Ladies - Short Program | Page 10 | Golden Skate

Ladies - Short Program

prettykeys

Medalist
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
OK. After seeing Caroline's SP myself (the choppy bad-quality one)... holy cow, it's no exaggeration. She's looking MUCH better, and her 3Loop was superb! :love: Way to go, loved her smiles.

nope. i too think kostner should lead. despite the stumbles, there's a freedom, a lack of stiffness, a flow to her movements that among today's competitors only she and mao have. she had better speed, better jumps, plus the best program (music + choreo) among the ladies i've seen (i haven't seen zhang's yet). i'm one of those who don't worship alissa c's fast but with so-so position spins, so to me there's no vast difference there. i also thought alissa c's 1st jump had a 2 foot (the toe-pick). yeah, i know, i didn't have slow-mo, i'm not a judge, blah blah blah, but i can make my own ranking (no funding envelope depends on it, so i'm free :)

for those whose taste runs to pretty-in-pink (as mine does), haruka imai's was the best of those pretty barbie doll programs. for once i prefer kostner's artsy program to all the pretty barbies, even haruka imai. maybe lori nichol still has some creativity left in her after all (good news for me, since mao has yet to move to tom dickson :)
Hmm, I agree with most of what you said. The quality of Carolina Kostner's skating was the class of the field (not surprisingly) but her program was a bit "odd" for me. On the other hand, Czisny had a VERY well-choreographed SP that went perfectly with the music. I was about to criticize the frontloading of the jumps until I realized the whole thing fit best the way it was done. I'd say Alissa deserves first place by a sliver.

I also enjoyed Haruka Imai though that wasn't the best program I've seen by her. There is a warmth to her that I have not yet seen in the Japanese ladies...I think I like her better than Shoji. :thumbsup:
 

lilshorty

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 20, 2010
The only programs I've seen are Alissa's and Carolina's. Alissa's program is very beautiful. The only quip I have about it is that I wish she would skate with more speed, but other than that it was truly an excellent performance and will go down as one of her most memorable. I thought Carolina's program was a bit...weird. I love the dress (green always looks good on Carolina), but that music was so strange I couldn't concentrate on the other aspects of her skating.
 

hikki

Final Flight
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Country
Japan
I'm I the only one who think Carolina should lead. She may a little bit off in step sequence, but other part is gorgeous. Great line and choreography, speed.

This is the first time ever that I think her PCS is too low

Alissa is lovely as well, great for her

I'm not sure about leading with stumbles here and there, but I absolutely loved Carolina's program! Agreed re: the PCS being low. I don't know any skater in the world today who can perform to an avant-garde piece so beautifully. It's like watching the contemporary segment of Prix de Lausanne except she can skate! She catches the beat with her shoulders, neck, back, elbows... Too bad (judging from last season) her lutz and flip are weaker and that she isn't the best spinner, but my wild wish is she wins the big thing this season!
 

glam

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 16, 2010
I really liked Kostner's program. The music was exciting! Alissa's skating and program were beautiful but to me too traditional and boring. Although I wonder, could she even skate to anything edgy and show a little attitude? :think:
 

SXTN

Final Flight
Joined
Jun 5, 2008
Too bad (judging from last season) her lutz and flip are weaker and that she isn't the best spinner, but my wild wish is she wins the big thing this season!

I don't get why she doesn't try the Flip at least.
 

ImaginaryPogue

Record Breaker
Joined
Jun 3, 2009
nope. i too think kostner should lead. despite the stumbles, there's a freedom, a lack of stiffness, a flow to her movements that among today's competitors only she and mao have. she had better speed, better jumps, plus the best program (music + choreo) among the ladies i've seen (i haven't seen zhang's yet). i'm one of those who don't worship alissa c's fast but with so-so position spins, so to me there's no vast difference there. i also thought alissa c's 1st jump had a 2 foot (the toe-pick). yeah, i know, i didn't have slow-mo, i'm not a judge, blah blah blah, but i can make my own ranking (no funding envelope depends on it, so i'm free :)

for those whose taste runs to pretty-in-pink (as mine does), haruka imai's was the best of those pretty barbie doll programs. for once i prefer kostner's artsy program to all the pretty barbies, even haruka imai. maybe lori nichol still has some creativity left in her after all (good news for me, since mao has yet to move to tom dickson :)

