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Thread: What will the 2011/2012 season bring us in ice dance?

  1. #46
    Constable , Costume Police colleen o'neill's Avatar
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    To judge by the audience response to V/M at world's, I don't think D/W can be seen to have taken a really definitive lead .OTOH, I wouldn't classify D/W's win as a default win. Tessa was barely back from injury , so we don't know how much better they could have been with more training time , but Charlie and Meryl 's material was not as perfectly suited to them as has been the case in the past. We've known these couples to be very close for years , so assuming both stay healthy (knock on wood ) we're right back to it being a brand new game every year.

    Earlier , on another thread , doris made the excellent point that whether you think D/W nailed the Tango or not , the work they put in to perfect the dance will keep paying off for them in the future. I'm quite sure this is true. And if Tessa's medical problem is truly behind her, V/M also have the possibility of progressing .Goodness knows what perfection we've yet to see. These two couples are so good , so young and they're bound to be forever linked in the history of the sport.
    Last edited by colleen o'neill; 05-25-2011 at 09:15 PM.

  2. #47
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    People seem to be assuming that Chock & Zuerlein are going to stay together next year. I'm not so sure......

  3. #48
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Why? Have you heard that either Madison or Greg or both are on ice partner search? Truly, I can't see how splitting up would benefit them, unless one or the other is just ready to retire. They were top ten at Worlds and 3rd at US Nationals and as such get 2 GPs and a trip to Nationals without having to do regionals or sectionals. Madison, particularly, is very young. The only reason I can think of for them to split is because one or the other wants to pursue something other than skating.

    And colleen, I am definitely excited to see what both V&M and D&W decide to do this season. One thing I like about both couples is that they start ODs/SDs by taking ballroom lessons in the dance they are working on. D&W have already started working on their SD, according to an article in Detroit Free Press, again by taking lessons in Latin ballroom. V&M have always been a bit less public than D&W about their training, so the fact that I haven't heard doesn't mean a single thing about whether they have started training for next season or not.

    However, a look at their schedule makes me wonder whether they have really left enough time to prepare for next season. I wonder whether they might opt to skate the last 2 GPs?

    They are doing Korean SOI and a tour in China, and The Ice in Japan, as well as the Detroit benefit for Japan.
    Last edited by dorispulaski; 05-25-2011 at 11:54 PM.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by cornell08 View Post
    People seem to be assuming that Chock & Zuerlein are going to stay together next year. I'm not so sure......
    Who knows how they feel now. They must have mixed emotions. It was a very successful season for them in one sense, yet in another it must be hard to see the Shibutanis fly so far away from them. With Samuelson & Bates returning and some other up and comers it seems inevitable they will be relegated to a fierce fight for even the #3 spot in the U.S in coming seasons, with little chance to move up barring major improvements. I hope they stay together and make making it to Sochi and climbing the World rankings as a goal. They are still young and have possabilities.

    And frankly I cant imagine the idea either one would do any better with another partner.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pangtongfan View Post
    I think ice dancing is still somewhat political and D/W now being the reigning World Champions will give them the slight edge in future competitions with V/M for now even if both teams are fully healthy and at their best, despite that I think V/M are the better team. Personally I consider them technically equal but V/M artistically much stronger, but I doubt that is how the scores will come out now. V/M's injury opened the door for D/W and they took it and ran with it, and with the nature of ice dance it is theirs to lose for the forseeable future IMO. Anyway I could be wrong but that is my current hunch. BTW I am in no way questoining D/W's World title. They were the better and more prepared team at Worlds, as they should have been with far more preparation and training time, and rightfully won. I am just saying how I think things will be even if V/M and D/W both stay completely healthy next season now that D/W have the momentum.

    I also have a feeling V/M will retire before Sochi, especialy if they start losing regularly to D/W which I think might happen. D/W on the other hand I am pretty sure will be there in Sochi, regardless what happens results wise between now and then.


