Scott Moir says its a piss off

dorispulaski, the "last five years" comment may not be literal. It's one of those round numbers that people say when they mean "for a good long while now". I'm not sure if Scott was really thinking in his head that V/M are better than all those past greats artistically.

However, there is little doubt that Scott is saying he thinks V/M are better than D/W artistically. I mean, that is the comparison he's being asked about, and the competition between them just happened. As the saying goes, "it's only arrogance if you're wrong". And so... despite being a far bigger fan of V/M than D/W, I'm gonna have to say Scott is wrong. Prior to this season, I might have agreed with Scott. But I just plain dislike "Funny Face" as a program. It's schmaltzy, superficial and relies on direct mimicry of characters from a movie right down to the costumes without any imagination, reinterpretation or thought. It's a game of charades with the answers spelled out. I find it a huge step down from their past FDs. D/W's FD, on the other hand, is a masterpiece. It's a classy roller coaster of a dance that sets a lovely and thrilling mood rather than any histrionic storytelling. If anything, I'm disappointed the judges kept the PCS between the two teams so close as to be statistically tied.

And therein lies the problem: Scott probably expected the judges to respond better to such ham-handed and obvious pantomime aimed directly at the nostalgia of their age group. And he's right, despite Davis/White somehow still pulling minutely ahead in PCS. It is the kind of slop skating judges eat up. Go for it if you must to win, but don't pretend it's artistically superior.

I think it's good that skaters express their feelings towards the judging. If they are not happy with it, they should say it aloud. That shows the judges that they need to judge carefully and puts more pressure on them.

KKonas said:

Well, since I have covered their careers since they were juniors, I can say that Meryl & Charlie are too classy for this kind of rhetoric.

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Not only classy, but smart: audiences remember that kind of rhetoric and it can affect how they are perceived in the post-competition marketplace.

Given Voir's history of making these kinds of remarks, it must be very difficult at times to be Tessa Virtue...

Serious Business said:

dorispulaski, the "last five years" comment may not be literal. It's one of those round numbers that people say when they mean "for a good long while now". I'm not sure if Scott was really thinking in his head that V/M are better than all those past greats artistically.

However, there is little doubt that Scott is saying he thinks V/M are better than D/W artistically. I mean, that is the comparison he's being asked about, and the competition between them just happened. As the saying goes, "it's only arrogance if you're wrong". And so... despite being a far bigger fan of V/M than D/W, I'm gonna have to say Scott is wrong. Prior to this season, I might have agreed with Scott. But I just plain dislike "Funny Face" as a program. It's schmaltzy, superficial and relies on direct mimicry of characters from a movie right down to the costumes without any imagination, reinterpretation or thought. It's a game of charades with the answers spelled out. I find it a huge step down from their past FDs. D/W's FD, on the other hand, is a masterpiece. It's a classy roller coaster of a dance that sets a lovely and thrilling mood rather than any histrionic storytelling. If anything, I'm disappointed the judges kept the PCS between the two teams so close as to be statistically tied.

And therein lies the problem: Scott probably expected the judges to respond better to such ham-handed and obvious pantomime aimed directly at the nostalgia of their age group. And he's right, despite Davis/White somehow still pulling minutely ahead in PCS. It is the kind of slop skating judges eat up. Go for it if you must to win, but don't pretend it's artistically superior.

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I think this is spot-on.

Not only that, but it is, I think, totally wrong for them stylistically. FF is a Broadway program. Voir's strength lies in choreography and "feel" far more subtle than the razz-ma-tazz that a Broadway-style program demands. It's always a good idea to challenge and to stretch yourself artistically, and I do hope Voir learns from it, but as a program it is far less successful for them than Marlie's waltz is for them.

glam said:

I think it's good that skaters express their feelings towards the judging. If they are not happy with it, they should say it aloud.

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True but it was worded poorly. He could've expressed his concern without using harsh language do it won't seem like his dissing his rivals.

Redstone, Welcom to Golden Skate. We hope you post long and often!

You don't perchance go to UVM did you, where there is The Redstone Campus?

Looks like another candidate for Ego Management training. The list is growing!

Why are you bringing S&G up. The never said anything at that time.

dorispulaski said:

Redstone, Welcom to Golden Skate. We hope you post long and often!

You don't perchance go to UVM did you, where there is The Redstone Campus?

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Thank you! I'll try my best!
I have no relation to UVM since I'm not from the USA.

Skate Canada's attempt of “masculinizing” the sport is working. Male skaters with heightened testosterone levels are now not shy of using WWF language. The baa-baa black sheep is the new black. I normally don't watch ice dance, but because of his comment I did. So it has the potential of drawing people's attention to figure skating. It is a much more civilized way than actually striking the opponents' knees with a baton.

skateflower said:

Interesting interview, to say the least.
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sp...win-silver-at-grand-prix-final-135407983.html


Looks to me V/M are finally taking off their gloves and reveal their true feelings. I'm so tired of those 'we-are-the-best-friends' official line. Time for some popcorn.

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I agree. I'd rather an athlete be honest about their feelings rather than trying to hold to some insincere politically correct line-even if I may not agree with their views.

pangtongfan said:

The days of soft spoken Canadian stars is a thing of the past. As much as I respect Virtue & Moir and Chan as skaters their arrogance and self righteous attitudes makes me miss the humility and class of our past greats like Kurt Browning, Elvis Stojko, Sale & Pelletier, Bourne & Kraatz, Elizabeth Manley, Jeffrey Buttle, which is sorely lacking in Canadians Champions of today. I think alot of that stems from the CSA and especialy their arrogant leader Michael Slipchuk who seems to be pushing this in your face, butch, almost bullying mentality. It was even strongly rumoured by many that in 2008 the retirements of a certain number of well known male skaters is they didnt want any non heterosexuals competing for Canada any longer. That said as I said in the other forum I do like that the two teams no longer so buddy-buddy with each other, and have some animosity and extra desire to beat one another makes the rivalry more enjoyable.

