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- May 19, 2011
Mirai Nagasu
- Thread starter kalle
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- Dec 28, 2006
Yes Mirai was training the 3/3 in her short leading up to the olympics. Frank told her not to do it in the event and skate clean (which turned out to be good advice) but that she could go for it at Worlds.
Whick is ******** i think. No way should Ando get higher PCS then Mirai. Reputation scoring at it's worst.
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- Nov 12, 2009
Eh maybe. Miki has really good basics, SS, edges, etc. And this season she actually attempted to emote to her music so I don't really have an issue with her PCS. And she's a 2 time World Champ now so no way are they going to give her PCS in the 50s if she skates well, which she has been this entire season.
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- Jun 3, 2008
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- Sep 22, 2010
PCS has always been a bit baffling to me, and Mirai will need to bolster her reputation if she wants higher PCS. Looking at this year's Worlds PCS in the free, we had for the old-timers:
Kim 66.87
Kostner 64.63
Ando 64.46
Czisny 61.13
Asada 59.94
Looking at Czisny's PCS vs. Asada's, it seems that your most recent results matter most in the effect of reputation on PCS. It's interesting that both Makarova (60.08) and Leonova (61.82) beat Asada in PCS. (Of course there's also politics, hence the Russian ladies' PCS.) Asada's two World titles didn't help her here, and Kim's World and Olympic title just barely put her above Ando. Her season long absence is probably the cause (like Asada, she has no reputation for recently dominating the field).
This results suggest Mirai can easily boost her PCS, despite her flubs in the past, as ISU judges apparently mostly count recent results in PCS reputation bonus. If she can follow up her Four Continents performance with say, a Skate America title, she could likely get close to Ando-level PCS in the rest of the Grand Prix, then get Kim-like PCS at Worlds.
(Conversely, Flatt's performance this season will mean even lower PCS for her next season, despite how "consistent" she was in previous years.)
Kim 66.87
Kostner 64.63
Ando 64.46
Czisny 61.13
Asada 59.94
Looking at Czisny's PCS vs. Asada's, it seems that your most recent results matter most in the effect of reputation on PCS. It's interesting that both Makarova (60.08) and Leonova (61.82) beat Asada in PCS. (Of course there's also politics, hence the Russian ladies' PCS.) Asada's two World titles didn't help her here, and Kim's World and Olympic title just barely put her above Ando. Her season long absence is probably the cause (like Asada, she has no reputation for recently dominating the field).
This results suggest Mirai can easily boost her PCS, despite her flubs in the past, as ISU judges apparently mostly count recent results in PCS reputation bonus. If she can follow up her Four Continents performance with say, a Skate America title, she could likely get close to Ando-level PCS in the rest of the Grand Prix, then get Kim-like PCS at Worlds.
(Conversely, Flatt's performance this season will mean even lower PCS for her next season, despite how "consistent" she was in previous years.)
Mirai has issues rotating her jumps (sometimes even her double axel). And before you disagree with me JEff, I'll say the calls speak for themselves. I'm sceptical about her ever getting a 3axel down at this point. Glad she's working on it.
My main question with Mirai is her motivation. I wonder if she has the will and desire to really be the best especially given Frank's comments.
I remember him saying Mirai "after her great season had a hard time for motivation next season". For me I have a hard time imaging Kim or Asada considering finishing 4th at a major competition, and finishing off the world podium a "great season."
Yes Kim wasn't herself this year, but reports were back in the day Kim was a relentless worker. And reports are the same of Asada. Not being sure if you really want to commit to training hard after winning it all is one thing. Being satisfied with 4th is another altogether. Talented girl, but wonder if she really will reach her potential.
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- Jun 16, 2010
Nagasu skated the absolute best she could have at the Olympics. Why should she have been unhappy for 4th, it was the greatest ladies competition in skating history probably, nobody had expected her to medal, and she would have won many other Olympics with the same skates. If she had kept the momentum from there and done things right since then she would probably be the World Champion by now, but of course she didnt. You can cricticize her for alot of things but criticizing her for being satisfied with her Olympic showing makes no sense.
I'm not criticizing Mirai for how she did at the Olympics, she should have no regrets there-absolutely! Maybe I didn't make myself clear.
My criticisms with Mirai is while she should be pleased with her peformance at the Olympics, the fact that she only finished 4th should also be a source of motivation to improve. After her showing at the Olympics and showing at Worlds, she should have been motivated to actually improve and train harder. Rather according to Frank, Mirai's great sason made it hard for her to have the motivation to train hard.
What I'm saying is that while an athlete should be satisfied that they did their best at the Olympics and gave in good performances. They should be all like well I guess I'm going to stop now and not train as hard, when they only finished 4th. Especiallly if said athlete is as talented as Mirai is.
I want to contrast Mirai's season after the Olympics, with Michelle's at 1994 worlds. Now yes Mirai had an injury but according to Frank Mirai was NOT training hard in the lead up to Nationals.
Michelle Kwan landed 7 triples I beleive and finished 4th at Worlds at 14. Michelle was clearly pleased with her performance and even cried. She placed 4th a truly great achievement for her age. (It really was!) But did Michelle go into next season saying I was 4th! I was the youngest one of the top 4. Clearly I don't need to train that hard, I'm just so happy I was 4th.
Heck no. Michelle went in there and basically said I'm pleased with my performance, but what do I have to do to make sure I NEVER place 4th with that kind of jump content again. What do I have to do to improve. And she improved her artistry, matured and the next year was World Champion.
