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Thread: Melissa Bulanhagui

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    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    Melissa Bulanhagui


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    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    I am so happy for her, I hope she could go to the Olympics, 4cc and Worlds!

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    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DynFcQKjdLM

    She was incredible during the US Nationals!

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    I wish her the best of luck in her switch I think its a smart move

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    Gotta Have Music iluvtodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by christinaskater View Post
    I am so happy for her, I hope she could go to the Olympics, 4cc and Worlds!
    I would to see that in her future!

    Quote Originally Posted by christinaskater View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DynFcQKjdLM

    She was incredible during the US Nationals!
    I spoke to her parents after the free skate (they were sitting in our section). They were so thrilled that Melissa finished in the top ten.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pikachuusb View Post
    I wish her the best of luck in her switch I think its a smart move
    Wishing her all the best. I hope she continues to train in Delaware!

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    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    I reckon that she would continue training in Delaware since she studies there.

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    mylastduchess
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    I really think ISU needs to have stricter laws on citizenship requirements, since almost all of South East Asian skaters are made up of American skaters. like I actually want to see skaters from those country compete even if they will not be getting any medals soon but at least they should actually be given a chance to represent their own country.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mylastduchess View Post
    I really think ISU needs to have stricter laws on citizenship requirements, since almost all of South East Asian skaters are made up of American skaters. like I actually want to see skaters from those country compete even if they will not be getting any medals soon but at least they should actually be given a chance to represent their own country.
    Care to elaborate on what you would advise the ISU to implement?

    I'm pretty sure the ISU does not want to get in the business of determining which skater legitimately has which citizenship. Eligibility for citizenship should rightfully remain an issue for individual countries to decide and enforce. Eligibility for skating representing a country--an issue for the national federation. Dual citizens have a choice, what's the problem with that?

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    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    By doing what you propose, skating would not be possible in SE Asian nations. To use the Philippines as an example, if it weren't for Filipino - American skaters who wanted the opportunity to compete internationally then the Philippines might not be able to obtain ISU membership, which require at least two rinks in member nations. One rink was built for recreational purposes. The second was built when several US skaters wanted to represent the Philippines. Also if the ISU tightened its control then its not only stepping on a nation's jurisdiction but then we may never enjoy the following skaters: Viktor Pfeiffer, Tanith Belbin, Kaitlyn Weaver, Isabella Tobias, Charissa Thansonboom, Allapach and Kongkasem, Diane De Leeuw - Chapman, Charlene Von Sager,Lily Lee...

  10. #10
    mylastduchess
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigsisjiejie View Post
    Care to elaborate on what you would advise the ISU to implement?

    I'm pretty sure the ISU does not want to get in the business of determining which skater legitimately has which citizenship. Eligibility for citizenship should rightfully remain an issue for individual countries to decide and enforce. Eligibility for skating representing a country--an issue for the national federation. Dual citizens have a choice, what's the problem with that?
    sorry I didn't mean the actual citizenship of a skater but the actual requirements to represent a country. of coarse pairs and Ice dance is different but still like the olympics someone like Tanith still needed to have full American citizenship in order to compete. Just look at the 4CC last year almost half of the girls competing (Puerto Rico, Chinese Taipei, Thailand etc.) where American born and raised, and I will bet that most of those girls barely set foot on the country they are representing let alone speak the local language.

    Think about it what motivation would federations from smaller countries from actually investing in their own skaters, when they could simply import someone from America who has benefited from USFSA programs? How would local skaters gain exposure, if they will never get a chance to be in any important events (they may not be winning medals now, but they are potentially future coaches, choreographers etc.) foreign skaters will not in the long run will not push for the advancement of the sport as much as local skaters would.

    like right now I just saw a very talented home grown talent from the Philippines in the JPG but he only got 1 assignment because his federation decided to give other assignment to a subpar American skater instead.

    If the Isu can limit a skater switching countries 1 year from participating from international competition when they represented another country from a year before, then why can't they extend that to 2-3 years if a skater joined a nationals or regionals for another country the year before?

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    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    I think in the Philippines, they are allowed dual citizenship, so that is a good thing.

