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Thread: Ladies' Short Program, Fri. 2/10 at 2:50 pm EST

  1. #271
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    Quote Originally Posted by skatingfan04 View Post
    Cynthia managed to be a complete disaster yet again. Honestly, Amelie better get that spot. Even with the pop, she out skated Cynthia tonight, as she has been all season (and part of last season). I think it's rediculous that this poor girl has to fight for a spot that she has rightfully earned over and over again.

    Don't get me wrong, I think that Cynthia is a better skater, in terms of artistry and such, but she's proven time and time again this season that she can't keep it together when it comes to the jumps. There's a limit to the number of second chances she should be getting.
    This is exactly how I feel (except I really don't have an opinion on either of them when it comes to artistry.)

  2. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    This one spot may determine the number of Canadian entries for the Olympics and I think Skate Canada has more faith in Phaneuf at her best or close to it but she's had problems all this season, prompting her to leave her long time coach to move to Toronto to train with Orser 6 weeks before the Nationals. Then she lost to Amelie due mainly to messing up the first jump of the SP combo. Skate Canada is basically in a dilemma and hoping for a clearer winner, especially in an International situation.
    Maybe Canada should pic their team on results, not potential. That might make Phaneuf clean up her skating, toughen up and just plain skate better! Must be demoralizing for their National Champ who has defeated Phaneuf every time this year. Officials/experts seem to never let sport just play out.

  3. #273
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    Quote Originally Posted by tampro1 View Post
    Maybe Canada should pic their team on results, not potential. That might make Phaneuf clean up her skating, toughen up and just plain skate better! Must be demoralizing for their National Champ who has defeated Phaneuf every time this year. Officials/experts seem to never let sport just play out.
    The thing is Amelie Lacoste has not exactly been shining, just better than Phaneuf recently. Phaneuf does have some good records, more experienced and liked by judges internationally. She also showed determination by leaving her mother figure of a coach recently and moved away from her comfort zone to Toronto to train with Orser, who is known for turning around some talents fast, almost miraculously but not that miraculouslly as to do it in weeks. At least Skate Canada didn't just pick her over Lacoste but is giving them both another chance to outshine the other convincingly. It's down to the wire tomorrow. They will have to make a decision, however difficult.

    Of course there are down sides to this process, being criticized and hurting the two skaters' relationship and national team spirit among them. OTOH, the USFSA's system, last year and this, does not make any better sense or prove to serve them well.

  4. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serious Business View Post
    Naw, she just has reflective heels, and blades that have this bluish tint that looks like the ice. And she's no Cinderella, the only thing she's sweeping up is ice flakes, with her butt.
    at first I was but after a moment I got sad

  5. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by sky_fly20 View Post
    ikr, and what if Amelie outskates her again here, they'll assign them both to another competition to battle it out again? and another one ? until Phanuef defeats Lacoste. ridiculous
    I would really be pissed by that time if I was Amelie, she could say that bluntly to her fed what they want.
    Right, because even with her disaster of a skate, Cynthia still is .96 away from Amelie who missed her lutz combo all together. This speaks volumes to SC because it does show that the judges prefer Cynthia over Amelie. After watching both skaters, I still say send Cynthia. By the time Worlds rolls around. she will be better; it's been a short 8 weeks with Brian. If I were Amelie, I'd be ticked that Cynthia is that close in score even missing 2 jumps. At least Cynthia rotated the jumps fully and this time her spins were credited at a higher level than at Nats; because had her spins been credited at Nats, she would be the national champion.

    I've been told by various sources tonight that SC really wants to send Cynthia to worlds as she is a safer bet; i can see why. As well, if Joannie comes back next season, which is a strong possibility, by that time Cynthia will be getting better results and may be even able to send 3 ladies to the Olympics, however, if Cynthia can't manage top 10 at Worlds this year, then I can see SC giving the spot to Joannie to regain the spots needed for the Olympics.

    In my opinion, neither skated great tonight and by no means did Amelie really beat Cynthia i the short; they are virtually tied. The long will be a nail biter to say the least as they skate 1 right after the other. If Cynthia skates her long like she did at Nats, she will beat Amelie.

  6. #276
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    I said if. I understand why they want Phanuef as they think she is more experienced and has a better record internationally but the long hopefully will determine and will be the last one. If Lacoste Wins, hope she doesnt have to battle Phanuef again in some B competitions

  7. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by lise View Post
    Right, because even with her disaster of a skate, Cynthia still is .96 away from Amelie who missed her lutz combo all together. This speaks volumes to SC because it does show that the judges prefer Cynthia over Amelie. After watching both skaters, I still say send Cynthia. By the time Worlds rolls around. she will be better; it's been a short 8 weeks with Brian. If I were Amelie, I'd be ticked that Cynthia is that close in score even missing 2 jumps. At least Cynthia rotated the jumps fully and this time her spins were credited at a higher level than at Nats; because had her spins been credited at Nats, she would be the national champion.

    I've been told by various sources tonight that SC really wants to send Cynthia to worlds as she is a safer bet; i can see why. As well, if Joannie comes back next season, which is a strong possibility, by that time Cynthia will be getting better results and may be even able to send 3 ladies to the Olympics, however, if Cynthia can't manage top 10 at Worlds this year, then I can see SC giving the spot to Joannie to regain the spots needed for the Olympics.