So what I'm criticizing Mirai for is not her performance at the Olympics, What I'm criticizing Mirai for is being happy with her talent at just having a few GP medals, just win Worlds shorts, and just winning 4 Continents bronze. With her talent and ability. Tara's criticisms, USFSA's reported frustrations-they are quite fair. No one with a championship mentality is completely satisfied with anything but 1st. They aren't satisfied until they are the best. And even when they are the best they are determined to continue to work hard to remain the best- because darn it THEY HATE finishing anything but 1st.
Now sure realically if you do your best and train your hardest like I think someone like Ando does, and your 3rd/4th sometimes than sure your fine with it. But I think its clear according to Frank Mirai wasn't trying her best.
Do you see what I'm saying when I'm criticizing Mirai for being satisified about being only 4th. I'm not criticizing her for the placement she had. But I'm criticizing how she's let it affect her training.
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The PCS for the two Russian skaters were a joke. lol
Despite her accomplishments, I never thought Mao gets much advantage in PCS. Personally, I feel Ando gets held up more compared to what she puts on the ice. So perhaps it's due to being more consistent in competitions. And then there are skaters who are consistently underscored in PCS no matter how well they perform (Czisny, Akiko).
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- Sep 22, 2010
The PCS for the two Russian skaters were a joke. lol
Of course, reputation is only one factor, but still big one. This season, Miki has been the only top lady skater delivering clean consistent results. The other top ladies were either missing or reworking technique.
Nevertheless, a good performance does boost PCS. Look at the top 3 Free skate PCS at 4CC:
Mao - 62.71
Miki - 61.73
Mirai - 60.07
Keep in mind these three had all clean performances. So in the eyes of ISU judges Mirai's almost there with Miki and Mao. One or two more ISU victories and she'll have no PCS disadvantage compared to them.
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- Mar 16, 2005
I won't disagree with you; we all know Mirai has accrued a large number of downgrades and under-rotations in both international and national competitions. I can only think of one instance of her ever having her double axel downgraded - Nationals 2009. Otherwise, and you can look back over the protocols of past events, her double axel is usually scored as one of the best, if not the best of the event. That element is often graded higher than those of skaters who have finished ahead of her. And finally at 2010 Worlds she executed the most beautiful double axel, garnering 2.00 for GOE. And despite her disastrous free at CoC this past season, she's suffered significantly fewer under-rotations and downgrades this season than in the past. Her season culminated with a near perfect free skate at 4CC. I'd still maintain that a fully rotated triple axel is well within her grasp. Yes, that does not mean that she'll ever be credited with landing one in competition, but her issue with under-rotating jumps seems to stem more from nervous or stamina problems than with technique itself. I'd say she's surely inconsistent, but she's still quite capable of technical brilliance as we've all seen. I too would refer the short clip of her triple Lutz-triple toe in the 2010 Olympics short program warm-up.
People have talked that Mirai is a bit of a slow rotator when it comes to jumps. For example Kim (quick rotations) And if I recall correctly the double axel she fell on at Worlds-was ruled underrotated. If it hadnt been she'd have had bronze. I believe at NHK? she may have had an underrotated double axel too.
Yes I agree she's capable of technical brilliance but not sure. My main issue is as I said before i don't know if mirai has the 'will"
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- Nov 12, 2009
The thing that's confusing with Mirai is that her jumps are big, but still prone to under-rotation. The 2a that was downgraded at 09 nationals was really high and big, but still short of rotation. Usually when I think of skaters prone to URs, they have small jumps, like Czisny or Mao recently.
Also, I think Akiko's PCS suffer because she is so prone to mistakes, and as for Czisny, while she is lovely, she skates slowly and looks down at the ice a lot, so I don't think she deserves to get higher PCS considering they are already pretty darn high.
Also, I think Akiko's PCS suffer because she is so prone to mistakes, and as for Czisny, while she is lovely, she skates slowly and looks down at the ice a lot, so I don't think she deserves to get higher PCS considering they are already pretty darn high.
Most of Mriai's problems stem from not being able to handle pressure especially when she has a chance to win. It's hard to believe that it's been since Nationals 2008 that she won an event when leading after the SP. When she gets nervous is when the under-rotated jumps happen. At 4CC she wasn't under as much pressure and she just skated in the LP and skated better then she ever has. She skated like a World Champion. That Mirai if she shows up next season will dominate US skating and make a run at the World Championship.
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- Joined
- May 15, 2009
I was not very happy with the programs Lori did for Mirai this season although the "Geisha" program seemed better by the end of the season.
I did like the programs Lori did for Mirai's Olympic season which seemed to bring out her best.
I see no reason to try and model Mirai after Michelle or anyone else. Mirai has a distinctly playful personality on the ice and no reason to try and turn her into a fake drama queen.
This is the Mirai I hope to see back this season:
http://www.youtube.com/user/JavyerSal?blend=7&ob=5#p/u/0/ML3PALXXydw
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- Jul 26, 2003
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A fictitious one in a tribute montage video ???
Did you link the program you wanted to? ( I wonder if you were misled by the costume?)
Here's the Mirai I want to see again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RIDpUGdMPM
The Mirai of the Worlds 2010 SP !
or the Olympic SP would do
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19I1HKAG_9o
Did you link the program you wanted to? ( I wonder if you were misled by the costume?)
Here's the Mirai I want to see again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RIDpUGdMPM
The Mirai of the Worlds 2010 SP !
or the Olympic SP would do
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19I1HKAG_9o
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- Joined
- May 15, 2009
I linked a montage which showed Mirai from 2010. That was my point.
I liked her programs and SPIRIT that season.
Her Olympic SP that you linked was about the 3rd best from that season. Worlds and Natls were both clearly better.
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