LADIES LONG PROGRAM Thread

[let`s talk]

^ But in the long run, they have the power of the purse. They will do fine.

Not sure that I got the reference to the power of purse.

[100yen]

Wafflecakes' ignorance is impressive, too. Fitness does not equal acclimatization. There is only one way to acclimatize, and that is to be at altitude and preferably, train and practice there for at least a short while. There is absolutely nothing you can do at lower levels to circumvent this process. Lowland-based skaters (or any other athlete) who don't normally train at altitude but who must compete at an altitude venue, probably best should arrive a couple of weeks early in order to allow their bodies to do this, and to make the breathing adjustments necessary to take in enough oxygen. Obviously, the vast majority of competititors do not have the time or money to be able to park themselves early at Colorado Springs to do this.

I agree. I know it is difficult for every Japanese skater because essentially every major Japanese city is at sea level. Tokyo at only about 15 feet above, while Colorado Springs is at about 6000 feet above. That's a pretty crazy adjustment for any athlete

[sky_fly20]

Not sure that I got the reference to the power of purse.

I think he means Japan's sponsorships, they give a lot of the sponsorships to skating, no ?

although I agree with you, NHK and Cup of Russia has the least inflated scores
I am actually amazed how scores even with the Japanese and Russian Nationals are almost the same in International results not that much inflated
Mao's, B/L Pluschenko at euros , ice dance etc.

[Tonichelle]

I am so over the moon for Ashley, I don't think Mao is in any trouble of losing the World Title to her through politics or any other such nonsense. It's not like Ashley is a judges favorite now or ever. Ashley's worked hard to get to where she is, and it's starting to -finally- pay off. Mao was beautiful on the ice, and I wouldn't have complained if she won. It could've gone either way. Ashley held my attention more/longer than Mao did, but I think that's more the music (Mao's was too quiet for night time lol).

Ashley will still have to skate lights out to get ON THE PODIUM, and we know how she can psych herself up so much that she flops... I'm hoping that doesn't happen (she's in a tough spot, if she doesn't podium will be all over her for not making it, and if she DOES then she'll have insane pressure next year that she may not be ready for and she'll flop then and people will be all over her), but it's a possibility. No need to hurl insults at a skater or fans because she happened to pull it all together. Don't feel threatened for the big prize... it's a new day a month away.

[macy]

ashley did SO beautifully. i've never been a big fan of hers but i think she's starting to win me over. she took total command of that program. i just hope she is able to carry this momentum not only into worlds, but into next season. alissa did absolutley wonderful, even better than ashley IMO in her first season with new coaches, then the second season was a little more rough. IMO they are both medal contenders and if both skate well are completely capable of getting 3 spots back. they are the best shots out of the US ladies at worlds right now so i'm glad they both made it. it will be interesting to see what will happen with US ladies now...ashley's back on, alissa is still fighting but who knows when she will retire, caroline making more and more improvements, agnes hopefully getting more consistent, the thought of rachael and mirai retiring, or both of them making a change/comeback, gracie gold most likely going senior next year, and who knows how much the other current juniors will improve over the next few years. i'm excited

[babayaga]

I must again state how horrible the tech panel(s) have been at this event. No edge call on the Lutz and no underrotation call on the toeloop? Those were obvious (the same with Caroline Zhang's Lutz).

Mao is extremely lucky that a stricter caller wasn't at this event because both of her Triple Flips could have gotten a <. I would probably give the benefit of the doubt, but they were both absolutely at least 1/4 turn short. Ditto for her Triple Loop (with which she was gifted by the judges to not receive -GOE for that landing).

This new jump technique is not working for Mao. She is needlessly focusing too hard on the Flip entry when it never received edge calls and rarely received < anyway. As a result of trying to take the entry on a cleaner edge, she is losing height and just making it MORE prone to < calls. That problem seems to have carried over to her Loop, where she is focusing too much on the takeoff rather than just exploding off the ice. In general she also seems to be waiting too long to start rotating.

I'm also highly confused by the changes that have been made to her spins. She is not doing her solo sit spin with the difficult flying entry, dropping the base value by .6, and she changed her final FCCoSp4 to a FCoSp4, which is worth .5 less. I realize she may not be able to do a FCCopSp4 anymore because of the changes to the new rules, although I actually don't think that's true with all of the different variations she is capable of, but there's no reason why she should be throwing those points away on the sit spin. I mean, she's clearly removing the flying entry from the sit spin so that it can be used as a level feature for the FCoSp4, but she could just do a regular CoSp4 with backward entry instead of a flying entry to achieve the level; they're worth the same base value.

And I'm STILL infuriated by the overall choreographic changes that were made to this program towards the end of last season.

This is the worst Mao has ever been at the peak of a season. Not at all what I expected.

But Mao just lost her mother a month ago. This could not not have affected her training and mindset. I think people's expectations should be a little lower at this time, no?

[SkateFiguring]

High altitude affects different people differently so it's hard to project the results here to normal events. (There is some discussion of this in the Men's LP thread.)

