Junior Ladies - Short Program | Page 6 | Golden Skate

Junior Ladies - Short Program

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Can't believe Lam, Shelepen, and Shoji are in 11th, 12th, and 18th :disapp:. Puberty monster strikes again or else they were all just having really off-nights. Vanessa and Risa especially seem to be struggling as of late, idk what's going on. I guess with jumps that small I should have expected this as a possibility...

I assume Polina won't be going to Worlds then, unless she somehow manages to pull up and medal after the FS (or I suppose even finishing 4th-5th could do the trick if her FS score is really strong), but skating in the penultimate warmup I'm not sure what her PCS will be. I'm sure she will pull up, I'm just not sure how much.

Did Christina do 3f-3t, 3lz, and 2a? I assume she got edge call for her lutz but 52 seems too low of a score for that content.

I can see Adelina surpassing Gracie after the FS. She's still a really wonderful skater, she just had a bit of an off performance today. Gracie's presentation leaves a lot to be desired. But, kudos to her for finishing 2nd after skating in the 1st warmup!
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
Ah just saw protocols. 3t-3t, e on lutz, neg GOE on 2a and messed up lvl1 spin explains Christina's score. Adelina messed up 2 spins which cost her quite a bit. Gracie got hardly any GOE on her flip combo and lutz, surprising. Downgrade fest for Shoji and it looks like she messed up 2 spins and only got level 2 for her footwork. On paper, you wouldn't think Shelepen and Lam's mistakes would have cost them as much as they did. If Simanckova hadn't double-footed her flip combo, Shelepen would likely have pissed out on the penultimate warmup group for the FS :eek:. Crazy. I still feel like she could end up medaling after the FS though. Joubert did it at Euros last season and Korobeynikova nearly did it at Euros this season.
 

jatale

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 24, 2011
Well, we all have our different opinions. I like Adelina's SP costume, it is "in your face red" and shows off her beautiful form and makes a bold statement. What can I say about Julia? Her spins and flexibility are just wonderful and her SP was clearly the best. Adelina would have been second if a few of her spins were better, I wonder what the problem was?
 

cjsk8fan

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 11, 2005
I was impressed with how Gracie was able to handle her nerves in her first real test. Her jumps weren't as spectacular and sure her presentation wasn't as good as Adelina's and Julia's, but look at the difference in experience between her and them. I am also not a fan of the gumby poses Julia does. I like flexability, but maybe more tastefully done. Also, it looked like Julia clearly flutzed, and yet no "e" call. I much prefer Adelina over Julia. I am not very good at scoring cop, so am not sure whether she was underscored here.
 

sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
I just saw Adelina's spin, that cost her a lot, got level 1 ? , her jumps were big
but what happened to her spinning position , that position looked awkward and she went slow
 
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Mao88

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 9, 2011
I just saw Adelina's spin, that cost her a lot, got level 1 ? , her jumps were big
but what happened to her spinning position , that position looked awkward and she went slow

Yes - wonder what happened with her spins.

Glad though that she has sorted out her jumps. That bodes well for the future. Hoefully, she will put it all together in the LP. Having seen the video now, I think she is starting to turn things around. Think she was a bit undermarked for her PCS
 

dorispulaski

Wicked Yankee Girl
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Country
United-States
Thanks so much to the video uploaders, so that we could see the top 3 ladies. I hope more of these SP's show up soon.

As you all know, ladies is my least favorite discipline, I know least about it, so take my comments with a grain of salt.

Julia was clearly the best, despite the fact that I detest hyper-flexibility in skating. And her music was nice. The camera angle appears to make all 3 skaters look slower than I remember them. Well deserved in first by a lot.

Gracie: I hate this music. She looks careful, rather than full on in attack, as at US Nationals. The 3F3T was a little off from Gracie's usual best- usually the 3T is as big as the 3F and the axis in the air is perfect. This time not. Good on her for coming back from a bad practice this AM and losing her skates in her luggage, then getting them back! BTW, looking at the protocols, Gracie got level 4 on all her spins (something she did not do at Nationals). Level 3 on the step, and the highest base level of the event. Despite this being dreadful, dreadful music, Gracie does a pretty good job of moving in time to this music, and doing something decisive with her arms at all those awful swoosh noices in it.

