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Thread: Short Dance, Fri. 11/25 at 11:20 am EST

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImaginaryPogue View Post
    For those catty or curious, the icenetwork headline reads: "Davis/White Outclass Dance Field in Moscow."
    LOL, given the way IN treated V/M's win last week, it makes you wonder what would be a more "appropriate" title of D/W on Skate Buzz this week after what happened... I think they need to organize a title naming contest and the most catchy headline showcasing D/W's lead and perfect 10s after a major stumble that drew eyebrows in Russia. Maybe something like: "Marina Anissina is right after all, 10s that even Pasha can't dream of"

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    Maybe if SkateBuzz got the same person who wrote the icenetwork article last week. I get the feeling he'd write the same about D/W as he did about V/M. It's P/B he cared about.

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    My god Andrew Poje is hot!! I think the hottest guy to ever step foot on the ice. This is probably one of the first ice dance teams I saw where you are probably more likely to be looking at the male when they perform.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apple Pi View Post
    Maybe if SkateBuzz got the same person who wrote the icenetwork article last week. I get the feeling he'd write the same about D/W as he did about V/M. It's P/B he cared about.
    Incidentally, I went to check what SkateBuzz has to say, they too had a French writer for this event but boy, look at the difference:

    http://www.skatebuzz.com/ViewNewsArt...3-966c872e5efa

    Weaver and Poje stand second after short dance in Russia

    Nov 25, 2011

    By Louis Daignault

    MOSCOW – Kaitlyn Weaver and Andrew Poje of Waterloo, Ont., posted a season best score on Friday and are in second place after the short dance at the Rostelecom Cup ISU Grand prix figure skating competition.

    World champions Meryl Davis and Charlie White of the U.S., who have won gold in their seven Grand Prix career appearances, lead the ice dance field at 69.94. Weaver and Poje, second at their two previous Grand Prix’s this season, follow at 64.45 and Ekaterina Bobrova and Dmitri Soloviev of Russia are third at 61.69.

    Weaver and Poje's performance to Rhumba and Samba was highlighted by a straight line lift and fast twizzles. The 2010 Four Continents Champions got a level four for the first Rhumba sequence which helped them to the strong score.


    So I think being French is not the issue, it's the professionalism of the writer and the organization that publishes it. IN has been taking shots at V/M for quite some time, including suggestions that they should retire. The more they do that however, the more it looks like they are worried about V/M.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    So I think being French is not the issue, it's the professionalism of the writer and the organization that publishes it. IN has been taking shots at V/M for quite some time, including suggestions that they should retire. The more they do that however, the more it looks like they are worried about V/M.
    Yeah, it's the writer himself that was the issue - and he just so happened to be French. I bet it's the same guy who asked V/M about their marks relative to P/B during the TEB presser and succeeded in making everyone uncomfortable.

    You honestly think IN even reads what they publish? There have been so many obvious errors in their articles in the past that I don't think they do. I don't IN is smart enough to orchestrate some kind of wide-spread attack on V/M.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apple Pi View Post

    You honestly think IN even reads what they publish? There have been so many obvious errors in their articles in the past that I don't think they do. I don't IN is smart enough to orchestrate some kind of wide-spread attack on V/M.
    Mistakes happen, especially when it comes to figure skating coverage, can't really have too much of expectation. For example, I lost count of how many times Tracy Wilson made errors while commentating, even basic facts like Angelika Krylova being Olympic Champion. That said, there are differences between unintentional reporting error vs. taking shots. Perhaps as you said, they aren't smart enough but the fact the Icenetwork is a joint venture owned and operated by USFS makes these series of coincidences a little, shall we say, coincidental. How come such accident never happens to D/W on IN if they don't ever read their own articles? Isn't that strange? SkateBuzz sometimes makes error in their reporting as well, although rarely, I can't however recall any instance they attempted to trash talk anyone or borderline of spreading rumors. IN is becoming the skating version of Fox News where facts don't matter anymore, spin is. Want proof? IP pointed out their title for D/W's performance today, hence it's for the curious or catty.
    Last edited by wallylutz; 11-25-2011 at 10:23 PM.

  7. #52
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    I do not see how that skate by Davis and White can get a 10 in anything. What mark would they deserves if they skated the same program well and without error?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CassAgain View Post
    Finally got to see the dance. I was expecting a much more dramatic event. Small stumble, very quick recovery and then business as usual.
    I was expecting something bad but the rest of the program was good so I don't know.

