Biellmann Mania

[ivy]

Looking back over some old programs recently and one thing I noticed was a relative lack of Biellmann spins in Ladies' programs. Whew - what a relief! Any one else tired of Biellmanns?

I know they are there because they are specifically listed as a way to get a higher level from a layback in the CoP. But all the ladies now casting about to find the blade of their free skate and then wrenching themselves up - tired of it! The only one I can think off hand that I really enjoy is Caroline Zhang's. The way she lifts her chest and then rises up to the Biellmann position - that's magical.

Why all the love from the ISU for the Biellmann? They had to have known if they listed it in the CoP we'd see a lot more

[RUKen]

Irina Slutskaya used to include a lot of Biellmann positions in her programs. It is possible that she had some supporters in the ISU at the dawn of COP who ensured that she would reap lots of points for doing them.

[Dragonlady]

Irina Slutskaya used to include a lot of Biellmann positions in her programs. It is possible that she had some supporters in the ISU at the dawn of COP who ensured that she would reap lots of points for doing them.

The Bielman rules were not put into place to assist Irina. I don’t think the ISU envisioned anyone adding a Bielman position to every spin and spiral when they added the rule that the Bielman position would raise the level of your spins/spirals. They were certainly quick enough to change the rule and restrict the use of this position to once per spin/spiral in each program once Irina maximized the benefits to be gained by using the Beilman position, and other skaters quickly started following suit.

[macy]

i only get tired of them when someone can't do a nicely positioned one or a very slow one. beautifully positioned and fast, i can watch them all day. my favorites are alissa, caroline, and karen chen. even though it's not fast, i think ashley has a nice position. alissa owns the bielmann right now, hands down.

[larryb]

Agreed! Alissa is the only one I can think of who actually gains speed as she spins. It is indeed a beautiful sight.

[skateluvr]

I agree, the same spins, the same elements under CoP have made things more boring. CoP can claim one real improvement in the skaters. Footwork. Some top skaters have amazing blade to ice skills. There are so few who do a nice Biellmann. I also hate the pancake spin with arms down, and the sideways twist spin with arm to the roof. Everyone does them and few do beautiful spins. I also am tired of the Yuna camel. I much prefer the original.

[chuckm]

Irina Slutskaya NEVER did a proper Biellmann. In a proper Biellmann, the leg is held with both hands on the blade, and the leg is lifted above the head so that the skater looks up at her foot while she spins. Irina grabbed the skate with one hand and held her wrist with the other. Her leg was behind her head, not above it. Very few skaters are able to achieve the proper position, and most struggle to get into it, which is most unattractive.

[ivy]

Thanks chuckm, that gives me a new metric to measure Biellmanns by. I've looked at whether the skate was actually in line with the spine rather then off to the side, but you're right that having the foot farther forward and looking up at it gives you that teardrop outline that I associate with the best position. Irina's Biellmann was always one of my least spins, especially when she did it with one leg and then the other. I could see why it was hard, but never thought it was attractive.

Mostly I love Alissa's spins and would take one of them over a triple lutz any day, but her Beillmann isn't my fave of hers.

Guess we should be calling these spins 'Moskvinas'. She did them before Denise (thanks Wikipedia)

[eyria]

I thought Biellmanns were better as an occasional highlight, not a near-mandatory part of every lady's program. I don't like this new trend that all ladies have to be super-flexible. To me, it has the effect of making all the spins/spirals look the same. Also, I miss seeing beautiful classic layback spins performed for their own sake. These days, it seems like so many layback spin positions are held only briefly before the now-automatic transition into the Biellmann.

Right now, my favorite Biellmann spin is Mao Asada's one-handed Biellmann. It's a nice variation on the standard Biellmann and Mao performs it so beautifully. I noticed that Adelina Sotnikova is now performing this variation as well.

[treesprite]

In my opinion, almost all Biellmann spins are ugly and unladylike. Some of them it just looks like the skater is trying to tear herself in half, like if she keeps pulling on her foot, she will tear in half going upwards. Rarely is the position nice enough to look as beautiful as a good layback, like a flower blooming.

When I was younger and really skating, people had just started doing catch foot camels and there were no Biellmann spins. I always thought of the B. as a hyper-extended catch-foot, not a layback.

[Serious Business]

As others have pointed out, at the inception of the COP, Biellmann positions were even more common than they are now. Ladies would use them in almost every spin and then chuck it in the spiral sequence, too! That's because the COP's rules for level features for spins and spirals back then included one that could be satisfied with the Biellmann. Since then, the COP has been reconfigured to limit the use of the position to gain level features.

My opinion: it really was too freaking much back in the day. But as things are now? I don't have a problem with it. I don't suffer from Biellmann overload any more. Mind you, unlike some posters, I have no intrinsic objection to the position. When done well, it makes for a perfectly lovely spin.

[Skater Boy]

I like the Bielleman but it is rarely done right and it is ugly to watch people struggle to get into position. yes, Iriina did it to max out on COP but the rule changes helped us no longer be inundated iwth the Bielleman (kind of like a fanny pack a good thing at one time and then over done) lol. Plushy's was ugly.. I did see some inapproprite comments about guys doing the Bielleman by Patrick Chan and Kurt Browning. I think patrick who may have been saying how hard it is to be taht flexible said no self respecting guy would do the spin (or something to that effect). Kurt then said something to the effect he would leave it t Johnny Weir for the guys. You read between the lines and it isn't that positive.

[Vash01]

I like the Biellman spin when done well. I hate seeing a skater barely making it in that position, just to get more COP points. I won't ever get tired of a Biellman spin done by Mao Asada, Alissa Czisny, Lucinda Ruh, Nathalie (I forgot her last name) and of course Denise Biellman.

[Skater Boy]

Agreed Vash01, However there was something crazy to see Slutskaya do the Bielleman or call it something else on booth legs. Impressive Still a bad bielleman to me is better than some of those odd looking spins or variations. Sometimes those legs and backs are so hunched or crooked you wonder is this gong to get any points or levels.

[gkelly]

I like the Biellman spin when done well. I hate seeing a skater barely making it in that position, just to get more COP points. I won't ever get tired of a Biellman spin done by Mao Asada, Alissa Czisny, Lucinda Ruh, Nathalie (I forgot her last name) and of course Denise Biellman.

Nathalie Krieg

I agree. I like the spin when it doesn't slow down and the skater is flexible enough to get into an attractive position efficiently.

Caroline Zhang and Mirai Nagasu are two others who come to mind as having done it especially well.

I've seen others too -- these days there are so many excellent, good, mediocre, and bad Biellmanns out there it's hard to keep track of exactly who does it and who fits in which category. I've seen dozens of each.