to assume Chan and one Japanese guy will be on the podium, but the 3rd spot is a little more up for grabs, especially where Takahashi has been far from his best this season, Kozuka showed he's vulnerable by finished OTP behind Hanyu and Abbott at 4CC, and Oda has had issues with his quad and counting so really only 1 of them ending up on the podium is very plausible. Joubert, Verner, Amodio or Brezina if they do quads, all have an outside shot at making the podium. I would even add Dornbush to the list, but he's not planning a quad so I don't see that happening without one.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
^^^
Interesting read, silverlake22. You seem to say that without a quad, a skater can not be on the podium. What if a skater does a quad, but misses a 3A. Do we have consistent 3As and 1or2quads, in this field of Mens?

I guarantee, if one takes off badly on a 3A, he is doomed to failure. There are no Wrong Edge Takeoffs, and Attempts for a 3A without failure.
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
Joe, I went through the list, and it's pretty amazing the amount of skaters that will be attempting a quad at Worlds this year. I stuck this in the what do you want to see in Men's thread, but I'll copy the list over here. The following skaters attempted a quad at their last competition previous to Worlds (GPF, US Nationals, 4CC's or Europeans)-there are 12 of them. And now 13, if Amodio does indeed try a quad. 8 have tried a quad in both the SP and LP. AFAIR, there are now only 24 spots in the LP, and significantly more than half of the men that I expect to see in the LP will have quads.

Chan, SP&LP
Joubert, SP&LP
Oda, SP&LP
Bradley, SP & LP
Takahashi, SP&LP
van der Perren, SP&LP
Gachinski, SP&LP
Schultheiss, SP&LP
Fernandez, LP
Verner, LP
Kozuka, LP
Viktor Pfeifer, LP
Amodio now plans a quad in the LP

I know Brezina has tried a quad before, but he didn't at Euros. He may at Worlds.

and even some alternates have shown quads this year
Guan of China LP (alternate)
Abbott (USA) LP
Menshov (RUS) SP&LP (alternate)
and of course Kevin Reynolds SP&LP (alternate)

It seems probable that the day of getting on the World podium with no quad is approaching, if not already here.
 
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silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
^^^
Interesting read, silverlake22. You seem to say that without a quad, a skater can not be on the podium. What if a skater does a quad, but misses a 3A. Do we have consistent 3As and 1or2quads, in this field of Mens?

I guarantee, if one takes off badly on a 3A, he is doomed to failure. There are no Wrong Edge Takeoffs, and Attempts for a 3A without failure.

I more just meant that for a newbie like Dornbush who won't be attempting a quad at all and won't get huge PCS, medaling is pretty much out of the question even if he skates cleanly. Also, I think attempting a quad and landing it allows a skater to make a couple minor mistakes without killing their chances completely, whereas even just one small mistake in a program with no quad is likely to be very costly.
 

dorispulaski

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Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
silverlake, I agree with you. It is going to be very hard for Sawyer, Russell, Dornbush, and Miner to finish in the top ten without a quad, given that everyone and his brother is going to be throwing one. They will all have to skate as perfectly as they did at US and Canadian Nationals.
 

blue_idealist

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 25, 2006
silverlake, I agree with you. It is going to be very hard for Sawyer, Russell, Dornbush, and Miner to finish in the top ten without a quad, given that everyone and his brother is going to be throwing one. They will all have to skate as perfectly as they did at US and Canadian Nationals.

I don't think Russell's going to finish in the top 10, quad or not. He was in the back of the pack at 4CCs.
 
Joined
Jul 11, 2003
I more just meant that for a newbie like Dornbush who won't be attempting a quad at all and won't get huge PCS, medaling is pretty much out of the question even if he skates cleanly. Also, I think attempting a quad and landing it allows a skater to make a couple minor mistakes without killing their chances completely, whereas even just one small mistake in a program with no quad is likely to be very costly.
van der Perren does a quad quad combo, but does he get on the podium other than possibly Euros?

It does make for many points in this winner-of-points-takes-all, but even at that, it needs a few extras. btw, I'm not in favor of partial credit or futile attempts at elements.

How attempts affect the individual judges scoring is not well publicized. Just don't know about that.
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
van der Perren does a quad quad combo, but does he get on the podium other than possibly Euros?

It does make for many points in this winner-of-points-takes-all, but even at that, it needs a few extras. btw, I'm not in favor of partial credit or futile attempts at elements.

How attempts affect the individual judges scoring is not well publicized. Just don't know about that.