    While I think there is some marking based on reputation (just ask W/P about that) CoP is a huge improvement over the old system in this regard. Even if we do factor in reputation, I do not think V/M were hurt long term at all by D/W winning. D/W absolutely deserved to win. However, V/M surgery would have sidelined other lesser teams for at least the season and maybe permanently. They took risks with a very difficult program far outside their comfort zone, which they only competed once. They beat D/W on the SD. And they still took home #2 in the world. And they are still the reigning Olympic champions. The reality is that healthy D/W and healthy V/M are going to push each other hopefully for years to come. I think the slight edge goes to V/M, but it will depend on how each skates on the given day. And we fans get to watch a great show. I hope that both teams stay to Sochi. I think V/M will at least stay until worlds 2013 to lock in 3 spots for Canada at the Olympics, and try to win a world title in their home town of London, Ontario.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by cornell08 View Post
    People seem to be assuming that Chock & Zuerlein are going to stay together next year. I'm not so sure......
    I don't get this. Why wouldn't they stay together? Yes, they will likely be stuck in a battle for 3rd for a number of years yet. But that gives them time to grow and develop and mature. They are still very young. It used to be that teams didn't find real success until their 30's. What's the rush? I don't think it would be difficult for them to figure out their place in the US system. Except for the year they had growth issues, the Shibs have always been a very special, amazing team. They wouldn't have expected to go to worlds this year, except for Bate's injury. It was a cinderella year for them, and hopefully gives them courage and confidence for the future. If they work hard, and continue to grow and develop, when they get to worlds again, they will be stellar. And thanks to their placement at worlds this year, they will continue to have international exposure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernDancers View Post
    Had P/B not fallen, P/B would have been on the podium. Shibs winning 3rd is a fluke. And some felt that it should have been W/P of Canada instead, on the strength of their SD and then clean FD.
    Yes, the Shibutanis won bronze because P/B fell. But had P/B not fallen, the Shibs would still have been 4th and W/P 5th, since the Shibs beat W/P in both SD and FD, by 3.47 points overall---not a tiny margin in ice dance. Why "some" would have W/P 3rd is a puzzlement.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by colleen o'neill View Post
    To judge by the audience response to V/M at world's, I don't think D/W can be seen to have taken a really definitive lead ..
    O yes - for "Megasport" like one time said Belbin: "secod were better then the first" This all about intertaining.
    V-M cloul be behind D-W in next season, but not because D-W improved or they are so good. USA didnt have any chance to win even bronz medal at other competition - only pairs. Canada have Chan

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by npa View Post
    O yes - for "Megasport" like one time said Belbin: "secod were better then the first" This all about intertaining.
    V-M cloul be behind D-W in next season, but not because D-W improved or they are so good. USA didnt have any chance to win even bronz medal at other competition - only pairs. Canada have Chan
    We all know you are a V&M uber, but saying that D&W aren't good enough to win Worlds and did so only because the US didn't have other medalists in the other disciplines, just makes you look ridiculous.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KKonas View Post
    We all know you are a V&M uber, but saying that D&W aren't good enough to win Worlds and did so only because the US didn't have other medalists in the other disciplines, just makes you look ridiculous.
    No, this is V-M arent good enough to win WCh on more time

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckm View Post
    Yes, the Shibutanis won bronze because P/B fell. But had P/B not fallen, the Shibs would still have been 4th and W/P 5th, since the Shibs beat W/P in both SD and FD, by 3.47 points overall---not a tiny margin in ice dance. Why "some" would have W/P 3rd is a puzzlement.
    As amazing as the Shibs are, W/P had a simply stellar SD. There were many on the discussion boards at the time that commented that W/P had a lovely skate, and were under-scored. I'm not sure about scores, but I also think the W/P SD was elegent, mature, gorgeous.... Shibs are a really great team, but they do not yet have the elegance and maturity of W/P. Maybe Shibs compensate with cleaner feet, pointed toes, etc. I happen to like both teams. I probably would have scored W/P higher than Shibs in the SD. I'm not sure about the FD. Was never a fan of their FD all season.

  12. #57
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    W-P were really greate at this WCh. They show greate speed, power and elegance. I dont like there FD, but IMHO- they could be third.
    I love Shibs FD, but not so much there SD. They was cute in FD, but maybe didnt lookm like senior skaters yeat in there style. But this is really team for gold in Sochi (they will foght with I-K IMHO)

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    Weaver and Poje could keep both Shibs and Euros off the podium in 2012 and then if Shibs are fourth and Europes highest palcement is fifth that would truly be the ghettoization of Europe in Ice Dance and they would be totally irrelevent and a huge joke for years to come.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernDancers View Post
    W/P had a simply stellar SD.....I probably would have scored W/P higher than Shibs in the SD. I'm not sure about the FD. Was never a fan of their FD all season.
    In the SD, Shibutanis outscored W/P in both TES and PCS. Interestingly, W/P did better in the FD than they did in the SD. W/P were fourth in the FD, but seventh in the SD, behind V/M, D/W, P/B, Shibs, B/S and I/K. Apparently, the judges didn't think as highly of their SD as you do.

  15. #60
    Constable , Costume Police colleen o'neill's Avatar
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    I understood that a number of commentators in Europe thought W/P were undermarked in the SD. The Shibs had a fabulous competition , but I wasn't sure they should have been ahead of W/P in the SD. I can't really be completely objective about the FD ,because I've adored the Shibs' FD all season, but haven't been keen on W/P's. (That said, W/P did skate it really well)...I certainly didn't agree with the judges about I/K's placement in the SD, I thought they were gifted..and maybe B/S were a bit, too..I really like B/S a lot, but I didn't think their 2nd SD was as good as their first..

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