Wagner and Mahbanoozadeh- Rising to the Occasion?

macy · Dec 30, 2011

I tried posting this thread with a link to the article on IN here because it's where most people read but it was moved to announcements and I can't figure out how to delete it...but anyway, did anyone read this article? this will be a very interesting nationals.

iluvtodd · Dec 30, 2011

I did read the article about Armin moving to Colorado (we'll miss him on the east coast). Truly hoping that Armin & Ashley have great success @ Nationals & beyond.

Nadine · Dec 30, 2011

I haven't read the article yet, but intend to do so soon, however I *have* seen snippets of said article posted all over the net in varying figure skating forums. :biggrin:

Most are harsh on Ashley because she's saying it's her to lose and is psyching herself up mentally, emotionally, and verbally.

Whereas Armin has only had positive comments.

Myself, I feel for Ashley, and hope she can finally deliver. In fact I hope they ALL can deliver, just like they did back in 2008, my favorite Ladies Nationals of all-time. The reason: everybody skated their best and Mirai won (though I personally would have had Ashley, which I said so at the time and remain steadfast). Taking nothing away from Mirai. After all, the very best competitions are when everyone skates their best and you win.

***Note: looking forward to seeing what changes will be made to Ashley's "Black Swan", which I personally thought should have never been touched after its original showing. It blew me away.***

As for Armin, what a brave courageous young man to take his skating into his own hands and do what he deems best (reminiscent of Jeremy Abbott leaving his long-time to go to Sato & Dunjien). Seems like everybody is going to Colorado now to use that Dartfish because it was successful with Patrick Chan, whom watched the legendary Evgeni Plushenko's technique and copied it.

What's that old saying ~ "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery".

Violet Bliss · Dec 30, 2011

Nadine said:
Seems like everybody is going to Colorado now to use that Dartfish because it was successful with Patrick Chan, whom watched the legendary Evgeni Plushenko's technique and copied it. What's that old saying ~ "Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery".

If you read the article and others like it, you should have noticed Patrick Chan is the main reason Armin and others are going to CS. Dartfish is not just available in CS or with Krall. Chan, on his part, has been very willing to share, instead of keeping secrets of his success factors. He has frequently mentioned his desire to motivate others to challenge his records, and to emulate his holistic approach of bettering his diet, off ice training, sleep habits, etc.

That said, I believe that, given a choice, Armin would rather train with the Worlds Silver Medalist than with the World Champion.

dorispulaski · Dec 30, 2011

The first time I heard of Dartfish, Audrey Weisiger was using it, and Tim Goebel went there to be coached. It's been around quite a while.

macy · Dec 30, 2011

what exactly is dartfish?

ImaginaryPogue · Dec 30, 2011

It's a computer program that helps you improve your jump technique. It allows you to overlay your jump with "an ideal" version of that jump, in terms of technique, height, etc. Nadine refers to Plushenko, and his 4T is the jump that is the model for Patrick Chan. It's not just a figure skating software, though (according to their website, which you can google).

macy · Dec 31, 2011

wow that's really cool. must be expensive if most rinks don't have it. it will be interesting what happens at nationals, although i don't think ashley will win even if she skates clean, unless everyone else doesn't do very well. i think the top contender at this point is alissa, maybe mirai if her long program is actually more enjoyable to watch. I still think she will end up 2nd or 3rd. in my opinion she still has work to do in her PCS.

skateluvr · Dec 31, 2011

Ashley deserves a shot at worlds. I like her skating, her performance, her costume even so much better than Mirai's. Mirai's costume is almost copy of a white MK one. An exhibition peice I think it was. I am rooting for Ashley Wagner alone this Nationals.

macy · Jan 1, 2012

^agreed. even if she doesn't win i would still like to see her go to worlds at least once.

KKonas · Jan 1, 2012

macy said:
^agreed. even if she doesn't win i would still like to see her go to worlds at least once.

Wagner competed at Worlds in 2008 where she was 16th.

tulosai · Jan 1, 2012

macy said:
^agreed. even if she doesn't win i would still like to see her go to worlds at least once.

I also want to see her go to Worlds but she has to deliver at Nationals first. I disagree with her actually and think despite the GPF it is Cziny's to lose- if she goes clean she's got it and I think she has a one mistake advantage over Ashley or Mirai.

I like Ashley as a skater but her attitude does sometimes bother me. I feel like if she were really confident she wouldn't feel the need to say some of these things. Nonetheless I wish her well and I do honestly hope she gets to go to Worlds this year or next. She works hard and she wants it, and I want that to be rewarded for her.

chuckm · Jan 1, 2012

Alissa Czisny sprained her ankle during free skate practice at the GPF. It was obvious that she was experiencing pain on her landings. It was not a major injury at all, just came at the least opportune time.