Adelina: I hate this music, too, and frankly, her execution of her spins and jumps did not impress me. In fact, I just watched it again, and the spins are dreadful. All 3 of them. And there is a 2 foot or close to 2t on the second 3t. And I hate the red tights. Perhaps the music and tights are over influencing my opinion, but I think she is lucky to be this close to Gracie. Maybe ordinarily she is an artistic performer, but she wasn't hitting the tricks on the rhythm, and the steps, which usually she does very well were just not on. In fact, I think she should be closer to Satoko and Christine than to Gracie from this particular performance.

Base levels:
Gracie 31.2 (3F3t, no UR's, no edge call, level 3 step)
Julia 30.0 (Vs Gracie did 3t3t rather than 3f3t, no URs, no edge calls, level 3 step)
Satoko Miyahara 29.6 (lip, highly underrotated on the 3t after the 3F)
Christine Gao 29.0 (3t3t, level 1 on one spin, and flutz)
Hae-Jin Kim 28.9 (3t3t,level 2 step, level 3 spin, problems with her lutz)
Adelina 28.1 (3t3t, level 3 and level 1 on two spins)
Zijun Li 27.2 (3t2t, and a flutz)
 
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sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
Had her spins been better though, that would have taken her ahead of Gracie. She lost quite a lot on them and that was the difference. Another factor is that her favoured combination is a 3Zx3R, which she was not able to use here due to the rules this year in juniors (i.e. that the Lutz has to be the single jump). Hence, she had to deploy a 3Tx3T which has a lower base value than Gracie's combination. She lost 1.40 points on that just by itself. Combined, had she been able to use her preferred combination and had she done better with her spins, she would have come away with a score in the lower 60's.

Also, looking at the video of Adelina's performance, I actually think she was undermarked. What were the Judges looking at?? As you say, the only problem element was the spins and her PCS should have been a lot higher! Had she got the better PCS that she deserved, the taking the above factors into account, she would be neck and neck with Julia.

I wasn't that bad except for the spins, but maybe the judges thought she had a not so good season
still I am happy Adelina is in top 3, she will always be my sentimental favorite
 

kwanatic

Check out my YT channel, Bare Ice!
Record Breaker
Joined
May 19, 2011
I watched Adelina's SP and it wasn't nearly as bad as her score would have you think. Her jumps looked solid, she had good speed across the ice (IMO) and she performed the program. The flying sit spin wasn't great and she had a bit of a hook-in problem on her final spin, but she still held the ending position long enough to get the extra level. Overall, I thought she did pretty well.

I think Julia is a wonderful talent but I really hope she finds a better choreographer. We get it, okay? You're very flexible, you don't have to pull your leg over your head every time you turn a corner. She lifts her leg 4 times in the first 30 seconds of the program. Flexibility feature are great, but overuse makes them annoying. :sarcasm: I can't get too excited about Julia yet b/c she has a lot of growing left to do and she could end up being a very different skater in the next two years once her height and weight change and the pressure starts to stack up. For now though, I do enjoy her consistency and flexibility (in decent doses) and I think she'll win this competition pretty easily unless she has a meltdown.
 

Li'Kitsu

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
cjsk8fan said:
I am also not a fan of the gumby poses Julia does. I like flexability, but maybe more tastefully done. Also, it looked like Julia clearly flutzed, and yet no "e" call.

Agreed on both parts... I'm actually not even that much of a fan of flexibility itself, just if it's used for beautiful positions. And Julias are kind of hasty and randomly thrown out there. I'm definitly wishing her choreographers wouldn't overdo it like that, too.

Loved Adelina though. Such a joy to watch her, and I'm mainly happy her jumps were there again.
Her Lutz looked okay, it wasn't her "usual" flutz, right?