Van Der Perren would be at the bottom of the pack if it weren't for his quads though, but can finish in the middle of the pack at worlds and near the top at euros if he lands his quad combos and other big jumps. Bradley is sort of in a similar situation. If he hits the quads and the triple axels, he can be in the top 10, but if he has jump problems, he could finish a lot lower.

For skaters with a realistic shot at a medal, landing a quad serves as a bit of a buffer in case they happen to have a slip up or two in their programs. For example, say Joubert and Verner both land quads but make some other mistakes, it's likely they wouldn't medal but they would likely still finish in the top 10. For Chan or Takahashi, landing the quad but making a couple other mistakes would probably still land them on the podium, but cost them the gold.
 
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Layfan

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
van der Perren does a quad quad combo, but does he get on the podium other than possibly Euros?

It does make for many points in this winner-of-points-takes-all, but even at that, it needs a few extras. btw, I'm not in favor of partial credit or futile attempts at elements.

How attempts affect the individual judges scoring is not well publicized. Just don't know about that.

I'm with you. It'll be interesting to see im that long impressive list of those attempting quads how many actually land the quad and of those how many then go on to badly flub the rest of their programs. It still seems there are precious few skaters who can both land a quad consistently, plus not have major flaws in the rest of their skating, the way Yagudin and Plushenko did in 2002.

Still, it is undeniable that the quad has resurged in a major way this season and I think that's great. Even so, it's not impossible to imagine Daisuke, for example, winning with a failed quad attempt and the rest of his skate perfectly, assuming that his main competitors like Patrick and Kosuka and Oda and whoever else mess up enough. It's not really my bet. I bet (and hope) the winner will have a clean, quad-included performance. But just saying. It seems like it still remains a huge challenge to be able to land two quads in a free skate plus meet all the other COP requirements to be the top skater. That's part of the reason why I was so astonished by Patrick Chan at Canadian nationals. But we'll just have to see if he can pull if off again.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
When has van de Perren done a quad-quad combo? He's done a 4-3-3, but as far as I know, not a 4-4.
 
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Violet Bliss

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
I made the lists of Men at 2011 Worlds with quads in their programs, roughly in order of the reliability/quality of their quads. And by "quads" I mean successful quads.

Podium contenders with or without quads:

Chan*
Oda *
Kozuka
Takahashi

Podium contender with quads required:

Joubert*

Non contenders whose ranking may be greatly enhanced with quads:

Van der Perren*
Fernadez
Gachinski*
Verner
Schultheiss
Bradley*
Amodio

Good quad jumpers not at Worlds:

Hanyu
Menshov*
Reynolds*
Mura*
Mroz*

*With quad combo.

Podium contenders are those with loaded programs they are able to execute with great skills and artistry. They receive both high TES and PCS. Among them Takahashi does not really have a quad, even though he landed one well this season. But he is the PCS king. Joubert does not have great CoP programs but somehow gets high PCS and wins a medal when he lands his quads (which he has not done much this season). The non-contenders' programs simply do not have enough contents to rival the top tier Men, depending on successful quads to lift their scores. Among them Verner has consistently high PCS so he can place really high if he lands his quad.
 
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silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
I'd maybe put Verner and Oda in the same category as Joubert. I know no quad in the SP will hurt Verner a bit, but if he lands it in the FS (and I think he intends to do it in combo with a 3t) then he could maybe sneak onto the podium depending on what the Japanese guys and Joubert do. His PCS have been higher than Joubert's this season too. Oda doesn't need a quad in the SP to medal, but I think he definitely isn't much a contender for a medal if he doesn't land one in the FS, the rest of his skating and his PCS just aren't that special to make up for no quad.
 

Violet Bliss

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
I'd maybe put Verner and Oda in the same category as Joubert. I know no quad in the SP will hurt Verner a bit, but if he lands it in the FS (and I think he intends to do it in combo with a 3t) then he could maybe sneak onto the podium depending on what the Japanese guys and Joubert do. His PCS have been higher than Joubert's this season too. Oda doesn't need a quad in the SP to medal, but I think he definitely isn't much a contender for a medal if he doesn't land one in the FS, the rest of his skating and his PCS just aren't that special to make up for no quad.

Oda has been a Gold medal contender all season long. And any pregnancy news close to Worlds wouldn't stress him out this time.

Vener has done well but his COR win was more given circumstantially than earned. He subsequeant performances at the GPF and the Euro were not great. He hasn't done a quad combo yet so that could be iffy and hurting more than helping. But yes I understand he has better chances of landing on the podium with a best skate and some meltdowns at the top than the rest of the field.

In contrast, Joubert has pulled himself up late in the season, as has our current World Champion whose TES have been abysmal at times. Kozuka, OTOH has been up and down, but within the big league score range.
 
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