He might still be sad if a guy he trains with and may even be friendly with loudly denigrates that achievement.Originally Posted by chuckm
He might still be sad if a guy he trains with and may even be friendly with loudly denigrates that achievement.
Hi, I am Italian and I lurke this board, where I've learnt a lot about skating.
Time to break the ice!
What do I think about the two dances?
Funny Face is very well conceived. Beautiful tap dance; the mood of the movie well translated into the ice.
Fledermaus Ouverture is a classic masterpiece. Vienna Ballet on ice. I must admit I am a waltz uber: nothing beats an excellent waltz. I give a large edge to Davis and White with their Free Dance.
Needless to talk about the skills involved in both dances.
About the performances and the scoring.
Virtue/Moir's, although excellent, was obviously flawed; Davis/White were clean. Having the two teams equal quality, I was glad the cleanest performance won in PCS and overall. I wish the same happened in men's event.
How do I understand Scott's complaints?
I use to interpretate people's statements the way they make more sense; especially from smart people.
So, in 2006 “we are disappointed we could not make it to Olympics” I read it “shame, it was close” not “we deserved it better”.
Same way, in 2011 “it was a winning performance” obviously refers to Free Dance only. Just because otherwise it would be plain silly.
Of course Scott is “pissed”. He must be angry with himself for his fall (his fault: running too fast he went off-track and collided), and needed to vent his disappointment. He was wrong, using bad words and picking the judges as target; but let us realize when a 24-years old just pours out.
Everybody remembers how much stress he and Tessa endured because of Tessa's threatening injury; no wonder if he is quite burnt out by stress.
Please tell me how poor is my English!
I'm used to scientific English, but to everyday's language not as much.
Thanks for posting! Your English is excellent.
Great post, waltzjump!
Your English is fine and actually you illustrated your points more thoughtfully than some who actually do speak English as their first language!
I wonder what she's thinking too. The DiManno article said Tessa's "lovely green eyes widened to saucer size" when Scott made his comment.
In that 'orange team interview' posted earlier in the thread, they both said their tendency is to look at where they can improve when asked whether they've ever felt they were judged unfairly. So hopefully Scott will channel plenty of this into motivation to improve as well once he's digested it a bit. As jcoates and others have pointed out, he likely hadn't fully acknowledged the extent to which D/W have closed the gap between them, and that can be a shock. I can see how he may have been dismissing the signs: yes, D/W beat us at worlds, but we were coming back after having to miss the season, we hadn't been training and competing, we'll be back on top next season. Yes, D/W beat us in the short program, but we had a fall and didn't skate our best, once we really have a great skate of course we'll win again, because we're the best artistic team in the world... Skating a really great program, bringing the audience to their feet as they've done before, and still being beaten (and in PCS at that), would then be like a bucket of cold water.
So hopefully they will both channel that frustrated energy into making improvements now that they've had that reality check. Being angry at the judging initially is understandable, but continually stewing about it and maintaining the belief they were robbed isn't going to help their motivation, their image, or their peace of mind.
Great question.
a) Publically, Scott tends to be the voice of the team. He dominates interviews.
b) There are times, of course, when Tessa disagrees, and it's generally in a moment when Scott's more bluster. For example, after 4CC 2009 (Tessa's first international competition post-injury), when V/M were asked if they were concerned they'd miss the entire season, Scott said no, Tessa said yes. I do find that Tessa's quick to be more introspective than Scott in general - she plays her cards very tight to the chest, so to speak.
What the...? Paranoid much? Or is that jealousy? Please...if Takahashi ever spoke Moirese I'd be extremely disappointed in him, too. But that's why he is so adored, because not only is he awesome, but he is so humble that he is self-depreciating at times.
And I'm very tired of the overuse of the term "bashing". Sometimes people are discussing issues that are close to the heart, not discussing them just for the sake of attacking people/skaters. Let's try not to be so butthurt and dramatic.