If Scott feels they deserved to win the FD it is a reasonable opinion. Not one I neccessarily agree with, and certainly dont think it justifies his reaction. However if he thinks they were robbed of winning the overall event with a fall in the OD, when the reigning World Champions had two excellent skates, then that is laugahble. Although still entertaining and fueling the flames of the rivalry which is enjoyable in a way as well as I said.

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I agree with all the skaters you mentioned as far as humility and class-with the exception of Elvis Stojko. He's made his share of classless comments imo.

ImaginaryPogue said:

Eh, they complained a lot. They complained about judging at events where even the Canadian judge ranked them below the Russians. Stojko complained about the judges didn't get his artistry. I'll definitely give you Chan on that front, and Scott's comments rankles, but grouping B/K and Stojko has a cut above them strikes me as odd - I'd argue they were equal to Scot anyway. There's definitely been a gear shift in how Canadian sportspeople act, though. Heck - you could go back to Donovan Bailey if you wanted to see the beginning of that trend.

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Apart from Stojko's artistry (the only routine of his I liked was his Bruce Lee number) he often seemed to have an unattractive lean on the landings of his jumps which would probably lose him some GOE points in today's COP. Jmo.

Interesting point, skatinginbc. Maybe the federation won't look poorly on Scott for sounding, as you say, like a member of the WWF.

Honesty is all very well, but I kind of like sportsmanship. I'm not going to judge Scott as a person for what he expressed or how he worded it, but I would have preferred another reaction. After all, it's not as if he and his partner have been shortchanged by judges in the course of their career. Rahkamo and Kokko they're not.

glam said:

I think it's good that skaters express their feelings towards the judging. If they are not happy with it, they should say it aloud. That shows the judges that they need to judge carefully and puts more pressure on them.

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I agree. If every skater does this, we may see less corrupt judging.

I would prefer to hear a person's thoughts after they've had some time to reflect. If that means a boring "we're disappointed" answer immediately after a competition, that's OK. It is understandable to be disappointed in a result, but Scott's comments crossed the line, IMO. (I admit this is slightly hypocritical, as I am a bit of a hothead myself.)

jcoates said:

Chan should send Scott flowers for taking the attention off of him for a spell.

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and panties.

jcoates said:

Chan should send Scott flowers for taking the attention off of him for a spell.

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let`s talk said:

and panties.

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Or Scotties to wipe away the tears.

skateflower said:

I agree. If every skater does this, we may see less corrupt judging.

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There's a HUGE difference between disagreeing with the judges on how they scored and accusing them of corrupt judging. One involves saying "I think we could have scored higher" and/or "I don't understand why we scored poorly in this element." The other is saying "The judges are conspiring together make sure Davis and White are winning no matter what" and/or "The judges are accepting money/trading votes/whatever so this team can win."

I think that even though he could have said it more eloquently, I think Scott is talking the former not the latter. And I think that's fine. It's perfectly fine to question how a decision is made and I agree with the earlier poster that it is also reasonable to not hold feelings in. That said, there's also a big difference between "expressing your feelings/disappointment" and "I'm just going to completely rant angrily about the result with no regard for anyone else."

There does seem to be fans that believe that Davis and White seem to be the benefactors or corrupt judging and politicking, which is absolutely laughable because it seems to take a miracle for USFS to acknowledge ice dancing at home.

But it does bother me, seriously, that Davis and White are painted as a team that is getting favoritism or are given marks, especially when Doris and other posters spend a LOT OF TIME explaining why they got the marks they got. Again I think it's reasonable to argue magnitude or question maybe details -- "I think Davis and White should have only been in the lead by 2 or 3 points" or "I don't agree that they should have gotten that much GOE or any GOE" -- but I think it's uncalled for to dismiss their victory to some vague "they got it because of politics/corrupt judging" speculation and providing no facts to back up that case.

And I think while Scott is maybe putting a subtle dig at his teammates, he's definitely not saying, "Davis and White are the benefactors of corrupt judging" either.

And this is why I don't like Scott Moir. It's a shame too because I LOVE Tessa! :disapp: Oh well, at least it's easier for me to cheer for Meryl and Charlie now.

It's one thing to skate error-free and disagree with how you are marked, but when you plant your butt on the ice and then whine when you finish behind a team that didn't have major mistakes and say your scores are too low is when I have a problem. It's like Evan Lysacek (and Frank Carroll) complaining that he should have received higher PCS at 2010 Nationals when he skated with mistakes in both the SP and LP and insinuating that he gave the title away to Jeremy Abbott (who was error free in the SP and the LP). This kind of poor sportsmanship does not sit well with me at all. :scowl:

Of course, politicking doesn't merely come from federations, but coaching situations as well -- Belbin/Agosto were weakened not merely by being with Linichuk, but by being Linichuk's second team (after DomShabs); Pechalat/Bourzat went to Zhulin only when it became clear that Delobel/Schoenfelder were going to stick with Zazoui to the Olympics; Fernandez left Morosov because Amodio was clearly his number one; Cappellini/Lannotte spent less time with Morosov after I/K went to him, etc etc etc.

And while historically it might be true that it takes a miracle for USFSA to acknowledge ice dance, that doesn't mean that it won't ever happen, nor that they wouldn't attempt to push their number one team ahead if they could.