    Melissa needs to have better costumes, more sophisticated and classy look, a little more ballet training to enhance the musicality much further.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mylastduchess View Post
    like right now I just saw a very talented home grown talent from the Philippines in the JPG but he only got 1 assignment because his federation decided to give other assignment to a subpar American skater instead.
    Then your gripe isn't really with the ISU, it's with the federation(s), right? Sounds like you want the ISU to play Nanny, Big Brother, or Enforcer with some sort of additional rules, since the federations don't necessarily see things your way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mylastduchess View Post
    Think about it what motivation would federations from smaller countries from actually investing in their own skaters, when they could simply import someone from America who has benefited from USFSA programs? How would local skaters gain exposure, if they will never get a chance to be in any important events (they may not be winning medals now, but they are potentially future coaches, choreographers etc.) foreign skaters will not in the long run will not push for the advancement of the sport as much as local skaters would.
    It depends how long their local program has been in existence, how good the local skaters are, and how old they are.
    For JGP you want skaters who can do all the double jumps including double axel (required in the short program) and who are getting component marks at least in the 3s (preferably higher). A skater of average talent with average coaching and not a lot of training time may not reach that level at all, or not until maybe 7 or more years after starting to train in the sport. A more talented skater or one who has access to the best coaching and plenty of training time (i.e., probably training abroad in a country with a more established program) may get there sooner. If they're talented enough to get there before they're 13, they have to wait until they're old enough to get sent on the JGP.

    So while the local skaters may still be working on skills at a level below junior, it can make sense to put the federation out on the international circuit with an imported skater, especially one who has connections to that country and will travel there to skate and inspire the younger skaters coming up in the new program.

    like right now I just saw a very talented home grown talent from the Philippines in the JPG but he only got 1 assignment because his federation decided to give other assignment to a subpar American skater instead.
    When you say "subpar," do you mean by American standards, or compared to the homegrown Philippine skater?

    Assuming they are both of comparable ability and there are only two JGP slots available for that country, it makes more sense from a development point of view to have two skaters with JGP experience than to have one skater with two assignments but no chance of qualifying for the final and another skater with no international experience.

    See the JGP announcement here:
    http://www.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/pa...v-list,00.html

    Federations who sent a skater to Junior Worlds last year who didn't qualify for the short program get to send one skater to three events on the JGP. Federations who did not send anyone to Junior Worlds get only two slots. Was the local skater too young last year and the imported skater not yet committed to the new country? Or did they just not choose to spend the money on sending someone?

    If they want more JGP slots next year, they have to send someone to Junior Worlds this year. If that skater makes it to the short program or to the final, they'll get four or five slots next year, so they'd do best to choose the skater with the best chance of advancing. If they hold a national championship and let the skaters compete against each other at the same time and place, they can use those results to choose the JW representative. If not, they can choose based on JGP results. Either way, they'll have a backup skater with some experience in case the first choice gets injured.

    If the homegrown skater is better than the imported one, then that's who should be chosen for the one JW spot. And if there are enough JGP slots the next year to give everyone one spot and still have the option to give someone a second slot, then the one with the best results should probably get that second spot.

    At the senior level, for skaters over 15 and especially those over 19 who are not eligible for juniors, the only restriction on sending skaters to "senior B" events is the money it costs to send them.

    But for Four Continents/Europeans/Worlds, now the skaters first need to have met a minimum technical score at a previous event to qualify even to enter the initial round. Essentially, the senior B circuit is where new skaters can earn their way into the elite circuit. So if no homegrown skater has yet met that minimum or is likely to do so in the near future, it would make sense to import a skater who can meet it so the federation can have a representative at Worlds and 4Cs. (4Cs still allows three entries per discipline, so if there are up to three skaters who qualify, whether imported or homegrown, the federation could send all three and perhaps take results there into account before deciding which one to send to Worlds.)

    If the Isu can limit a skater switching countries 1 year from participating from international competition when they represented another country from a year before, then why can't they extend that to 2-3 years if a skater joined a nationals or regionals for another country the year before?
    The ISU only cares about what happens internationally. They don't pay attention to what happens in the domestic competitions of their member federations. Oh, yeah, they do ask for a list of the top finishers at each nationals and publish them once a year, but not all federations submit the information. For one thing, not all federations hold national championships, if they don't have enough skaters to make it worthwhile.

