Page 6 of 17 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 ... LastLast
Results 76 to 90 of 242

Thread: Caroline Zhang - Can She Regain Her Spot Among The Top US Ladies?

  1. #76
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,880
    I agree with brightphoton. If young girls can't bear public comment on their fitness level, and aren't willing to get themselves into shape, they should reconsider going into a sport that entails doing solos in front of crowds and on TV in tiny sparkly dresses that expose most of their bodies. There are lots of other sports where they can cover up, or they can skate non-competitively.

    Censorship is a slippery slope. You start by banning body comments, then you ban any sharp criticism, then you end up with a boring board and fans who are muzzled in a way that's different from fans of any other sport.

    That said, I like that courtesy prevails on this site. If it were like sports radio and women (for example) were constantly being insulted, I wouldn't be here. But we're a long way from that.

  2. #77
    Down With It
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    13,483
    Still gonna side with DL on this one. Especially since I'm the one who started this thread- I most certainly don't want the discussion to turn to weight.

    Attempting to move on from this- It has been reported on Twitter that Zhang did a runthrough of her freeskate at Four Continents practice today and missed only one jump. She's said to be "[looking] very solid".

  3. #78
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    The Brink of Insanity
    Posts
    667
    Quote Originally Posted by Spun Silver View Post
    If young girls can't bear public comment on their fitness level, and aren't willing to get themselves into shape, they should reconsider going into a sport that entails doing solos in front of crowds and on TV in tiny sparkly dresses that expose most of their bodies.
    If these girls weren't "in shape" they would never be able to do the jumps and spins that they do. I don't think you or I or anyone on this board is qualified to comment on their fitness levels.

  4. #79
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,880
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonlady View Post
    If these girls weren't "in shape" they would never be able to do the jumps and spins that they do. I don't think you or I or anyone on this board is qualified to comment on their fitness levels.
    If the right to comment on a skater were limited to those whose proficiency equals that of the skaters, there wouldn't be any fan boards. Fans comment on athletes' fitness all the time. Ever check out the word on CC Sabathia, among others?
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...342728264.html


    Sure, even the less fit elite skaters can do amazing things. They could be even more amazing if they were in tip-top shape.

  5. #80
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    3,087
    But who are fans to say whether a skater is in "tip-top shape" or could be fitter? There are different body types. People always talked smack about Sarah and Emily Hughes being "fat" but they had exomorphic body types versus endomophic. Do you think Sarah would have been Olympic Champion if she weren't in shape? Yet, people always talked about how "big" she was. Some skaters that fans have praised as in "perfect" condition have since come out and said they had disordered eating (Jenny Kirk, anyone?) and some skaters that people rail on as "fat" or "overweight" or "huge" have been some of the biggest stars/most technically talented in their time (Ito, Harding). Please, disordered eating and eating disorders are HUGE problems in this sport, let's not add to it by giving a kid struggling through puberty a complex that they are "fat" or "out of shape".

  6. #81
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,880
    Sometimes all it takes to discern fitness is a pair of eyes, and I find it irksome to be told I can't tell if someone is a little overweight compared to other athletes. Plus, I spent enough time in a ballet studio to have a very acute gut-level sense of fitness levels.

    I've been on this board for six years and have never seen anyone call Sarah Hughes (during her competitive years), Midori Ito, or even Tonya Harding big or fat. ("Even" Tonya because I've seen her referred to as muscular or recently as having large powerful thighs, but the references were not critical.)

  7. #82
    Down With It
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    13,483
    But I've been on the board for 10 years and HAVE seen some refer to S. Hughes as "big" and "fat". Especially around 2003 when she grew.


    Let's just all agree to disagree and get back to Zhang...had I known the thread would head in this direction I wouldn't have even bothered, honestly.

    And...HERE is the tweet I was referring to earlier re. CZhang's practice at 4CC:

    https://twitter.com/#!/LynnRutherfor...33517340131328

    Just caught Caroline Zhang's run-thru of free -- missed just one jump. Big double Axel at end. Looks very solid. #4CC
    Interesting to see how she holds up compared to the other 2 Americans.
    Last edited by R.D.; 02-09-2012 at 12:19 PM.

  8. #83
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    The Brink of Insanity
    Posts
    667
    Quote Originally Posted by Spun Silver View Post
    If the right to comment on a skater were limited to those whose proficiency equals that of the skaters, there wouldn't be any fan boards. Fans comment on athletes' fitness all the time. Ever check out the word on CC Sabathia, among others?
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...342728264.html
    I don't think the comparison is apt at all. The athletes being discussed are (a) male; (b) well above the average weight for their height; (c) over the age of 25; and (d) not dealing with puberty and growth issues affecting their playing ability. And the articles doesn't suggest that these guys are struggling to play well because they're fat. The issue of whether baseball is a sport if it can be played by guys who look like Prince Fielder has been around since Babe Ruth played ball.

    Zhang is well below the average weight for her height. But some posters want to carp on her weight.

