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Thread: LADIES Long Program

  1. #241
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    congratulations to all womens medalist
    job well done,
    nice on your 1st victory in your very first gp event Elizaveta Tuktamisheva, great job

    good going 2nd for Akiko Sukuki
    Great job 3rd Ashley wagner,

    great going to all ladies

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by christinaskater View Post
    Congrats to all the medalist! Superb event!

    I want Carolina, Mao and Akiko on the world podium
    Not out of the realm of possibility. I want Alissa, Mao, Carolina.

  3. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    I hate to say it but Mirai's problems seem to be all in her head. But not going out and fighting is not acceptable. Akiko struggled with some of her jumps but kept performing and not giving up. Maybe Mirai just isn't a competitor.
    But Jammers, Mirai is a competitor. She may not be strong competitively, but she competes, and has wins. In my book that makes her a competitor, whether strong or not.

    What makes you think Gracie Gold has got all it takes? Certainly a name like that does not hurt.

  4. #244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art&Sport View Post
    But Jammers, Mirai is a competitor. She may not be strong competitively, but she competes, and has wins. In my book that makes her a competitor, whether strong or not.

    What makes you think Gracie Gold has got all it takes? Certainly a name like that does not hurt.
    Obviously you didn't ask me, but Gracie Gold has impressed me because she has been able to learn from her struggles. After failing to make U.S. Nationals last year, she went back to the drawing board and worked on her jumps, including those two 3X3. It's a similar story to Agnes Z, who won Nationals at the junior level after not making it the year before.

    Gracie has also already gone through a major growth sprout (and is a year older than Liza or Adelina) so it's likely that those big jumps and solid 3X3 will last in the long term.

    Regarding Mirai, it's early in the season. And Mirai seems to peak later on (see: 2010 Nationals/Olympics; 2011 4CC). So let's see that the rest of the season holds us...

  5. #245
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art&Sport View Post
    Possibly, but once again, see my post upthread -- Did Mirai's possible "lack of commitment" come about because of the hot and cold support by U.S. federation. ONce again, everyone took the Kween for granted, and still haven't come out of the shock and awe daze/ days.
    The US Federation would love to support Mirai but she has to earn it. Plus that is no excuse for skating so badly. I bet Frank would agree. This is all on Mirai.

  6. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jammers View Post
    The US Federation would love to support Mirai but she has to earn it. Plus that is no excuse for skating so badly. I bet Frank would agree. This is all on Mirai.
    Ah but, they were too busy getting behind Rachael. And then of all things fined Rachael in aftermath of Worlds disaster, instead of (or at least in addition to) fining her coach.

    Mirai did not skate "badly" at SC -- she skated without joy or apparent interest in her music and choreo. It is not "all on Mirai." Just as with Rachael at 2011 Worlds, the coach shares the responsibility, IMHO. Whose decision to use this music and choreo? It doesn't work for Mirai, IMO.

    ETA: Yes, Mrs. P, let's see how the season unfolds. It's not looking great for Mirai right now, but I don't think she should be dumped on or that the entire U.S. top ladies should be "swept away," as Jammers suggested earlier. I'm hopeful for Alissa and Ashley. Mirai does need to reflect on whether she truly wants to continue skating or whether she's doing it for someone other than herself, or for not the right reasons.

    I've seen a couple of clips of Gracie. She has exciting jumps. It will be interesting to see how she progresses. Never a good idea to push young skaters forward too quickly, or put heavy expectations on them. That happened to Mirai and Caroline, unfortunately.
    Last edited by Art&Sport; 10-29-2011 at 05:16 PM.

  7. #247
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    Anyone have the Akiko long program?

  8. #248
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art&Sport View Post
    I don't think this music works for Mirai. Compare with the cut Kwan skated to at 2005 Nats sp. And like you said re Akiko and Ashley, they were really into and enjoying their programs. It doesn't seem as if Mirai ever liked this program, just that she was being told to do it, like homework. I also don't find that her costume is working for her, nor the overall choreo. She sure doesn't seem happy with it. The program was just okay -- she didn't sell and she lost focus. I think that's obvious. She knew it and Frank knew it, and the judges certainly knew it -- they overly dinged her on PCS.
    Still not convinced. I rewatched the program and am studying the protocols. It looks to me like Mirai threw away over 10 points in GOE, downgrades, and base value just by not skating her program as choreographed. Not that I've seen her planned elements list, but I'm assuming she meant to tack on a 3T to her 2A instead of a 2T, and didn't plan a solo 3T. She seemed to fall off an edge in her combo spin and abbreviate it (?). Surely her PCS would have been much higher had she whipped off her jumps and spun the way we know she can. I'm just guessing, but I think the program was a good showcase for her. I thought the music and costume were beautiful - she looked like a young Russian ballerina (much more than Tut did!) - and once I got over my first disappointment, I think she did a good job with it. It was just an off day technically, and that affected her ability to sell it. Whether she got distracted or didn't practice enough or what, who knows? But I don't think it's the program per se that held her back.

    ETA: My most favorite move was the backward falling leaf, if that's the right name of the element. Anyway, some kind of backward-moving split jump!
    Last edited by Spun Silver; 10-29-2011 at 05:38 PM.

  9. #249
    Rooting for Adrian, Javi and Kevin R!!! :) aemeraldrainc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Art&Sport View Post
    Ah, thanks! That's why I had a great feeling upon hearing it. Matt Savoie skated to the opening movement quite exquisitely in 2005. No comparison with what Alena showed here.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lFAsN...1832A6C18299B0


  10. #250
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    Someone over at FSU noted that Mirai skipped a bar of her music in her LP. It was noticeable, comparing the beginning of the LP at Nebelhorn and here at SC. both times, she did the pulsing movements with the music but when she raised her arms here in SC, it didn't go with the longer note like it did at Nebelhorn. I think this really set the tone for her presentation, because she didn't seem to really be listening to the music quite enough.

    I really hope she does well at COC. She's my favorite skater.

  11. #251
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    congrats to the medalists!!! As for Mirai - really not a great competition for her; but, today she was just off. I agree with the other posters that this program might be a lovely vehicle for her, and I am just not willing to right her or her team off (the latter especially as I have zero inside knowledge). But, there was no spark, speed was off, edges were off, the spins traveled and she caught her edge on the combo spin and sort of bailed...and we all know she can do so much more. So, I'm just gonna hope she does.

    It is lovely to see Ashley with more confidence and passion. Liz - wow!!!! Both Canadians sort of broke my heart, they have lovely skating and lovely programs....hope they bounce back! Rachel...hope she can regroup. I really hope this isn't lingering injuries - if she is just not well trained yet, well, she can get there, but if she is still nursing injuries, I worry for her.

    ETA way to go Akiko!!! love her!

  12. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spun Silver View Post
    Still not convinced. I rewatched the program and am studying the protocols. It looks to me like Mirai threw away over 10 points in GOE, downgrades, and base value just by not skating her program as choreographed. Not that I've seen her planned elements list, but I'm assuming she meant to tack on a 3T to her 2A instead of a 2T, and didn't plan a solo 3T. She seemed to fall off an edge in her combo spin and abbreviate it (?). Surely her PCS would have been much higher had she whipped off her jumps and spun the way we know she can. I'm just guessing, but I think the program was a good showcase for her. I thought the music and costume were beautiful - she looked like a young Russian ballerina (much more than Tut did!) - and once I got over my first disappointment, I think she did a good job with it. It was just an off day technically, and that affected her ability to sell it. Whether she got distracted or didn't practice enough or what, who knows? But I don't think it's the program per se that held her back.

    ETA: My most favorite move was the backward falling leaf, if that's the right name of the element. Anyway, some kind of backward-moving split jump!
    I totally see what you're getting at, but I've been pretty "meh" on this program even when she did it relatively well at Nebelhorn. I love the music, but I just don't think I love it on her.

    Oddly enough, I actually liked her version of Carmen the most out of her FS programs. But I'm hoping she proves this wrong and makes it work.

  13. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    I totally see what you're getting at, but I've been pretty "meh" on this program even when she did it relatively well at Nebelhorn. I love the music, but I just don't think I love it on her.
    I don't like the music, and I don't like it on her. I hope she's not paying Lori Nichol too much for her programs. The cuts and choreography are mediocre, not just this season, but last season too.

    Ashley's music choices and choreography are AMAZING this year. I'm absolutely enthralled with Pollack, and even though I was skeptical about her Black Swan LP because of the overhype from the movie, it was incredibly good too. I really hope this season she can stop playing second fiddle to Mirai and Rachael and get to the World Championship.

    Although this year it probably won't be difficult at all to bypass Rachael. Rachael, what happened to you?

  14. #254
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    A deserved win for Akiko in the LP, I'm very happy to see this.

    Mirai's program is trash (even worse than last year's) and, sorry to say, she doesn't seem to be living a healthy enough lifestyle. She needs a new program with a different choreographer, a different coach, and someone outside of the rink to closely manage what she eats.

    Ashley is in great shape but needs better choreography and could use a better competition strategy. The Long Program does have a couple strong moments (I like how she does an actual full rink-length spiral and utilizes arm movements signifying the swan transformation while doing do; that element has become so wasted in programs these days) but the spins in the program are choreographed very poorly and just in general the program needs more edge and a concept that is more fully realized. Her jump layout could be improved to maximize points in such a way that caters to her abilities but I won't go into details of talking about that here, unless people are interested.

    I see that someone else pointed out how Alena Leonova does 3 Triple Flips in her program. Her Lutz isn't even a "flutz", it's a Flip...her entrances are EXACTLY the same. The tech callers need to start calling it as 3 Triple Flips and she needs to be getting penalized for an invalid element (well, ideally the extraneous 3Flip would be downgraded to a Double, but CoP has yet to fix the rules to allow for such a thing). Aside from that issue, I'm not entirely sure how to approach discussing Alena. This girl has a ton of spirit and a very specific kind of energy and you can't really change these things about her. That's just who she is and you have to appreciate it when it works. She needs to just keep perfecting her technique and trying to push herself as much as she can.

    There's not much to add to the discussion about Elizaveta...she's clearly a very talented jumper and has a lot of potential as a performer and skater, but who knows how her body will change in the next couple years since she is still rather young.

    Everyone else was not worth talking about.

  15. #255
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs. P View Post
    I totally see what you're getting at, but I've been pretty "meh" on this program even when she did it relatively well at Nebelhorn. I love the music, but I just don't think I love it on her.

    Oddly enough, I actually liked her version of Carmen the most out of her FS programs. But I'm hoping she proves this wrong and makes it work.

    I was surprised to find myself bored which I hardly get with Mirai even if I don't love her programs like last year.

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