Obviously Ashley and Caroline demonstrated what they are capable of. But some simply couldn't perform anywhere close to their usual standard.

[Layfan]

I haven't been able to watch but .... Yey for Ashley and Caroline!!!!!!!! To be honest, it would have been upsetting if at least one of the Americans hadn't medaled at this event, given that their only real competition was Mao and Murakami, who hasn't been up to her highest standards this season ... but to have Ashley win and Caroline win the bronze! What a treat. After so many bad seasons I wouldn't have predicted that Caroline would have done so well this season and I am so happy for her. I am just thrilled that her hard work and perserverence was worth it. And Ashley! Finally national champion and now 4CC champion to boot. I think Ashely will do well at worlds. I know she will be nervous but on the other hand, she's not REALLY a top favorite for medals. She'll go in as another medal possibility but not a favorite. I think there will be more pressure on Mao and Carolina and even Alissa. People won't know what to expect of Ashely, given that it's her first worlds since 2008 and that could be to her advantage. I hope so anyway. I hope she doesn't worry TOO much about the getting the third spot back and remembers to enjoy herself at worlds and just the fact that she made the team and is there as the American champion. She seem to really like her Swan program, too, so that is another good thing.

[seniorita]

I ve got a naive question but since I dont know the answer, why did they hold an event in a place where it might cause problems for the majority of athletes, cause all I ve been reading the last week is altitude affecting their health or at least performances, and they all look exhausted the least, wasnt there any other arena in the world closer to sea level to hold 4CC ? I mean it is normal they wont always compete in the same circumstances they are mostly trained but from all competitions this is the first time I m reading so much worrying choice of a place.

[Mathman]

Not sure that I got the reference to the power of purse.

As sky-fly20 says, it was a reference to the fact that Japan is the only country in the world right now that generates any revenue for the ISU.

This was in response to the post by NotAnybody'sMother that the Japanese Federation was not in a position to apply any political clout to affect the outcome of this contest. And perhaps this played a role in placing the U.S. skater, Wagner, ahead of Asada.

My point was that politics is only politics, but money is money. Overall, the ISU is not going to stack the deck against Japanese skaters just because some other federation has political pull.

[Olympia]

I ve got a naive question but since I dont know the answer, why did they hold an event in a place where it might cause problems for the majority of athletes, cause all I ve been reading the last week is altitude affecting their health or at least performances, and they all look exhausted the least, wasnt there any other arena in the world closer to sea level to hold 4CC ? I mean it is normal they wont always compete in the same circumstances they are mostly trained but from all competitions this is the first time I m reading so much worrying choice of a place.

I wondered that too, Seniorita. Is it that mountainous areas like Colorado Springs tend to be winter sports powers? Co. Springs is a very important skating city for the U.S., certainly. At least for the highest-stakes competition of all, the Winter Olympics, when it's held in a mountainous area, a country can maybe send its athletes to a training center a bit earlier to get used to the altitude (I'm thinking of places like Grenoble and Innsbruck), but for a yearly competition like 4CC, the funds are probably harder to come by. I know that Patrick specifically trains in altitude for endurance, as the Kenyan runners do for track and field, but skaters in Japan or other low-lying countries don't have access to facilities that high up.

[Tonichelle]

They've used the area for skating for years... as I said previously I don't think the number of medical emergencies really warrants a ban on use of the facilities for competition.

[Mathman]

I ve got a naive question but since I dont know the answer, why did they hold an event in a place where it might cause problems for the majority of athletes, cause all I ve been reading the last week is altitude affecting their health or at least performances, and they all look exhausted the least, wasnt there any other arena in the world closer to sea level to hold 4CC ? I mean it is normal they wont always compete in the same circumstances they are mostly trained but from all competitions this is the first time I m reading so much worrying choice of a place.

Colorado Springs is where the USFSA headquarters is located, and they are well able to organize an event more quickly and more cheaply than other U.S. cities can.

The USFSA is having a hard time finding anyone willing to host their major events, like Skate America and U.S. Nationals because the local hosting organization is likely to lose money.

For the 2010 U.S. Championships held in Spokane, even though attendance was good the local organizers still had to scramble to get the money together. The state government had pledged to give them $50,000, but were forced to renege on their promise because the State of Washington did not have any money either. (A new state legislature came into power that year and the new legislators weren't figure skating fans. )

[Layfan]

Yey, just watched Ashley's SP and FS on Youtube. What great skates for her. Especially the FS, she was clearly in the moment. We've rarely seen Ashley on top but she seems to thrive on it - not one of those skaters who gets flustered by finding herself national champ or 4CC champ but one of the those skaters who embraces it and goes with it. She's not perfect but she's fierce.

[jenaj]

Philip Mills has done some very good choreography over the years for a number of skaters that I liked. AFAIR, he did some programs for Navarro & Bommentre and Inoue & Baldwin and a lot of others that I do not remember.

He did an exhibition for Michelle--can't remember which one. I'm sure someone else will.