  9. #84
    Tripping on the Podium
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    61
    This thread has made me very sad. It is disingenous to compare skater body sizes to baseball players because baseball players do not use their bodies in the same way. It is impossible for an elite skater to be fat. It is cruel to call anyone heavy when they are indeed very small.

    http://www.shutterfly.com/progal/sli...304803b&idx=18

    This is a picture from Nationals. Caroline has big thighs but that is because she uses them. Her thigh muscles are large like a bodybuilder has large arms. Her waist is minute. The shape of her hips is due to her bones. She is not anywhere near out of shape or overweight.

    There are times where I read boards and see people shouting about fat skaters and what they are really complaining about is that a skater has a large bust, or that they have naturally wide hips, or they have a plump cheeks. And I wonder, what would satisfy those people? Must Caroline cut off the sides of her hip bones or remove her breasts? Must she never eat again? Different people have different body shapes. Being "fit" produces not the same universal image.

  10. #85
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    756
    The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

  11. #86
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    The Brink of Insanity
    Posts
    667
    Quote Originally Posted by Spun Silver View Post
    Sometimes all it takes to discern fitness is a pair of eyes, and I find it irksome to be told I can't tell if someone is a little overweight compared to other athletes. Plus, I spent enough time in a ballet studio to have a very acute gut-level sense of fitness levels.
    It's been my experience that dancers are the WORST people for thinking they're fat when they're not. Body dysmorphia is practically a job requirement. So no, I don't think you're really qualified to decide who is fat and who isn't.

  12. #87
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    4,880
    To put all this into perspective, here is the comment that aroused all these urgent calls to protect the skaters:
    I noticed that Ashley was looking leaner and more muscular at Nationals. Agnes always looks to be in great shape.
    This is people's idea of a post that endangers the wellbeing of skaters? Good grief. People are going way overboard.

    Onto 4CCs. Good luck to Caroline and all the rest.

    PS: Dragonlady, sorry I don't meet your qualifications. Maybe you should Ignore me as I have no intention of trying to follow your directions. Or feel free to spend your time following me around and criticizing me! I don't really care!
    Last edited by Spun Silver; 02-09-2012 at 01:05 PM.

  13. #88
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Hollywood, CA
    Posts
    3,890
    Quote Originally Posted by R.D. View Post
    But I've been on the board for 10 years and HAVE seen some refer to S. Hughes as "big" and "fat". Especially around 2003 when she grew.
    I can't believe anyone ever called S. Hughes fat before 2003.

    In 2003 she WAS overweight in comparison to what she should have been for ideal competitive shape and it showed in her jumps.

    Emily Hughes similarly did not pay perfect attention to her fitness level and it showed in competition. Yes, she has a larger frame in general, but there was more to it than that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonlady View Post
    Eating disorders are made much worse when young, impressionable skaters go on message boards and post that Sally Skater is fat. Sally is already struggling with her body because puberty does that to an athlete and then she reads that on top of the problem that she can't do half the stuff she used to do, everyone is commenting that she's fat, and it sends her over the edge.

    Last but not least, skaters read the board. People tell them not to but they do. How would you feel if all these strangers said you were fat. Kelly Osbourne has talked about the pain of reading people's comments on the internet.

    So choose to be part of the solution and not part of the problem and ignore the issue.
    As always, you choose the path of ignorance.

    The PROBLEM is not people talking about these athletes being overweight, the problem is that these athletes are not receiving the eduction and motivation they need to practice the correct diet and exercise regimens in order to have ideal bodies (which is not to say any one specific body, but rather the ideal body for that individual).

    Being a competitive athlete is about honing your body to the best it can be. It's not an easy thing; you have to give up many traditional foods and habits and want to push yourself every day. If these young ladies can not handle the pressure and the work required to be a competitive athlete, then they should not be one. There is absolutely no reason for us coddle these people and not speak the truth. Lack of proper nutrition and exercise is a big problem in society, especially in this age of terrible processed foods shoved down peoples' throats by businesses and people sitting around in offices all day and then going home and sitting on the couch. We need to address those issues in order for society to improve and competitive athletes certainly SHOULD be receiving flack for not maintaining ideal bodies. It's their JOB.

    Most young people are naturally going to face body image issues with puberty (and not just girls, it's ridiculous how you insinuate that males don't have big personal issues in this regard as well) and that is something which needs to be thoroughly explained to them and they need proper guidance with. Once again, education is key and people are not getting it. Society needs to be more open and honest when it comes it talking about bodies and sexuality. Young people go through so much self-doubt and self-loathing as a result of parents and communities being too scared and/or uneducated and/or closed-minded to enlighten their children.
    Last edited by Blades of Passion; 02-09-2012 at 01:23 PM.

  14. #89
    Down With It
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    13,483
    Quote Originally Posted by Spun Silver View Post
    This is people's idea of a post that endangers the wellbeing of skaters? Good grief. People are going way overboard.
    Actually you have to go further back...almost to the beginning of the thread. It took a while to escalate, but this is where it all started (this is by the same poster BTW)

    Post #9:
    I have believed for some time now that Caroline's weight was her biggest issue. People talk about her slow speed, ugly mule-kick, poor edges and horrendous technique. But her speed, kick, edges and technique put her on 14 podiums. It was only when she gained weight that her problems started.

  15. #90
    Custom Title
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    2,616
    I have been reading the reports at FSU. Ashley has been having trouble with two-foots. Richard has had rough practice sessions. Mao and Kanako look strong.

Page 6 of 17 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •