10-02-2011, 07:00 PM
Thank you, thank you, thank you for these videos!!!! I have to admit, I hate to see all the falls, but I have this immediate positive impression of Chan's LP. Many people get tired of Aranjuez, but it sucks me in every time, and I like how is natural speed and flow somehow fits with this. Can't wait to see this program get better with time.
It is so great to see Rochette again (come back, come back!). I don't quite have a feeling about Alyssa's LP yet - it is in some ways beautiful or potentially so. Maybe it just needs more mileage - but it felt to me, too, a bit empty or like something just wasn't quite convincing about it; and when I turned the sound off, it looked rushed (and I don't mean she seemed to be skating quickly, just that little spots where she seemed to rush toward elements or out of them). But, it is very early in the season and I so look forward to watching her progress (would love to see her win a lot, too!!!!).
10-02-2011, 07:09 PM
On the Ice
10-02-2011, 07:11 PM
Wowwowwow! She still moves a bit coltish but she could be absolutely incredible by the time Sochi comes around. Other than the jumps, her skating reminds me a bit of Yamaguchi. (Obviously Liza's jumps are wayyy bigger).
Originally Posted by theresa
10-02-2011, 08:36 PM
I agree! Her movement is still a bit rough around the edges, but she has a sort of exotic look and feel that is rare on the ice. Her spins could use a lot of work still, but here's hoping she has an amazing GP season and doesn't peak too early!
Originally Posted by drivingmissdaisy
Thanks! This is her SP this season and it looks great!
Originally Posted by poloska
Last edited by LeCygne; 10-02-2011 at 08:40 PM.
10-02-2011, 10:44 PM
To my untrained eye, Dai seemed a bit "exposed" in his exhibition program: His blade seemed to wobble (very slightly) here and there as if unable to hold his gliding edge in a low speed as good as such world champions as Jeffrey Buttle and Stéphane Lambiel. Dai usually skated fast, so it never occurred to me as his possible weakness.
What Liza impressed me most was her use of hands, wrists, and fingers. I was awed by so many expressions that came out of the two little hands of that young girl. Outstanding!!!
Chan's LP is full of difficult jump entrances, reminiscent of Takeshi Honda's Concierto de Aranjuez, also choreographed by Lori. What Chan still needs to work on is his posture and body lines, though they have been improved but not excellent enough to complement the great music and ingenious choreography of that program. If skated clean, it is a program very hard to beat.
Last edited by skatinginbc; 10-02-2011 at 11:33 PM.
10-02-2011, 11:19 PM
As the JO videos spread all over the world in warp speed, I want to acknowledge and thank the source, kakuhuohong of Baidu, since I have no convenient way of contacting her. (Stealing from her was easy and convenient though. )
Having watched most of the skaters, I'm duely impressed by many beautiful though imperfect skating. My favorites turn out to be the Canadians, , Chan, Rochette, and Buttle. Gachinsky is really impressive, with a giant leap in choreo and presentation, as is his compatriot the young wonderful Liza. She is so tiny so I have some concern about her future development. The Japanese are capable of much more than what they put out in this pre-season competition. Kozuka is a great skater but this program is not exciting. Dai showed technical weaknesses. I hope it's a stage in his training and not a trend.
Buttle skated beautifully and was technically strong as well but for running out of gas. Joannie? Still Canada's best and one of the world's best. I just loved her Firebird. Alissa has an (over) ambitious program but her many major point robbing flaws are "invisible" technical ones and her strength (spins) very obvious so she may look very beautiful and get the "wazrobbeds".
Chan's Aranjuez took me in instantly and carried me all the way through. After two watchings, I suddenly realized I didn't notice the step sequences. The whole program is a seamless step sequence with jumps popping up here and there, never intrusive, like waves that disappeared back into the ocean. The last fall was on a jump with the craziest entry! This program turned out to be very emotional for me, partly because of the very soft spot in my heart for Spanish/classical guitar, and Patrick's program and skating are so in tune with the feelings of Aranjuez and flowed all the way through. I mentioned before that although Aranjuez was considered overused in skating, I found it so beautiful yet its emotions had not been truly portrayed in skating before. (Sorry to fans of various great skaters.) Patrick really captured the emotions for me. I was not surprised knowing he chose it for his emotional connection with it, still I could not know how I would experience this program. It was mesmerizing in a sweet and sad way.
As it is, it's not about the technical prowess or flaws for me. It is imperfect but it's all about the feelings. As I said, all the jumps come out and go back amidst steps. Insanely difficult. Falls will be gone soon enough. One thing about Patrick's falls, he springs up instantly, in the choreography before he is completely up. There is hardly any interuption. Kozuka too got up very quickly from his fall but Dai for some reason took a long time to get back into his program. Big difference.
I can hardly wait to experience this Aranjuez when it is well seasoned and skated flawlessly, or nearly so.
Last edited by SkateFiguring; 10-02-2011 at 11:31 PM.