  14. #14
    mylastduchess
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigsisjiejie View Post
    Then your gripe isn't really with the ISU, it's with the federation(s), right? Sounds like you want the ISU to play Nanny, Big Brother, or Enforcer with some sort of additional rules, since the federations don't necessarily see things your way.
    Uhmmm who makes the laws for the sport? Isn't it the ISU, who enforces the 1 year limit on skaters whose switching skaters? The Isu isn't so all of a sudden an extension of the one year ban for switching skaters is such a big deal for you...

    so why not just let those smaller federation stop training all their own skaters if they will never gonna have a chance to represent their own country anyways? You know cause its healthy for the sport to have most of its international skater born and raised from one country!

  15. #15
    mylastduchess
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    Quote Originally Posted by gkelly View Post
    It depends how long their local program has been in existence, how good the local skaters are, and how old they are.
    For JGP you want skaters who can do all the double jumps including double axel (required in the short program) and who are getting component marks at least in the 3s (preferably higher). A skater of average talent with average coaching and not a lot of training time may not reach that level at all, or not until maybe 7 or more years after starting to train in the sport. A more talented skater or one who has access to the best coaching and plenty of training time (i.e., probably training abroad in a country with a more established program) may get there sooner. If they're talented enough to get there before they're 13, they have to wait until they're old enough to get sent on the JGP.

    So while the local skaters may still be working on skills at a level below junior, it can make sense to put the federation out on the international circuit with an imported skater, especially one who has connections to that country and will travel there to skate and inspire the younger skaters coming up in the new program.
    I just want to make some stuff clear, Its not that I dislike smaller federations for importing some skaters abroad but now they almost seems to depend on them heavily. Remember a few years ago when Taiwan just published an add for a skater in the US to represent them in Worlds in Los Angeles?



    When you say "subpar," do you mean by American standards, or compared to the homegrown Philippine skater?
    subpar to compete internationally (and yes the other skater outscores him quite a bit ).

    Assuming they are both of comparable ability and there are only two JGP slots available for that country, it makes more sense from a development point of view to have two skaters with JGP experience than to have one skater with two assignments but no chance of qualifying for the final and another skater with no international experience.

    See the JGP announcement here:
    http://www.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/pa...v-list,00.html

    Federations who sent a skater to Junior Worlds last year who didn't qualify for the short program get to send one skater to three events on the JGP. Federations who did not send anyone to Junior Worlds get only two slots. Was the local skater too young last year and the imported skater not yet committed to the new country? Or did they just not choose to spend the money on sending someone?

    If they want more JGP slots next year, they have to send someone to Junior Worlds this year. If that skater makes it to the short program or to the final, they'll get four or five slots next year, so they'd do best to choose the skater with the best chance of advancing. If they hold a national championship and let the skaters compete against each other at the same time and place, they can use those results to choose the JW representative. If not, they can choose based on JGP results. Either way, they'll have a backup skater with some experience in case the first choice gets injured.

    If the homegrown skater is better than the imported one, then that's who should be chosen for the one JW spot. And if there are enough JGP slots the next year to give everyone one spot and still have the option to give someone a second slot, then the one with the best results should probably get that second spot.

    At the senior level, for skaters over 15 and especially those over 19 who are not eligible for juniors, the only restriction on sending skaters to "senior B" events is the money it costs to send them.

    But for Four Continents/Europeans/Worlds, now the skaters first need to have met a minimum technical score at a previous event to qualify even to enter the initial round. Essentially, the senior B circuit is where new skaters can earn their way into the elite circuit. So if no homegrown skater has yet met that minimum or is likely to do so in the near future, it would make sense to import a skater who can meet it so the federation can have a representative at Worlds and 4Cs. (4Cs still allows three entries per discipline, so if there are up to three skaters who qualify, whether imported or homegrown, the federation could send all three and perhaps take results there into account before deciding which one to send to Worlds.)
    The local skater actually placed 8th in a JPG managing to get some points and actually has potential, the other one has none. I don't why the Philippines didn't send a representative last year at JW (I would guess its because of finances from either the federation or the skaters lack of funds). But at the end of the day the Philippine federation is hurting their own skater by only giving him one or two international assignment each year cause he will never rise up in the rankings and will always have an early skater order in major competitions

    Imagine if someone from one of those smaller countries actually manages to win a spot in the Olympics, but then in the Olympic year somebody from the US or Europe decides to compete for that country and manages to get the spot instead. I don't think that would be very fair.
    Last edited by mylastduchess; 09-16-2011 at 01:49 PM.

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