Men's Short Program, Fri. 11/18 at 9 am EST

[fscric]

I heard an EuroSport commentator saying that he felt Chan's high score was given somewhat based on who he was, not on how he skated. The professional opinion made me suspect that there might indeed be such thing as "cushion", or at least I know there is a voice out there from a skating expert thinking Chan did not deserve what he got.

Out of curiosity, do you consider it a professional opinion when the EuroSport commentators proclaimed Patrick an artist at his last World's performance?

[fscric]

Every men's thread turns into an argument about Patrick-bashing. It's boring! Why can't people accept that there are differences of opinion? You will never, ever, ever convert the whole forum to Patrick-love by fighting them. That said, there is tons of respect for him here, but all some people hear is bashing.

I really like the way IP just expressed it. His skating is admirable, a thing of beauty, wonderful - but not always equally great, and he's not the only exciting skater out there.

Sorry to preach, really. *Zips lip on the subject.*

I do think the Chan bashing was mild until A&S lectured us how unworthy Patrick Chan is and BoP's assessment, as usual, that Patrick is unworthy of his mark.

[Blades of Passion]

Interesting how some people always find somebody else better than Patrick in every competition.

I find somebody better than him in competitions where *gasp*, people are better. It's a very frequent occurrence.

FYI, I thought he deserved to win both segments of the GPF last season (and the judges actually put him #2 in the SP). So there's that. *shrug*

[evangeline]

I do think the Chan bashing was mild until A&S lectured us how unworthy Patrick Chan is and BoP's assessment, as usual, that Patrick is unworthy of his mark.

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Ok, discarding aside Art&Sport's and Blades of Passion's posts for the time being, what Chan bashing posts were there? I don't understand. Criticisms of a skater looking lackluster and not being into a performance are common criticisms and IMO, do not constitute bashing at all. For instance, how many times have we heard that a skater like Miki Ando just sleepwalked through her program? Or that Mirai looks to have lost all her spark and seemed really bored during her programs this season?

[skatinginbc]

Out of curiosity, do you consider it a professional opinion when the EuroSport commentators proclaimed Patrick an artist at his last World's performance?

Yes, I do. My original post simply stated the existence of such opinion (i.e, Chan was probably overscored) from an expert and argued that mentioning "cushion" should not be automatically interpreted as "bashing". It didn't say whether I agree with his opinion or not. Different experts may have different opinions. Expressing a different opinion is not necessarily bashing.

[fscric]

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...

Ok, discarding aside Art&Sport's and Blades of Passion's posts for the time being, what Chan bashing posts were there? I don't understand. Criticisms of a skater looking lackluster and not being into a performance are common criticisms and IMO, do not constitute bashing at all. For instance, how many times have we heard that a skater like Miki Ando just sleepwalked through her program? Or that Mirai looks to have lost all her spark and seemed really bored during her programs this season?

OK, I re-read the thread and I agree that before the arrival of those 2 posters, the posts in this thread are criticism.

[emma]

Patrick Chan: Ehh..... I’m not the biggest fan of keeping programs for another year, unless you clearly didn’t do well with it the first time around. Patrick’s already nailed this program to the wall from Worlds 2011 and I can’t imagine him skating it any better (and given the new GOE limitations on his footwork, doubtful he’d score higher). Add that to the fact that I never really LOVED this program in the first place – certainly not compared to his Exilados... well, I doubt I’m gonna root that hard for him in the SP. But the thing is – the dude can skate. Even when he’s not on (and he wasn’t here), he’s still incredible to watch. I’ve never seen someone who’s talent is so skate-specific. Everything about what he does is grounded in those amazing blades of his. And personally, that’s what I respond to in figure skating. Even when off, there’s so much quality here. The footwork section is just sick. The triple axel was spot on. And even if it’s not my favourite of his programs, I admire the new choreographic subtleties found throughout – just the little toss of joy he gives off is infectious.

Nan Song: You know, he’s definitely rough around the edges, but really, this wasn’t that bad. Epic jumps, and even if the music is overdone, it’s overdone for a reason (aka, Clint Mansell’s score is really really good and the intensity suits him). I’ve gotta ask, though – is that all that’s necessary for the steps preceding the solo triple. Cause that’s kinda lame.

Michal Brezina: I was hoping for MORE attack, actually. The footwork was well skated and placed, though, and his jumps (when on) are terrific. Interesting that he got the second highest PCS of the night. Don’t know if that’s mere laziness from the judges or is fair.