    In my opinion, neither skated great tonight and by no means did Amelie really beat Cynthia i the short; they are virtually tied. The long will be a nail biter to say the least as they skate 1 right after the other. If Cynthia skates her long like she did at Nats, she will beat Amelie.
    No one is questioning who the judges prefer. But Cynthia has yet to beat Amelie this season. Poor Amelie...she thinks this is a sport. Sorry girl, it's not about what happens on the ice.

  8. #278
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    I agree with Tempro1. Win or go home. This is making Skate Canada look like the French Federation.

  9. #279
    leave no stone unturned seniorita's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    I agree with Tempro1. Win or go home. This is making Skate Canada look like the French Federation.
    I thought FF does what Russia does too, send the iffy skaters to Euros and the best goes to Worlds or Olys?Or no?
    I remember only some drama in 2010 where they prediceded to send Ponsero to Euros and Amodio to Olympic Games.
    On second thought that looks like Cyntia's and Lacoste situation, maybe I m just used to RF and FF deciding this way and the skaters know it too.

  10. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by lise View Post
    Right, because even with her disaster of a skate, Cynthia still is .96 away from Amelie who missed her lutz combo all together. This speaks volumes to SC because it does show that the judges prefer Cynthia over Amelie. After watching both skaters, I still say send Cynthia. By the time Worlds rolls around. she will be better; it's been a short 8 weeks with Brian. If I were Amelie, I'd be ticked that Cynthia is that close in score even missing 2 jumps.
    That's what I thought at first, but then I remembered that popping is WORSE than falling.

    For her 2a and solo triple, Amelie received 3.94 + .3 = 4.24
    For her 2a and solo triple, Cynthia received 1.8 + 3.9 = 5.70

    Cynthia's TES was .72 higher than Amelie's. She actually had a 4.7 advantage in base value, but had more -GOE. Cynthia's PCS advantage was only .32.

    I like Amelie's skating, I hope she wins her spot - AGAIN - and has a great time at Worlds, with great skates. I do hope if she goes, someone prevails on her to switch her lutz for a 3sal or 3toe in the SP. She's not going to get high PCS ANYWAY (thank you Skate Canada, for heaps of scorn all season long), so she might as well attempt easier skills that she can do well.

  11. #281
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    Skate Canada will be criticized mightily whoever they select. To my eye Lacoste has demonstrated that she has the goods to be a top ten skater, and Phaneuf has been top 5 or 6 (I forget) in the Worlds, so it comes down to their competion nerves. I don't know how a skater gets past that, to become a contender - but Joannie Rochette managed it - though it took her a long time.

  12. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by seniorita View Post
    I thought FF does what Russia does too, send the iffy skaters to Euros and the best goes to Worlds or Olys? Or no?
    Yes, but I didn't want to insult Russia and France and Canada all in the same post.

    There are different ways to do things. But what I don't like is the idea that there are these king-makers (federation officials) that act like they are the big players in the game of figure skating, rather than the skaters. The skaters get pushed off to the side while the big shots strut and fret.

    It would be perfectly fine to use Four Continents and Europeans as qualifying events for Worlds. But then say so. It seems like there are not really any guidelines in place and the federations just make up the rules as they go along, to manipulate the results on an ad hoc basis.

    In this situation, it is not fair to Lacoste because if Phaneuf had won nationals the Canadian Federation would have said, well, Phaneuf is the national champion so she goes to worlds. Since it didn't happen that way, now they say, "OK, two out of three?"

    I would have no objection if Skate Canada had announced their policy beforehand in a straight-forward way. But this behind-the-scenes winking and nodding makes them look like just another bunch of crooks in a crooked sport.

    Quote Originally Posted by veravina
    Skate Canada will be criticized mightily whoever they select.
    And rightly so, in my opinion. They have brought criticism down upon themselves.

  13. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilvskating View Post
    I don't get Mao's PCS. Nobody in this competition should get PCS close to Mao's IMO. Congratulations to all the top ladies but the scores do not seem right to me.
    I agree with this. I always feel like Mao is underscored in PCS. Her basic skating skills and quality of movement is so far ahead of most of the field, yet this is barely reflected in the scores. To me, her step sequence in the short seemed twice as difficult as everyone else's--all those exquisite turns and twizzles--yet she makes it look effortless.

    Here's what I don't get: Patrick Chan seems to get unbelievable PCS no matter how he skates, apparently because he has the best basic skating skills in the field. Same goes for Kostner, to a lesser extent. Yet other skaters like Mao, who to me seem vastly more talented than most of the field, do not get this automatic PCS boost. Would love if someone could explain why not.

  14. #284
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    How are their relative speeds? Is Mao as fast as Kostner? (Carolina is super fast, but I've never been lucky enough to see Mao live.)

  15. #285
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    re: Asada

    Well, for a long time, she WASN'T the best skating skills skater of the field. When she was with Tarasova, Kim and Rochette both eclipsed her there (Kostner has been ahead of her for quite some time). Having seen her and no one else at 4CC, I'd say her scores were fair.

    re: Phaneuf vs LaCoste

    What Mathman said. This isn't about giving the ladies a chance to prove themselves in front of an international stage. This is about giving Phaneuf a second chance. And maybe a little bit sucking up to Orser (coach more Canadians!!!). Everyone seems to agree that Phaneuf has more potential to score higher than LaCoste. But the fact is, she's not outscoring LaCoste EVEN when LaCoste is making major errors. So how much, in the end, should potential be worth? I have to admit, should Phaneuf beat LaCoste here and get sent to Worlds, I'm gonna be rooting against her (or more accurately, I'm rooting against Skate Canada's actions and would like to see it backfire).

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