So don't point to Alissa's GPF performance as a sign that she won't be ready for Nationals.

skateluvr · Jan 2, 2012

Haven't read the article, but is it somehow not *ladylike* to talk yourself up when you are the underdog as Ash has been with Alissa (so stunning-so flexible), Mirai (so spunky-an Olympian) and Rachael (reliable, US Champ, Olympic skater). Ashley is skating way better than Rachael, looking better than Mirai and Rachael, and is showing attack on her jumps whereas we get ulcers worrying about Alissa. I enjoyed Ashley far better than the 3 us champions. I did not realize she was at Worlds in 2008 as I was not paying attention for a couple years -could not really, but I think she has a great LP. And I am waiting for Gracie to come and conquer. I would hate to see Rachael get promoted to Worlds and this years Mirai is beyond dull. So, maybe it is her year. I hope she wins. Go Ashley. When Chan talked like this in Vancouver, no one complained. (or did they?) Sexism!

mskater93 · Jan 2, 2012

Dartfish not only overlays your jump with an "ideal" jump, the software has analyzed any number of jumps and can overlay various versions of proper technique over the mistakes. Specifically, free leg motion on jump entry (this piece of the software is typically used on Axel take offs for doubles and triples as a common mistake is a more "around" approach to 2A/3A), point of take off (is the free leg in its proper place, is the skater completely exploding off the skating leg to get maximum thrust) and air time (I think on a 2A, the minimum air time for full rotation is 3.3 seconds - it tracks air time so the coach can determine whether it's a technique issue: going back to previous analysis of free leg/take off position, or a strength issue: overlaid technique is correct, just not strong enough to get enough air time).

Here, Dartfish lessons typically are about $100/20 minutes. The software cost is $30K to buy it (unless it's gone down in the last 12 months).

mskater93 · Jan 2, 2012

skateluvr said:
Haven't read the article, but is it somehow not *ladylike* to talk yourself up when you are the underdog as Ash has been with Alissa (so stunning-so flexible), Mirai (so spunky-an Olympian) and Rachael (reliable, US Champ, Olympic skater). Ashley is skating way better than Rachael, looking better than Mirai and Rachael, and is showing attack on her jumps whereas we get ulcers worrying about Alissa.

Ashley is probably using a technique she learned from a sports psychologist, sports psychology clinic, sports psychology books, or something Mr. Nicks and Phillip Mills is instilling in her from a positive self talk/imagery/and setting expectation standpoint. The more you're positive in your "head" and in your discussions with yourself, the more you are able to lay it on the line when it counts. For every negative thought you have, you need 2-3 to erase it so that when you dig in the jar to compete, your chances are greater than 50/50 of pulling out a positive thought than a negative thought. I believe I have heard that if you are 50/50 negative in your discussions with yourself in your head, the chances of pulling out a negative thought under pressure increase by 50%. She needs to move beyond that point and by telling herself she's the favorite and should be able to win, she's improving the probability of pulling out that positive thought during her performance. I don't know why people are getting worked up over that...

Jammers · Jan 2, 2012

Mirai is wasting her considerable talent by not getting in good enough shape and playing around with her career. Watching her this year is like watching zombies on ice because she shows about as much emotion as the walking dead. Even if she doesn't like her programs it's her job to bring them to life and it doesn't even look like she's trying out there. Say what you will about Alena Leonova but she puts everything into her performances and leaves nothing out on the ice. Having said that a clean energized Mirai will still beat a clean Ashley and Mira does skate well at Nationals.

mskater93 · Jan 2, 2012

I disagree with your comment that Mirai skates well at Nationals. She's inconsistent. Both in 2009 (where she suffered from a growth spurt, injury, and outgrowing her coach) and last year, Mirai left considerable points on the table and stayed home from the World team. Last year's LP was a complete "deer in the headlights" performance from her once she heard Alissa's score. VERY disappointing. I mean, really, blowing a flying sit spin into a FSSp with no level in a Championship event is just, well, stupid, and definitely something that would not point to "skating well at Nationals".

Wagner, on the other hand, has kept herself home on multiple occasions due to BIG mistakes in the SP. If she can control her thinking in the SP, she can put herself in position to make the World team with a clean skate in the LP. I think this is Wagner's now or never season.

chuckm · Jan 2, 2012

Wagner has always talked this way about herself leading up to Nationals. Before 2010 Nationals, she talked about how she had an advantage over the other skaters because she had made the Grand Prix Final. She skated well in both SP (4th) and FS (2nd), but wound up 3rd and missed a trip to the Olympics.

Last season, she was double-footing many of her jumps, which left her 7th in the SP, 5th in the FS and 6th overall at Nationals. At least she seems to have overcome that particular problem.

pangtongfan · Jan 3, 2012

Ashley is delusional if she thinks the National title is hers to lose. She and maybe her Mom or boyfriend are surely the only ones on the planet to believe this. If Csizny skates anywhere near clean she would never lose to Ashley right now even if Ashley skates her best. A clean Mirai will also beat a clean Ashley. She has to skate her best and hope for Mirai to make mistakes to even make the team.

For someone who has spent years getting her butt kicked regularly by Czisny, Nagasu, Flatt, and Zhang she sure is delusional.

Wagner and Mahbanoozadeh- Rising to the Occasion?

macy

iluvtodd

Nadine

Violet Bliss

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl

macy

ImaginaryPogue

macy

skateluvr

macy

KKonas

tulosai

chuckm

skateluvr

mskater93

mskater93

Jammers

mskater93

chuckm

pangtongfan

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