I'm intrigued - what's so-so about Alissa's positions? Given the number of infelicities in Kostner's skate, I'm fine with Czisny in the lead, though I'll agree that the score is a little high. Kostner has a really intriguing program, but I'll withold judgement until it's clean. Czisny's program was gorgeously suited to her, though, and she skated it so well.
 

emma

Record Breaker
Joined
Oct 28, 2004
I've only had a chance to watch one video - AC, and wow, she looks so great for her first competition. I absolutely love, love, love her dress (not usually the first thing I notice of mention) and I typically don't "love" frontloading, but I liked it in this program or thought it worked really well. Even last year when she skated, I would hold my breath in the short program for the jumps to be done, but this time, I just didn't feel that. There is something about this program and/or her skating - but it just went by really fast. Does any one think her step sequence is much improved? And am a huge fan of her spins, and what really got me today is how fast they appeared to be and as always, so incredibly well centered even when changing feet or edges. wow. great.

Thanks for all of you comments and posting videos - I'll watch and read more late!
 

snowflake

I enjoy what I like
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 10, 2008
Thanks everybody for comments, informations and videos :thumbsup:

Given the number of infelicities in Kostner's skate, I'm fine with Czisny in the lead, though I'll agree that the score is a little high.

What does it mean?… something bad I suppose :laugh: OK, she was not clean, but to me this program was captivating. I've never heard the interesting music before but love Caro's interpretation. Can't wait to see her doing it perfectly. Kudos also for the only 3toe-3toe. V. Helgesson planned it but doubled the second. Did Czisny plan 3Lz-3toe?

Happy for C. Zhang, Czisny and all US skating fans who badly need successful ladies :)

Short is short. Long will show us the winner. Hope the ladies will do way, way better than the guys yesterday.

Come on Joshi, Ksenia, Elene and Valentina… you can :yes:

Go all!
 

ManyCairns

Medalist
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Country
United-States
Hey, no more ladieZZZ for me! They were riveting! Loved Carolina, Alissa, and Caroline!

I really like the La Vie en Rose version Alissa used, actually. A little change of pace for her. Nice dress -- I most always love Alissa's dresses -- enough unusual touches not to be too bland but still very elegant. I'm not with the naysayers about her spins -- she hardly travels at all and her position throughout holds so well -- no line breaks, just turning about the axis like a precision instrument.

Carolina looked lovely, too, and I LOVED LOVED LOVED her music and the program. Did I say I LOVED her music? I will watch that over and over I'm sure.

Caroline's music was very uplifting for her, too, she seems like she's got so much more vitality out there now. So glad she stayed with skating. Great job!
 

Violet Bliss

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 19, 2010
This was a great SP competition, thanks to Alissa, Carolina, Caroline, and Haruka. I love the constrast of Alissa's pretty princess and Carolina's edgy program, in music, choreography, and the green dress. No zzzzz from this Lady.

Thrilled for Caroline's comeback when so many have written her off. Her techniques have improved so much overall with no more glaring weakness. Keep working, girl, and show and wow them!
 

ivy

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 6, 2005
So happy for Caroline Z. That was my favorite program of the evening. Love the quality of her expression - the way she uses her arms and edges. Fine with her placement though.

Enjoyed Alissa. The spins are so great, feel like she could take more risks choreographically. She's a mature skater and I just want a little more from her. More freedom, more security. Could just be me projecting my nervousness for her onto her skates.

Carolina is just one of those skaters I don't get. Nice triple triple, but I find the rest of her skating awkward and stiff. Spins were so slow and not nice positions. Seems like a skater I'd enjoy, but missing something. I would have had her PCS below Zhangs.

Haruka I also enjoyed. Not quite the whole package yet. Spins nice and fast but the positions not great to my eye.

1st thought after seeing the SP is that more of the top skaters need to be at Worlds! (I know it's a long way away) Maybe Caroline will get there- but probably not, not sure about where Haruka ranks in Japan after recent retirements, but she should be there too! (assuming both are able to deliver the programs of this level for the rest of the season)
 
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Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
So happy for Caroline Z. That was my favorite program of the evening. Love the quality of her expression - the way she uses her arms and edges. Fine with her placement though.

Enjoyed Alissa. The spins are so great, feel like she could take more risks choreographically. She's a mature skater and I just want a little more from her. More freedom, more security. Could just be me projecting my nervousness for her onto her skates.

