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Thread: Should Flatt have skated at the World Championships on an injury?

  1. #16
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    I kind of agree. For me, it comes down to "what rotten luck. Rachael had a stress fracture and couldn't perform her best. If she had the U.S. probably would have gotten its third spot back." If there had been a last minute replacement chances are that person would have finished lower than eighth and it would have come down to "what rotten luck. Rachael had a stress fracture and didn't get to compete. I she had, the U.S. probably would have gotten the third spot back."
    To be clear- the core of this has nothing to do with 3 spots. It's about the unwritten rule- the sportsmanship to step aside when you're injured, or if things look doubtful, at least give the alternate a heads up (granted, we don't know for sure that team Flatt didn't do this) and tell her to BE READY just in case. Also let USFS know. I was surprised when I read Hersh's article and Raith said he had no idea about Flatt's injury.

    Remember when Kwan stepped aside in Torino? Granted, she bothered to make the trip in the first place...but when it became CLEAR AS DAY that she wasn't going to be ready, she stepped aside, giving alternate Emily Hughes enough time to pack up and take her place. Sometimes, even in skating, IMO- it's not ALL about the individual. Sometimes it's best to put the good of the team ahead of your own personal benefit.

    In the end, it's not about the 3 spots, or the woulda-coulda-shoulda. Remember last year when Nagasu tanked the FS at worlds? Yeah, that could have happened again had she gone. If you're injured, and it's hampering your performance level- as was the case for Flatt- you aren't doing the team any favors. It doesn't matter if the alternate can do any better, but it's fair if the alternate(s) is(are) healthier...JMHO.
    Last edited by R.D.; 05-01-2011 at 01:23 AM.

  2. #17
    I think it is important not to blame Rachael directly. Skaters often have very little say in decisions like these as the coaches and/or federations are ultimately in charge. Also, historically there have been many times when injured athletes have been able to push through pain and achieve amazing results. Kerri Strug in the 1996 Olympics anybody? Clearly this didn't happen for Rachael, but it easily could've. And from a purely logistical standpoint, it is very possible that the time frame was too short for Mirai to get a Visa into Russia. And it's no secret that Mirai is not a highly motivated athlete so I doubt she would've been anywhere near ready to compete.

  3. #18
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Judging by Mirai's tweets over the last month, she didn't seem too upset not to be training hard for worlds. She's all about the fun. I adore her and all, but I don't know that she'd have done any better.

    That being said, I really have to wonder why Flatt went through with it. Not sure how the rules play out but if she'd bowwed out after the SP - when she knew darn well her foot was not going to hold up for the long, I have no doubt about that. If your foot can't hold it together for 2.5 minutes how's it going to hold for 4?? - would it have damaged the chances any more/less than her skating? we'd have still kept the two spots at least with Alissa's placement, yes?

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigsisjiejie View Post
    Well, without additional information, we can't do anything more productive than speculate and second-guess.
    Exactly. I'm hesitant to say much about this topic because so many questions are left unanswered. At the moment though, I just feel sorry for the girl. I don't think bombing was exactly what she had in mind when she decided to compete in spite of her injury.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by dlgpffps View Post
    I don't think bombing was exactly what [Flatt] had in mind when she decided to compete in spite of her injury.
    OF COURSE not! Nobody plans on screwing up...

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    Czisny's 5th place, with or without Flatt, would have been enough to hold onto 2 spots. Czisny would have had to be in the top 2 to get 3 spots if she was by herself. Turns out that with Flatt's 12th place finish, Alyssa needed to WIN- and even if she didn't fall in the FS, that wasn't happening. Highest she could have finished, theoretically, is 3rd.

  6. #21
    she takes the audience on her journey of emotions Layfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    Judging by Mirai's tweets over the last month, she didn't seem too upset not to be training hard for worlds. She's all about the fun. I adore her and all, but I don't know that she'd have done any better.

    That being said, I really have to wonder why Flatt went through with it. Not sure how the rules play out but if she'd bowwed out after the SP - when she knew darn well her foot was not going to hold up for the long, I have no doubt about that. If your foot can't hold it together for 2.5 minutes how's it going to hold for 4?? - would it have damaged the chances any more/less than her skating? we'd have still kept the two spots at least with Alissa's placement, yes?
    Well, going into the long Rachael was 7th and Alissa was 4th. It's reasonable to think that Rachael thought or hoped she could at least be good enough to hang onto 7th and at least be part of the team that won the third spot back. It could have happened. Then we'd all be talking about how she was a big hero for skating though the pain.

    To be clear- the core of this has nothing to do with 3 spots. It's about the unwritten rule- the sportsmanship to step aside when you're injured, or if things look doubtful, at least give the alternate a heads up (granted, we don't know for sure that team Flatt didn't do this) and tell her to BE READY just in case. Also let USFS know. I was surprised when I read Hersh's article and Raith said he had no idea about Flatt's injury.
    If you say so. But I have to wonder if this would merit its own thread had the third spot not been on the line. If we had two skaters who placed high enough and one who had a meltdown, it would probably be an afterthought.

    Not saying people don't have the right to ask. I guess Raith is asking although I still stay it's strange that he said he would send a text. It doesn't sound like a very formal or serious inquiry to me.
    Last edited by Layfan; 05-01-2011 at 11:50 AM.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Layfan View Post
    Well, going into the long Rachael was 7th and Alissa was 4th. It's reasonable to think that Rachael thought or hoped she could at least be good enough to hang onto 7th and at least be part of the team that won the third spot back. It could have happened. Then we'd all be talking about how she was a big hero for skating though the pain.
    I totally agree. Skating fans are so fickle.

  8. #23
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    With Michelle she had been nursing injuries all season leading up to the Olympics. She withdrew from Nationals we all know the story. Emily was well aware that she might get the call
    and continued training. I don't know Rachael's situation and if she said the injury just happened I believe her.

    Any news about who Rachael's new coach will be?

  9. #24
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    Flatt was 8th going into the FS. 4th and 8th would have done it. 5th and 8th would have squeaked it out.

  10. #25
    she takes the audience on her journey of emotions Layfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    Flatt was 8th going into the FS. 4th and 8th would have done it. 5th and 8th would have squeaked it out.
    My mistake. But my point remains intact.

  11. #26
    Custom Title Nadia01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Layfan View Post
    P.S. on a side note, I find it kind of odd that Raith is going to text msg team Flatt about this. Text message? I don't know whether to think that means it's not a serious complaint or what.
    IIRC Hersh said Raith was traveling when he was informed of Rachel's injury. So maybe he couldn't really call?

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    Czisny's 5th place, with or without Flatt, would have been enough to hold onto 2 spots.
    That's if the U.S. had only qualified for one spot based in 2010 worlds. If Rachael had withdrawn she would have got an automatic 20th. (I think. Or is it 24th?)

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    That's if the U.S. had only qualified for one spot based in 2010 worlds. If Rachael had withdrawn she would have got an automatic 20th. (I think. Or is it 24th?)
    ah, then perhaps that's why she stayed in knowing they could at least keep 2 spots that way.

  14. #29
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    To be clear- the core of this has nothing to do with 3 spots.
    Then why do I get the feeling that this thread wouldn't exist if a 3rd U.S. lady had been at Worlds this year and done well enough, along with Alissa Czisny, to earn 3 spots for next year?

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    That's if the U.S. had only qualified for one spot based in 2010 worlds. If Rachael had withdrawn she would have got an automatic 20th. (I think. Or is it 24th?)
    Isn't there an exception to this rule, though? Could be mistaken but I think it was mentioned elsewhere.

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