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Thread: Senior Men's Free Skate

  1. #271
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Why the sudden concern about Jason Brown, a skater who finished ninth in both of his U.S. Nationals appearances?

    The same thing happen last year with Bradley. A few posters had the temerity to hope he might be able to finish in the top ten at worlds. Such posters had their heads handed to them: "He's not as good as Chan! He's not as good as Chan!"

    Yes, we get it. Jason Brown is not as good as Chan.
    Well, then, while we're at it, he'll never be as good as Kurt Browning, either...



    oh, wait, maybe I missed the point.

  2. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    Well, then, while we're at it, he'll never be as good as Kurt Browning, either...



    oh, wait, maybe I missed the point.

    Sigh...Browning. He's on his own up there in the stratosphere. Thanks for the chance to contemplate him for a few moments.

  3. #273
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Joshua Farris skated like crap at Nationals, compared to his appearances internationally. He had problems throughout the program.

    Why? I don't know, but perhaps the whole gig reminded him way too much of his utterly disastrous LP at US Nationals, skating on a broken leg/ankle/foot, whichever it was.

    Perhaps it just wasn't his day, or maybe he does not like relatively big crowds. Who can say?

    It isn't all the falls, you know.

    Farris fell on his 3A, underrotated his 4T, fell on his only triple lutz in the program, had a significant stumble in his straight line step, and had trouble on his second triple axel, resulting in only a 2t in the combination. So he had 4 major and one minor error in the skate.

    Brown had a good skate going until he screwed up & fell in a choreographic step, and then screwed up one jump and fell on two others, thus messing up the end of his program.

    It is entirely possible that Farris will beat Brown at Junior Worlds this year. Or he might not.

    We'll have to wait and see.

    It is possible that Jason will some day challenge Patrick Chan, but it is also most possible that he will have a career like Jonathan Cassar's, a skater who is much admired here in the US, but has never developed a reliable 3A. Jason has a lot of the right stuff, but it remains to be seen how he will develop in the future.

    If you're interested in watching a good performer, regardless of how they might finish, do try to get a chance to watch Jason at Jr. Worlds. It may be the last chance to see him internationally.

    He also may have a great career.

    And while we're talking about last year, the most maligned skater of the bunch was Ross Miner. Who is 3rd again this year, and won his first bronze on the GP, and yes, still needs to develop a 4T. The much praised Richard Dornbush did not do well at all, and has not podiumed this year. However, he landed a 4T of some sort at Skate America.

    Ice is slippery.

  4. #274
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    There is especially no point to compare artistry.

  5. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blades of Passion View Post
    I am not saying not to appreciate, enjoy, exalt, etc. But comparisons are often done with biases and agenda. So, I let judges decide in competition, and everybody enjoy their own preference without putting others'.

  6. #276
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    That's a really pointless way of thinking. We are supposed to compare everything. Any "biases and agendas" that exist will always be there and it's silly to say only the judges sitting at competitions should have an opinion.

    In any case, Jason Brown at 16 years old exhibited better Performance, Choreography, and Interpretation than any other male competitor I've ever seen for that age. Or any age, when compared to most skaters.

  7. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    Johnny first called Patrick's hands starfish when he was commenting on TV, in an American competition without Patrick....But it becomes tiresome when he repeatedly mocks Patrick's hands...But I don't deem it worthwhile to search for Johnny's comments, which are not worth the attention or focus. Let him say whatever he likes. Sorry, no links.
    No links, eh? So your words cannot be trusted. You are the one who criticized Johnny's "frequent put-downs of Patrick Chan" through his commentary and yet at the same time hypocritically claimed that "Johnny's comments...are not worth the attention". If so, why did you even make "Much Ado about Nothing" in the first place? And that's not enough. You even spread the subject to another thread. Indeed, this has been a comedy. Getting better and better.

    If you don't have the link. I do: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmTES...lated#t=1m015s) Date: 3/25/2010 for the World Championship. Patrick was one of the competitors.

  8. #278
    Custom Title ryanbfan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    :sheesh: don't these back and forths EVER get old?
    there's a reason I don't like posting on forums lol... if that's what you meant.

  9. #279
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    MathmanBeing a pro-Chan agent provocateur is a lot lonelier, lowlier, and untolerated than being a pro-6.0 advocate.
    On skating boards nothing is lonelier than having fond memories of eras past. But then again, we old-timers will be dead soon anyway.

    The funny thing is, I actually like the IJS just fine. But for some reason the fervor of the arguments put forward on its behalf always make me want to say the opposite. Go figure.

    As for agents provocateur, we are used to posts along the lines, "I just love Yu-na Kim to pieces. She is so wonderful!"

    Next poster: "I can't stand her. She lips her flips and Mao is prettier."

    To me, the present exchanges have a different vibe. There seems to be a more purposeful agenda in play, or something. I can't quite put my finger on it.

