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Thread: Takahashi's SP vs. Chan's

  1. #31
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    I watched these two SPs back to back twice.

    For 4T, Takahashi did better. Can't pick who's better on 3T in the combo, and 3A and 3Lz. Both were brilliant. Chan's interpretation for this piece is perfect while Takahashi has a tiny room for improvement. I feel that Takahashi's this SP's choreography is similar to his LP's choreography. Although his performance is almost always top knotch, I prefer his this year's LP better than his SP. Takahashi's SP music has a weird no-ending ending which undermined the over all impression on this program. At the beginning of this season, I hated the idea of Chan keeping his Take Five SP. Somehow, starting from TEB, I'm beginning to appreciate Chan's this program. At last week Canadian Nationals, I completely fell in love with it. This was something that I've never felt for this program even at last year's Canadian Nationals and last year's worlds. That one foot footwork of Chan's is to die for. Where on earth did he get the power to push through such long distance with such fast speed?!

    I'd give Chan the win over Takahashi if they both perform like this in a competition. I feel that Chan deserved over 100 points and Takahashi deserved his. There won't be much dispute in such performances.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    I thought that Takahashi's closing combination layback spin was fine. It was his earlier camel that was weak.
    Camel spin is the widest spin and the most difficult to keep up speed and be centered. So many skaters are painfully slow doing their camel, almost at a standstill trying to complete more revolutions. Dai's was pretty fast though he didn't or couldn't do more rotations to qualify for more than a level 2. So many Men do the donut thing these days. I guess they try to receive a higher level call with it while also reducing the radius/scope of the spin.

    eta. I love the beautiful simplicity of lines when a good Camel Spin is done with great extension and position.
    Last edited by SkateFiguring; 01-26-2012 at 12:01 AM.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    Are you tempting me to show how their falls differ and whose program is better delivered with falls?
    Don't wast your time, it's not worth it.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatinginbc View Post
    You're welcome although what I meant was far from grandeur. I'm glad you are OK with it.
    I understand well people project but I accept them as they are even as I engage in debates with them. I keep myself very OK and happy that way.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    At the beginning of this season, I hated the idea of Chan keeping his Take Five SP. Somehow, starting from TEB, I'm beginning to appreciate Chan's this program. At last week Canadian Nationals, I completely fell in love with it. This was something that I've never felt for this program even at last year's Canadian Nationals and last year's worlds. That one foot footwork of Chan's is to die for. Where on earth did he get the power to push through such long distance with such fast speed?!

    .
    I am surprised it took you that long to fall in love with this program. For me it's love at first sight. It's truly a masterpiece in terms of both design and execution. I felt I was watching Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire dancing when I watched this program. And I can watch it again and again and never get tired of it. That's why Lori and Patrick are the best in this field!
    Last edited by Boeing787; 01-26-2012 at 10:40 AM.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boeing787 View Post
    I am surprised it took you that long to fall in love with this program.
    It might make you even more surprised that it took me two years, I finally fell in love with his POTO program at last year Canadian Nationals.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    Chan, when he is clean, is good schoolboy who did his homework well.
    Quote Originally Posted by skatinginbc
    Oh, no no no. What Patrick is, is cool. He's old-school cool. He's cool like the Fonz was cool.

    Let others do Fierce and Intense. I don't want to see Patrick skate to Bach's Toccata and Fugue in D Minor. I want to see him do Sweet Georgia Brown.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    Are you tempting me to show how their falls differ and whose program is better delivered with falls?
    You inspired my interest, so I did a little research. During the entire 2011 GP series, Dai fell only once (NHK Trophy LP) whereas Chan fell 6 times (twice in Skate Canada LP, once for TEB SP and another for LP, one each for GPF SP and LP). Dai apparently could not compete against Chan's diversity and propensity for falling. And here are some of the examples:

    Chan:
    Upturned turtle fall (TEB LP during CiSt3, www.youtube.com/watch?v=JK8GrUHrqLw 1:38–1:44)
    Forward frog fall (Skate Canada LP leading into 3Lz, www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYbdWqeLrkQ 2:48-2:54)
    And his regular sideways hand-down fall (TEB LP, www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAYBHthR4Gw 3:12-3:19)(GPF LP, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQIWeDxeW_8 4:16-4:28)(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeQ0PZDAsqo 0:38-0:45)(TEB SP, www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeQ0PZDAsqo 0:38-0:45)

    Dai:
    His regular sideways hand-down fall (NHK LP, www.youtube.com/watch?v=IevEFHTCqeo 1:04-1:12).

    Chan's falls certainly add variety and dimension to his programs.

  9. #39
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    Chan, when he is clean, is a prodigious genius with a Ph. D. before he could drink legally. A good schoolboy indeed.

    eta. Thanks Mathman! If I were one, I wouldn't have made the mistake!
    Last edited by SkateFiguring; 01-26-2012 at 12:18 PM.

  10. #40
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    Last edited by Mathman; 01-26-2012 at 12:46 PM.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluebonnet View Post
    It might make you even more surprised that it took me two years, I finally fell in love with his POTO program at last year Canadian Nationals.
    I may surprise many people by saying my favorite POTO is his SC 2010 performance. I think it's simply the most passionate version, while in 2011 national and worlds, his performance had an easy pace.

  12. #42
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    Now back to Pat vs. Dai. Between the two, I think Dai is a better dancer, but Patrick is a better skater. Dai wins the heart of the (biased or not knowledgeable)audience, while Patrick wins the mind of the judges.
    Last edited by Boeing787; 01-26-2012 at 05:03 PM.

  13. #43
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    Just because many (including myself) may prefer Dai's skating, does not mean we are not knowledgeable about skating. I can be in awe of Patrick's edges and technical ability and concede that he is the best in those regards. That may be what the scoring system values most at the moment. But many (including myself) may value Dai's interpretive ability, performance skills, and choreography more.

  14. #44
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    Chan will win even if he falls 10 times so what does it matter.

  15. #45
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    perfect Takahashi won't beat a flawed Chan. see above...It is Chan's title already. Just as Three triple axels couldn't beat the faster, Yuna with one big scoring triple triple....

    It is already seen that Chan has to skate really poorly to not get huge scores, and he will still win. So comparing the two re: who wins worlds is pointless. Dai is mature elegance. Chan is all over the rink, speedy, young and flashy. The judges love his speed and edges and the footwork done at such speed, they forgive jump mistakes/falls. Yuna was crowned and Patrick will be crowned until Sochi. Then he meets maybe the young, hungry and we hope healthy Hanyu. His coronation will happen in Sochi unless the Russian men have someone as good as Chan, and that isn't going to happen. Dai has maturity and that is why we love him-he is a complete, mature, truly elegant skater. Chan has the possibility if he keeps perfecting what he did at Nationals to be listed with the greatest single skaters ever, esp if he wins Gold in Sochi, and It looks very likely he will, unless he pulls out for injury reasons, or can't skate.

    Speed gets the votes. Irina, Carolina, Yuna are examples of how skaters with great speed often win over slower, but equally good skaters. I hope to see Chan mature as a professional but I hear he will quit after Sochi, and we will never see who he is as an artist. For now until Sochi, he is a CoP master and athlete. A great one.

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