10-02-2011, 11:32 PM
You watched only TWICE? Surprise!!! I watched four times in a row. Speaking of "mesmerizing in a sad way", I'm afraid I have to say Takeshi Honda created a feel of sadness in his Aranjuez better than Chan's.
Originally Posted by SkateFiguring
10-03-2011, 12:37 AM
Skatinginbc, I watched Aranjuez twice in a row, then took a break, and watched some others. Came back to watch it twice in a row again. Maybe more. I don't want to indulge because I know it will get even better.
After your post, I searched for and watched Honda's Aranjuez, trice. The first was completely ruined by the loud non-stop yupping of the commentators. Then I watched his bronze medal performance in 2002 Worlds. Ah, no commentators! It was the same or similar cut of music as Patrick's, not surprising since Lori did both. A great skate even with a fall and a step out. I watched it again, paying more attention to the music. Then I realized a reason I didn't get as much feeling out of his skate is that he was not able to use certain parts of the music like Patrick and skated through them. It takes Patrick's skating skills to make certain parts work so beautifully, without making it obvious. i.e. he makes me feel the music instead of his working the music or showing his skills. That increased my appreciation.
10-03-2011, 02:27 AM
Originally Posted by theresa
I think there is a lot to like in this program. And some stuff, not so much. On the positive side, her jumps are impressive! Will she add a triple axel to this? She is going to be tough to beat on the tech side if she does. I also liked her speed and confidence on the ice and the lack of my two most hated moves, the Biellman layback and the I-spin. She has very nice line and, of course, she is very cute. On the negative side, I hated the brassy music when she went into her footwork--cheesy. Her spins did not impress and I would like to see an arabesque spiral instead of the Biellmann--or at least in addition to. It will be interesting to see how she develops. Because she is still so young, it is hard to say if she will realize her potential, which is very high, indeed.
ETA: I also liked her flying sit spin.
Last edited by jenaj; 10-03-2011 at 02:47 AM.
10-03-2011, 02:45 AM
Skating is art, if you let it be.
*It was great to see Buttle skate to Naqoyqasi again! He was treating this as a very real competition too, bringing the 3Axel back into his repertoire.
*Daisuke's program definitely has a lot of promise. I hope he can get all of his confidence and the jumps back.
*I admired a few parts of Chan's program, and his basic skating ability really is the best in the World, but he lacks the ability to convey profound emotions. And 3 falls in a program yet again. He did not deserve to win this competition.
*Arthur Gachinski deserved to win. It was easily the best of the competition technically and his program is interesting and well-conveyed. He just needs to work on the timing of a few of the moments. Definitely a contender for another World medal.
*Florent Amodio is now officially the first guy to try 6 jumping passes in the second half of his program. Coach Morosov seems to think his strategy that worked with Miki Ando will work here too. I don't find this to be a wise move because Amodio's program is more taxing in the first half with the long step sequence (and much more difficult jumps). He can't just open with a couple of relatively easy jumps and waste time with a Spiral Sequence, as Miki Ando did in her program. Overall this program for Florent Amodio is not nearly as effective as the program he had last year. I don't think the judges will treat him too kindly...and they shouldn't.
*Takahiko Kozuka skated well but his program is sadly not nearly as good as I was hoping for. The beautiful, longing chords of Nausicaa are mostly wasted in the first part and then the program ineffectively cuts to a different soundtrack for large chunk of the program before returning back to more Nausicaa music that is misplaced for that ending part of the program. This is a mostly pleasant program but it should have been a masterpiece. Also, I very much miss the 2009 and 2010 Takahiko Kozuka. He used to have such a gentle elegance and beautifully nuanced movement. Nausicaa would have been absolutely perfect for him (especially a great program to it, which this isn't). These days, he seems to be concentrating too hard and "trying" to project too much. The emotion is lost in the process.
*Alissa's program and performance was very sleepy. I'm not liking it very much. She is a skater who has quite a bit of prep time for her jumps and this program really emphasizes that; it becomes tedious. It's nice to see her try and up her technical level, though, with the 3Lutz-3Toe attempt (ultimately, however, the 3Toe-3Toe is probably going to be a lot more realistic for her) and trying to bring her 3Sal back.
*Speaking of the Triple Salchow, does any female in the World do a better one than Joannie Rochette? She owns that move.
*I was very surprised by the choice of music when Alena Leonova started skating. And then when it cuts to the Requiem for a Dream music later in the program...just, wow. I think this might be most OPPRESSIVE program ever? I give her credit for trying to skate to this and if she can reign in the flailing a little bit and not seem quite as peppy in the latter half, it could actually be a powerful piece. Very powerfully oppressive, that is.
*Elizaveta Tuktamysheva has great energy and great jumps, and a solid program too, but she needs to learn now to stop rushing all of her choreography. If she can do that and just add a bit more maturity into the performance as well, she will definitely be a huge contender.