Adam Rippon: This program has a KILLER ending. That split jump and then that final spin is just a thrilling skating moment. I wish this program before it had more of a gradual rise to that crescendo, though. He didn’t stalk his 3A as much here as he did at Skate Canada (or was that just the long program) and I was pleasantly surprised. I’m fine with his PCS being behind Brezina’s even if I don’t think I’d have them like that. But he really wowed me in the end, so that definitely helps. ...

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Really great post....I find myself totally agreeing with this. But I especially agree with all of the stuff you wrote about Chan.

I am still wondering why Adam's 3 lutz didn't get higher GOE's; perhaps someone who understands scoring better than I can help here,

[evangeline]

Florent Amodio: Oh, did Morosov misread this season or what? Right off the bat, we have an atrocious costume. Then comes that ridiculous take on “Summertime” (“Summertime” without Louis Armstrong’s sonorous trumpet is like Canadian winter with no snow. Doesn’t logically compute). The French federation and Stannick Jeannette need to stage an intervention stat – the choreography is bland, the interpretation mediocre and the ego overwhelming.

Clearly you have never been to Vancouver in the winter

Aside from that....so agree about Florent. I think Morozov is sucking out his soul because the genuine joy and the exuberance in skating from previous seasons seems gone, or at least somewhat muted. The worst thing is that Florent's LP is even worse than his SP in terms of costuming, music, interpretation and choreography.

Only tripped out ice dancers can get away with pairing neon green and tiger print.

[skateflower]

Interesting how some people always find somebody else better than Patrick in every competition. . .

Well, the opposition to him will likely retreat either 1) if he stops falling at every competition, or 2) if he still falls but judges start to downgrade him in rankings,

[jettasian]

I think Patrick is bored by now with his own sp. Other than that everybody skated like they were drunk of champagne.
So much talk about the men event here,I liked COC and NHK much better.

Actually, I was bored too. I mean, he did the same program so well at world last year, now, it looks pale in comparison. That's why one should never repeat a program that has been done much better before. I could understand POTO as it didn't get a better showcase until last year. Well, as long as the judges don't get bored, I guess what am I to complain about? I just hope that it won't give him a disadvantage in Nice.

[ImaginaryPogue]

Clearly you have never been to Vancouver in the winter

Aside from that....so agree about Florent. I think Morozov is sucking out his soul because the genuine joy and the exuberance in skating from previous seasons seems gone, or at least somewhat muted. The worst thing is that Florent's LP is even worse than his SP in terms of costuming, music, interpretation and choreography.

Only tripped out ice dancers can get away with pairing neon green and tiger print.

I maintain that Vancouver and the entire lower mainland is a logical incongruity to Canada (except colleen. She's awesome).

So is Vancouver, of course (and I spent my formative years in Northern British Columbia, fwiw).

[skatinginbc]

It snowed in Vancouver yesterday. It has been an unusually cold winter in BC.

[fscric]

Patrick Chan: Ehh..... I’m not the biggest fan of keeping programs for another year, unless you clearly didn’t do well with it the first time around. Patrick’s already nailed this program to the wall from Worlds 2011 and I can’t imagine him skating it any better (and given the new GOE limitations on his footwork, doubtful he’d score higher).

I totally agree with you about the bold part, that has me worry about his SP scores this year. Can you explain about the "new GOE limitations on his footwork" as I'm not familiar with it? Thanks.

[jettasian]

Job well done with a UR'd quad fall? I'd hope that the reigning world champion would be held to a higher standard.

What does UR'd a quad fall have anything to do with reigning world champ? So a world champ can't make mistake? What does that say about former world champ who didn't even attempt a quad then?

[Blades of Passion]

OK, I re-read the thread and I agree that before the arrival of those 2 posters, the posts in this thread are criticism.

My posts are criticism as well. I went to full length to explain my opinion with a detailed protocol breakdown. Don't lump me into this ridiculous "xxxx poster is bashing zzzz skater" talk, which in fact nobody is doing in the first place. Art&Sport may be very repetitive but he/she is not bashing Chan.

People need to stop being so artificially outraged at dissenting opinions.

Also - some people may get defensive at how "whatever Patrick Chan does it's never good enough for some of you!", but on the other hand some people find it delusional/uneducated to think Patrick Chan is the epitome of amazing programs and performance ability.

It goes both ways and if you can't handle reading opinions you don't agree with, then maybe you shouldn't participate in discussion forums.