I'm not saying you would be more or less disappointed. I'm saying that Takahashi, confirming the opinion of many, would be praised for doing so. Admittedly, he's adored for his general attitude. I love Takakashi, but given the extent of comments that have been made in the past about Chan, I'd hardly say I'm being paranoid. I'll pm you if want a fuller opinion.
I am emphasizing that while there are posts that villify Chan (seen them myself, I'm not blind), it is wrong to say that "people would" (in the general) righteously back Takahashi by some unfair double standard. There are, after all, also those who make Chan out to be some kind of hero, with the villains being the skating fans that criticize him, or event outcomes, or the judging system. Can't there be some middle ground? Chan never crossed any line that I drew in my sand, but Moir did. Put those words in YuNa's mouth and I'd be disappointed, too. I think that's fair.
Welcome, Waltzjump! Your English is impressive. I can't imagine posting anything this well thought out and finely expressed in French, which I studied for years.
And thanks for your insights. You bring up some excellent points, about both the skating programs and Scott's motivations for speaking like that.
Like you, I felt that Meryl and Charlie's program evoked the golden age of Vienna. It wasn't only the music, which is just about the most lilting opera overture ever composed. It was the flourishes Charlie and Meryl added to their skating, the perfect arm movements, the shifts in balance. Couldn't you just imagine that they were dancing in the Sacher Hotel or even Schonbrunn Palace? I'm not savvy enough to analyze all the moves and decide which of the two couples deserved the most points for their efforts. I just know that this program is a dazzling confection. I share your love of waltzes, and this may be influencing my reaction. But I think I'd love this program no matter what.
I hope we read many more posts from you! If you're interested in practicing your everyday language, a great forum like this is the perfect place for it. There's so much to talk about and to learn. Welcome!
Agree to disagree, here. I don't think you're being unfair, though. And I believe that Scott did cross a line, regardless of the fact that I wanted him to cross said line.
What line did he cross? 15 pages about Scott saying what so many disappointed, hardworking second place skaters have said. People are not robots with PC answers all the time. He really feels they are a cut above as do ALL OLY GOLD CHAMPIONS. His little statement is nothing compared to over the years-Irina, Plush, Butyrskaya, Bonaly, Kerrigan, Witt, Kulik, even Yamaguchi was testy when MK beat her. Why can't someone say IMHO, I am the best artist (or jumper or spinner, or twizzler. I am amazed there is such condemnation for "bad sportsmanship." He is a man with a big ego. That's new in sport? Much ado about not much.
No ice dance OGMs since Gritchuk / Platov have gone on with their competitive career past their OGM. The biggest risk (other than injury) for those who do continue on is eventually losing to another skater/team. If Scott is so incensed, maybe they should consider whether the risk is really worth their while.
I do worry that perhaps V&M are/were being pressured to compete longer than they really wanted to by Skate Canada, as was Yu Na Kim by the Korean federation. They say in public that they are eager to compete, but when something like this comes up, I wonder.
Is there a cultural (or generational) issue here? Are there some areas where trash talking is considered fun and adorable? And others where it is considered unsportman-like.
It all reminds me of a record from Scholastic that my mother bought me when I was a little tot. It was the story of Robin Hood, and the actors broke into song occasionally. Prior to the archery contest, the herald sang the rules for sportsmen. I don't remember much of it, but some of it went like this:
A sportsman's always courteous and never whines and cries
And even when he thinks he'll lose he goes ahead and tries
He goes ahead and tries, my lads, he goes ahead and tries
And he never makes excuses like the sun was in my eyes
A sportsman still remains a sport although he has been beat
He will not curse he will not bite nor kick out with his feet
Nor kick out with his feet, my lads, nor kick out with his feet
And he will never never never never never never cheat
This part is so important that I really must repeat
He will never never never never never never cheat.
Clearly, the kids of today do not have this record.
Last edited by dorispulaski; 12-14-2011 at 02:55 AM.
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