*The best lady of this competition for me was Akiko Suzuki. Excellent presentation, excellent footwork, and big jumps (that was definitely her best 2Axel-3Toe ever!!!). Not as much jump content as Elizaveta, but enough for her superior performance ability to clear the gap in my opinion.
10-03-2011, 04:51 AM
leave no stone unturned
It is a treat to watch videos on a Monday morning!
Akiko and Liza
I love Akiko Lp, hopefully she will go to worlds this season, and Liza, wow, she is a little star, her smile after the second 3-3, weeee!And has great dress! Her landing style reminds me of Yuna.. with pointed toes. She looks like a junior still, but a diva junior!
Joannie should come back! And great costume for Firebird, but I dont want to listen to this music ever again! Leonova program I dont like, neither the sp I saw from test skate, she makes me anxious somehow.
Alisa has a nice music choice but of the same style and I have totally forgotten the program already.
From men, Dai''s program is so much better than last year's and i didnt mind the mistakes , love the costume as well!
Patrick looks more matured, I liked the costume, program dunno..but because Nichol is determined to give every Kwan music program to new skaters. I really want to see Patrick skate to more original music and doesnt end up his carreer only with warhorses ala Lysacek, or as a friend of mine said, Nichol should buy a new cd. I m looking forward to seeing him with other choreographers, he would make miracles with Camerlengo.
Now Kozuka, this is a music choice! I realized Kozu has a certain style of costumes, they look claustrophobic somehow, but I like his program, especially for a man and hopefully he will like it too, cause now he looked rough still!
Arthur has really matured and looks determined, and the jumps look great but why he has a tale thing in the costume like last year, it is distracting and looks like a penguin!
Buttle is a pro now and it shows, by far the best performance.
Amodio I didnt watch the program yet, but saw the costume , is he skating to Cats musical? the shirt is awful and I got afraid the program would also be relevant to the costume, I know he became Euro Champion and all under Morozov but I miss the olympic season kind of programs...
From all, Hanyu on Carnival was the most awesome, cant wait to see him competing this season. (and he gets taller and taller!)
10-03-2011, 04:54 AM
Off the ice
I've watched the men's programs, or tried to watch is probably more accurate. I don't care how many quads to guys are adding, it looks like we are in for a dull season on the artistic side, and this saddens me. Skating should be a combination of athleticism and artistry, and these days packing in transitions often passes for artistry, and actual musical interpretation and performance is not emphasized enough to my liking.
In no particular order:
1. Dai - I am sorry but I can only take so much Blues for Klook. I decided to amuse myself by putting it on mute and using different music, and it was vastly improved. Maybe Dai can be convinced to do the same?
2. Florent - if he's not removed from Morozov's group soon, he'll become unwatchable. What a waste of a good skater; Morozov can't even showcase Flo's natural musicality, something I had not thought possible.
3. Patrick Chan - yes, he has the skating skills, but I would like to see him skate a program that requires more than showcasing said skills. It was dull. He needs a fresh perspective with the choreography, but so long as he's getting rewarded for this paint by numbers stuff, it'll never happen.
4. Gachinski - I think I like the program, but he needs to be more committed to what he's doing.
5. I only watched Kozuka to the end because he's skating to Joe Hisaishi music; I am willing to be very forgiving when skaters use something by Hisaishi. I don't see how this program breaks any new ground artistically for him, though, and generally agree with Blades' take on the misuse of the music.
6. Jeffrey Buttle was lovely, even with the jump mistakes. I really liked the way the program was structured and how he used the music, and I agree, he has improved as a performer in his pro years. For the life of my I can't understand why he's not getting more choreography work; he has a really great understanding of how to work with the system without making it look like he's doing everything for points.
Like Seniorita, I found Hanyu very enjoyable. More enjoyable than most everyone in the actual JO, in fact.
10-03-2011, 06:50 AM
Takeshi Honda just had that subtle sad face, suppressed yet convincing . The best part was towards the end, especially when the music stopped and he covered or wiped his face with his hand (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QB1Aj...eature=related). Every time I watch it, I just feel sad for him. I could feel the struggles he had gone through.
Originally Posted by SkateFiguring
Compared to Honda's, Chan's "subtle sad face" looked somewhat shallow (lack of depth, boyish). I know it is subjective, but I simply don't feel any conviction in his emotion (It looked very much like acting). Being sad probably goes against his natural grains since he seems a playful, "goof-around" type of happy person as shown in his "bromance" with Kurt Browning. Nonetheless, it is still a very good vehicle for him, better than phantom though not as good as Take Five (which suited his personality so well). Without a flair for emoting, Patrick relies heavily on the beauty of his skating skills and choreography. Luckily he has the skills and Lori has the choreography.
10-03-2011, 07:06 AM
Rumour has it that Miki's music was nice... I'm curious!
Last edited by hikki; 10-03-2011 at 08:36 AM.
10-03-2011, 07:55 AM