  9. #54
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    I agree with CassAgain -- business as usual. Shouldn't 9.5's and 10's be reserved for something special?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    I agree with CassAgain -- business as usual. Shouldn't 9.5's and 10's be reserved for something special?
    Yes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    I do not see how that skate by Davis and White can get a 10 in anything. What mark would they deserves if they skated the same program well and without error?
    Coming from a proud member in the Detroit area is quite telling, imagine the shock of those today when they saw D/W's PCS actually flew past that of V/M from last week. Granted, you can't compare the leniency of two different panels, for all we know, last week's panel could have given D/W maybe only 33 for PCS. Still, D/W seems to make this kind of error quite often when there is no real competition. They both fell at FD of their last GP event from last year as well. It's not a good idea to give other judges watching from home any impression that you are being gifted, even as World Champions. Because they might try to right the "wrong" when they go into the rink next time, similar to how the Yankees were stolen a HR call by bad umpire decision who didn't know the ground rules, only to have them gifted a HR call back in the very next match.

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    I was actually wondering if someone who understands ice dance technique could help me out with something. I'm not a skater, so I really don't know much about levels. I was realy surprised (and very pleased, given how much I love W/P and how much I think they have improved in precision, power and edges over the past two seasons) by how close W/P were technically to D/W, even though W/P clearly missed a couple of key features in the rumba and D/W skated clean (with the exception of the fall, which should not have impacted their TES). I'm not saying I disagree, because W/P seem to be really strong technically, and I'm thrilled to see them getting the scores they diserve, but just how good are they in terms of the elements? Because they got higher levels than D/W on a few, and didn't do too badly with GOE's either. Just wondering.

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    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    Mistakes happen, especially when it comes to figure skating coverage, can't really have too much of expectation. For example, I lost count of how many times Tracy Wilson made errors while commentating, even basic facts like Angelika Krylova being Olympic Champion. That said, there are differences between unintentional reporting error vs. taking shots. Perhaps as you said, they aren't smart enough but the fact the Icenetwork is a joint venture owned and operated by USFS makes these series of coincidences a little, shall we say, coincidental. How come such accident never happens to D/W on IN if they don't ever read their own articles? Isn't that strange? SkateBuzz sometimes makes error in their reporting as well, although rarely, I can't however recall any instance they attempted to trash talk anyone or borderline of spreading rumors. IN is becoming the skating version of Fox News where facts don't matter anymore, spin is. Want proof? IP pointed out their title for D/W's performance today, hence it's for the curious or catty.
    How many other potshots at V/M have you seen from IN other than this article?

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    Quote Originally Posted by wallylutz View Post
    If you look at the protocol, D/W who usually have nothing but 2 and 3 for GOE, received only +3 from one single judge for all of their elements. Their three +3 came from one judge alone and they better hope that judge isn't American or else being so far out of the line can lead to accusation of national bias. An argument can also be made they skated below their standard that 8 of the 9 judges really weren't that impressed. They also received more 0 than they have of +3. So no, I don't think they were that overwhelmed, frankly, I wasn't either.
    What happens if that particular judge ISN'T American? Does he/she still get reprimanded?

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    Quote Originally Posted by evangeline View Post
    What happens if that particular judge ISN'T American? Does he/she still get reprimanded?
    Going with my gut feeling, I am thinking several judges will be asked by the referee to write some explanation for the way this SD was judged regardless whether an American judge was in fact responsible for the 10s or not. It really wouldn't surprise me if the Ice Dance Technical Committee would want to do an overall review of the event, after it is completed. Rightly or wrongly, with some of the recent chatters, for example, the one lamented by Marina Anissina and this happened in Russia, I'd pay attention to future Ice Dance communication to come out between now and year end. They will never explicitly point fingers at someone, not publicly anyway, but I think it's possible they will direct judges to pay more attention to certain aspects and etc. The fact that a major stumble seems go unpunished as far as PCS is concerned where unison is always important is simply unacceptable. While TES rightfully reflects the error not being on a required element, you just can't let such an error go on PCS when clearly 4 of the 5 criteria talked extensively about unison as a couple. The question is not whether the placement here is correct or not, that's not in dispute, but judges not applying the necessary deductions for PCS - that is something I think referee will ask some hard questions and depending on his report, the Ice Dance Technical Committee may react as well. To answer your question, even if that judge is not American, which will save him/her the dishonor of national bias, if his/her explanation for given out 10's and the highest GOE and every PCS component D/W is determined to be unsatisfactory or contained errors, then he/she will be reprimanded for making mistake - just like the one judge who gave Javier Fernandez's Double Lutz+Triple Toe a GOE -3 likely also made an error on the definition of SP jump combo requirement. I don't know how can you possibly explain those 10's and the 9.75 for Transition. I just can't. The error on unison would have killed any attempt to justify perfect scores. And 9.75 for TR, that's just nuts. TR is hard to justify high marks because there is always something you can nitpick on. In other words, had D/W not stumble, did that judge plan to give out 10 for TR? 10 for TR, that I have never seen before. There have been 10's in Ice Dance, but I haven't seen one for TR and probably shouldn't so long as humans are dancing.

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