  10. #280
    Custom Title demarinis5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    On skating boards nothing is lonelier than having fond memories of eras past. But then again, we old-timers will be dead soon anyway.

    The funny thing is, I actually like the IJS just fine. But for some reason the fervor of the arguments put forward on its behalf always make me want to say the opposite. Go figure.

    As for agents provocateur, we are used to posts along the lines, "I just love Yu-na Kim to pieces. She is so wonderful!"

    Next poster: "I can't stand her. She lips her flips and Mao is prettier."

    To me, the present exchanges have a different vibe. There seems to be a more purposeful agenda in play, or something. I can't quite put my finger on it.
    I can put my finger on it, it's called the ignore button, works for me.

  11. #281
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    To me, the present exchanges have a different vibe. There seems to be a more purposeful agenda in play, or something. I can't quite put my finger on it.
    I can, or I think I can.
    Last edited by Bluebonnet; 02-03-2012 at 10:27 AM.

  12. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    The funny thing is, I actually like the IJS just fine. But for some reason the fervor of the arguments put forward on its behalf always make me want to say the opposite. Go figure.
    So you understand being provoked.

    Call me agent provocateur as you wish, I'm mostly provoked into refuting distortions of facts, non debatable facts.

    As for agents provocateur, we are used to posts along the lines, "I just love Yu-na Kim to pieces. She is so wonderful!"

    Next poster: "I can't stand her. She lips her flips and Mao is prettier."
    I enjoy people enjoy their idols, with all the and they want. They are entitled to their feelings. I am entitled to mine and find double standard to be told to stop mentioning my favorite for whom I have never posted a single or or made extreme proclamations. Mostly I defend.

    To me, the present exchanges have a different vibe. There seems to be a more purposeful agenda in play, or something. I can't quite put my finger on it.
    I'll tell you exactly what my agenda is as a "pro-Chan Agent Provateur": to refute nonsense and myths, either established or being built. Unlike jettasian, I don't call out intentions and disses of his artistry as these are highly personal and debatable. But when people keep saying he wins all the times with big margins with multiple falls and is the only one to do so because of politics, I challenge them to back it up with facts, they can't. Or I bring out the facts myself. Annoying, I know. But I am provoked.

    As for rebuttal of Jason Brown comparison which has been popular these days, it's another case of myth building and fact reversal I find it hard not to refute. I would have no objection to comparing their skating skills, and I have compared young skaters to Chan myself. No, Chan is always brought up as a late bloomer who didn't has 3A at 17, just like Brown, or even that he didn't have them till around 20. The idea of Chan being a late bloomer is so absurdly contrary to reality, and he did have 3A excellent enough to win international Senior events and the Canadian championships at 17, and became Worlds silver medalist at 18. How does that compare? It's like saying they are the same at 17 because they both have ponytails. Compare facts. Don't create disparaging non facts to boost your favorites. It's no favor to them.

    I do the same for other skaters too, even into debatable subjective stuff when people are overly harsh on young skaters and writing them off. I do much less for others because 1) I don't have as much fact based information about them as I have about the Canadian and World Champion; and more significantly, 2) there are much much fewer such distortions of facts, almost always with a negative bend, about anyone else, at least currently. Bashing, maybe; making up and spreading stuffs which then become accepted "facts" to be thrown about willy nilly, no. Talk about purposeful agenda!
    Last edited by SkateFiguring; 02-04-2012 at 10:00 AM.

  13. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Not every mention of Patrick is an attack. What I was trying to show by the three pictures is the improvement that Patrick has made in this area in the last two years.

    If you look at the pictures that I posted, in the ones from two years ago his hands do not add anything of artistic value to the pose. But in the third picture, from Malaguena, the one I labeled "yes!" -- they do.

    As I said, i believe (from evidence like this, and from knowing something of Lori Nichol's methods), that Lori has worked with Patrick on this.
    I'd like to see some OTHER MEN's hands, and see how they differ from Chan's. I bet not much difference.

  14. #284
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Those wishing to discuss Patrick Chan's hands or Johnny's rose wreaths should open a new thread in The Edge. The US Nationals Men's LP is not the place to do it. If you wish to discuss Patrick's hands solely, the Patrick Chan thread is a good place.

    Johnny, in his guise as an IN commentator of the LP is fair game, as is the skating of any skater who competed in the Sr. Men's LP, in this thread. Johnny's past interviews or commentary at some other event are not fair game.

    I have tried to find and unapprove the Chan, Johnny, starfish and rosewreath posts. I may have missed a few. If there are any left, please PM me and I'll remove them.

    I think my next Christmas wreath will be fake roses trimmed out with starfish. No one but me will know what that is all about.

  15. #285
    and... World Peace! Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by demarinis5 View Post
    I can put my finger on it, it's called the ignore button, works for me.
    Mods don't have that luxury, just like you can't ignore us, we can't ignore you

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