Carolina is just one of those skaters I don't get. Nice triple triple, but I find the rest of her skating awkward and stiff. Spins were so slow and not nice positions. Seems like a skater I'd enjoy, but missing something. I would have had her PCS below Zhangs.

Haruka I also enjoyed. Not quite the whole package yet. Spins nice and fast but the positions not great to my eye.

1st thought after seeing the SP is that more of the top skaters need to be at Worlds! (I know it's a long way away) Maybe Caroline will get there- but probably not, not sure about where Haruka ranks in Japan after recent retirements, but she should be there too! (assuming both are able to deliver the programs of this level for the rest of the season)

I think with Alissa focusing on upping her tech content, i.e. 3-3 and bringing back the 3S for a 7-jump FS, I think it's important that she doesn't try anything too risky with the artistry part. Her team already knows that judges like her artistically (she consistently gets high PCS when she's clean), so she needs to focus more on the tech side of things. Using my analogy of running that I use in the Ice Dance discussion, there is no benefit in doing everything at one — in running you choose to focus on speed or distance. In Alissa's case, she clearly has chosen to up her tech content (and quite frankly I think she knows that she HAS to choose to do so), so I don't mind that she hasn't changed too much on the program/artistic side.

Haruka had a terrible Nationals last year finishing in 12th. But I think when she is on and clean, she is probably right behind Mao, Kanako and Akiko (if Miki is indeed out for the year). And in 2010, she finished sixth behind those three plus Miki and Yukari.
 

skfan

Final Flight
Joined
Jul 29, 2009
I'm intrigued - what's so-so about Alissa's positions? Given the number of infelicities in Kostner's skate, I'm fine with Czisny in the lead, though I'll agree that the score is a little high. Kostner has a really intriguing program, but I'll withold judgement until it's clean. Czisny's program was gorgeously suited to her, though, and she skated it so well.


look at the camel spin. it's not as nice as sumner's in

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwvUyHdFdh4

it doesn't even come close to the awesome camels of maria butyrskaya.
even if you tell me it's intentionally with a bent knee, there is a more aesthetic way to do a bent-knee camel spin. see maria butyrskaya's adagio program. or otonal.

for a skater sooooo flexible, why does her blade grab spin not look as nice as oksana baiul's or nicole bobek's or rory flack's? she's not limited-physically, she chooses to achieve this position rather than a more aesthetic one, so her sense of aesthetic just does not jive with mine

her bielman has a bent skating leg. i prefer zhang's camel, layback, bielmann, in this competition alone, not to mention the great spinners of the past. bobek didn't spin as fast, neither did cohen, but cohen's positions were always amazing, and bobek at her best makes czisny look dull and dreary.

of course, i'm aware she's very gracious to her fans, has a disney princess image and an inspiring story. but to me all that can't make up for the fact that her eyebrows are pulled up to her hairline even when she's grinning as if to convince the audience, yes, i really am relaxed, isn't this a soothing program.

that's just my impression. your mileage will vary. so many people find alissa c so beautiful and stirring, when to me she is all tensed-up, inflexible in both her facial expression and body movements. this la vie en rose program looks like moon river in a different dress, to different music.

hey, i'm all for pretty pretty. witness my haruka imai fangirling. it's just that nothing alissa c does qualify as truly pretty in my eye, even her quiet blades-- she doesn't have the flow of an ekaterina gordeeva, a michelle kwan, a mao asada, a mirai nagasu. usually i keep quiet, but occasionally the cynic in me pipes up, seeing such mediocrity ordained. where's bill parcells and his 'put away the annointing oil' when you need it? (yes, i'm aware she doesn't wipe the ice with her butts like before, but merely not falling doesn't generate magic).
 

ivy

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 6, 2005
Just spent some time poking around in the protocol sheets. Hoping some one more in the know can tell me why Elene got so dinged in GOE's for doubling her jumps. Her opening 2lz + 2t seemed like a nice 2lz + 2t to me - correct edge, fully rotated, not the best air position, a little open, but not obviously flawed, for a double, to my eye.

Mostly she got -3 goes for that, except for 1 judge gave her a +1. I understand the +1 and of course she's not going to place well with a bunch of clean doubles. Still it seems like she should be judged on what she did, not what she was expected to do.
 
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