And really good to see Gracie doing so well, she's not quite there yet, but I actually enjoy watching her skate already.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
To be fair, this is hardly Gracie's best performance ever. She was definitely tight on her jumps and she did not get the +GOE she has been getting in other competition. And in the Hersh article she notes that.

Also she got an early draw. She did not get such a draw at JGP, so I wouldn't be surprise if that score would had been closer to 60 had she skated later.

I think given all the circumstances — she did what she had to do and stayed focused. And to me, that's bodes well for her as she enters the senior ranks. The artistry stuff can be developed later; I think she is smart to focus on what she CAN do rather than obsess over what she doesn't.
 

noidont

Final Flight
Joined
Mar 27, 2010
Gracie's short program is so choppy, bland and labored. Choreography is virtually non-existent and the music is terrible. It's probably not her fault but this program doesn't work at all and with this kind of program she as a skater isn't going to establish a personal style. Gracie also seems slow today. Christina Gao should've outscored Gracie more on PCS.

Among the videos I've seen I actually really liked Ziquan Zhao. I've never seen her short program before and it was a decent surprise. Satoko Miyahara looks like a mini Akiko. Cute.
 

lavender

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Julia is a kid and kids are often more consistent and less nervous than athletes / people in their late teens + adults. There are actual scientific studies that examined the physiological/neuropsychological changes during competition in tennis players, young adolescents (till 14 /15 years) and adults. The results clearly showed that most of the kids have none of the extreme reactions to the competitive stress adults tend to have. Puberty is not all about the different body, it's about self-doubt, intrinsic stress, over-thinking. Maybe that's the real puberty monster.

ITA....

I also agree with silverlake on Adelina.
 

DianaSelene

Medalist
Joined
Aug 2, 2011
It is too bad about Sotnikova. She looked pretty good except for the spins. Spins are usually the least that a skater should worry about so she will hopefully get them under control soon. I've said this before already but I think she should definitely get rid of the lutz-loop combo. I think it hurts her confidence often because she often messes it up. And when you mess up your first jump, it is hard to have an amazing program after that. Considering that no one really does difficult combos today on the senior level, why just not do what Lipnitskaya does? 3T-3T. Or if that's too low, 3S-3T should not be too difficult for a girl who tries 3L-3Lz. I don't like this tactic of a horribly difficult jump that only makes it worse for Sotnikova. Maybe I'm wrong? Don't know.
 

Mao88

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 9, 2011
Just added some additional videos to post 107 above. Now have the Top 13.
 

sky_fly20

Match Penalty
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
It is too bad about Sotnikova. She looked pretty good except for the spins. Spins are usually the least that a skater should worry about so she will hopefully get them under control soon. I've said this before already but I think she should definitely get rid of the lutz-loop combo. I think it hurts her confidence often because she often messes it up. And when you mess up your first jump, it is hard to have an amazing program after that. Considering that no one really does difficult combos today on the senior level, why just not do what Lipnitskaya does? 3T-3T. Or if that's too low, 3S-3T should not be too difficult for a girl who tries 3L-3Lz. I don't like this tactic of a horribly difficult jump that only makes it worse for Sotnikova. Maybe I'm wrong? Don't know.

she did 3T-3T not 3Lz-3lo because in junior SP a Lutz combo is not allowed
I saw some videos before worlds she was practicing in a video clip 3F-3T and landed it cleanly but I guess she wasn't ready
but I agree with you, if you mess up your first jump it will damage your confidence in the whole remaining period you skate
as of the current, she has tried 3LZ-3Lo all season in her programs and has a success rate of around 60-65 %

I do not care if Adelina wins. I just want her confidence back
because I still believe out of all the current junior ladies, she has the most talent and an all around skater when she fully matures
she just needs to get it together. I am hoping she will pass this rough time in the coming seasons by then her growth spurt should stop already and hopefully her confidence picks up.
 
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