Nagasu | Page 3 | Golden Skate

Nagasu

Poodlepal

On the Ice
Joined
Jan 14, 2010
I'm going to say something a little racist-sounding here, although I don't mean anything bad by it.

IMO, Mirai is hindered by the fact that there are many, many other skaters who are very similar. At 4CC, there was one "Asian girl, no-bangs, bun, skating to slow "beautiful" elevator music" after another. Had Mirai been there, there would've been one more. There are a lot of that type of skater in the US Nationals, too. Christina Gao and a couple of the youngsters would be in that category as well.

The young Mirai stood out with her cute choreography. No, it wasn't sophisticated, but it wasn't that same old-same old. She will have to either do the hardest jumps or combos--which she doesn't seem able to do, just that same old lutz double toe loop that everyone does (and does she even do it properly?)--or she will have to get a different look, choreography, type of music, something! Right now, there's nothing particularly special or noticeable about her skating.

I say to her: do what you want. At this point, it's more important for her to regain her love of skating than worry that a judge will dock her because she didn't do classical music or wear a tasteful enough outfit. If she wants to be a cute Carmen and not a sultry Carmen again, let her. If she wants to skate to punk rock wearing chainmail, let her. It's like they are trying to force her into a Yu-Na mold, and she doesn't seem comfortable.

I would also give the same advice to Agnes, who mysteriously went from a brassy blond showgirl with big hair and a sparkly top to a subdued, bunned brunette. There must be a lot of pressure to conform to whatever "type" is considered in at the time.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I say to her: do what you want. At this point, it's more important for her to regain her love of skating than worry that a judge will dock her because she didn't do classical music or wear a tasteful enough outfit.

Exactly. And if that is not possible, no matter how much pressure there may be from family/fans/USFS to continue, probably best to find something else that interests her.

___________________

You know, this "conform to the standard" stuff is really getting old. It's almost making me get bored with skating in general (apart from the US' ladies conundrum)...why not encourage different styles, different personalities? The NJS is already making most programs similar by requiring x number of elements, y rotations in spins, etc...no need to make it even more monotonous by having everyone skate to the same 5 songs/wearing same costumes & looks, etc. One big reason I don't even bother watching the lower-level skaters.
 
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Jammers

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 4, 2010
Country
United-States
THe difference between Mirai 2010 and Mirai today is partly that she was an 'underdog' back then. She was 'the future' and 'up and coming'. There wasn't as much pressure to win. Now, she's always considered a potential favorite and people expect her to win. She's never skated well when she's been the favorite and front runner at a major event. When she was in 1st after SP at World's, she caved during her LP because she was thinking about winning, instead of just skating.

It's a stumbling block for many defending champions - i.e. Michelle lost some confidence in 1997 due to growth spurt and worrying about not finishing 1st - thus falling at Nationals and leaving door open for Tara L.

The pressure to succeed is definitely something that's harder on the expected winners. i.e Michelle nor Irina nor Kurt Browning have won Olympic Gold because of the pressure. They lost to Tara (expected to medal) and Sarah who both skated with joy and abandon because it wasn't theirs to lose - IMHO, it wasn't as much the technical details, but the lack of joy and freedom in their movements that lost the gold in 1998 and 2002.

Mirai definitely has had high expectations put on her shoulders and she's got to develop the mental toughness and confidence to use ignore that pressure and get out there and just do her best. As trite as Michelle seemed, she made that attitude work for her - you do the best you can out there and that's all you can really try to do.
Mirai wishes she had the competitive spirit that Michelle had. Maybe Michelle didn't win Olympic Gold but she very rarely had meltdowns and was a fighter. Mirai makes one mistake and it kills her performance and she stops fighting. If she doesn't get tougher she will just be another talented skater who didn't pan out.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
If she doesn't get tougher she will just be another talented skater who didn't pan out.

To be fair to Nagasu though- that's a pretty looooooong list.

(Although, I would argue that getting to the Olympics and winning the national championship isn't necessarily "failing to pan out". That's pretty d**n good if you ask me.)
 

fairly4

Medalist
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
i agree r.d. --mirai isn't bad-
it more she hasn't lived up to her hype and the other hype so far.
she still can do it. it is more of motivation for her and how to handle not being (underdog) status.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I'm going to say something a little racist-sounding here, although I don't mean anything bad by it.

IMO, Mirai is hindered by the fact that there are many, many other skaters who are very similar. At 4CC, there was one "Asian girl, no-bangs, bun, skating to slow "beautiful" elevator music" after another. Had Mirai been there, there would've been one more. There are a lot of that type of skater in the US Nationals, too. Christina Gao and a couple of the youngsters would be in that category as well.

Aside from looks and race, I think what made Mirai bland this season were her programs. Had she skated well I doubt her race would be any factor at all. Mao fit the stereotype you suggest but she can skate her program magnificently. Perhaps you are suggesting there is now a generic quality to her skating, and I agree with that... for now. I think she and Frank need to look at tapes of Michelle and Sasha as they transitioned from teens to young women to find inspiration. These programs this year were skated with music in the background; there was no accenting the music. Kwan would usually put her spiral during a build-up in the music and Sasha often used her body to compliment accents in the music. It's these small things that can make a program go from ho-hum to very engaging.
 

Mrs. P

Uno, Dos, twizzle!
Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 27, 2009
I heard parts of the Spartacus ballet music on my local classical radio station the other day and it was shocking because I was thinking, "what great music; it's not bland at all!" This season I've associated it with Mirai and her lifeless LP.

The choreography and music cuts certainly did no favors, but I totally agree that Mirai could have really worked it if she wanted to.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Who chose the music, though? Was it Nagasu? Or her team chose it for her?

ETA: the discussion about race and looks- it's her generic skating that's the problem, not her race or looks. She once stood out. She no longer does. Everyone else simply skates through the pieces instead of TO them, which is part of what separates the good skaters from the great ones.
 
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Joined
Mar 14, 2006
I think her team - I remember her talking about choosing the tango herself but I'm pretty sure she didn't say that about Spartacus.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I think her team - I remember her talking about choosing the tango herself but I'm pretty sure she didn't say that about Spartacus.

Another problem if true. She needs to choose a program SHE likes, first of all. I think Team Nagasu tried to make her into a skater she wasn't, and she was clearly uncomfortable with it. But all this is a distraction from the main issue, and I think that is that she was undertrained for Nationals, for whatever reason. As long as you score the points and hit the jumps, who cares how boring or interesting the piece is, right? Unfortunately the jumps weren't there for her either. Ouch.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
What do you think of chuckm's point above that she was fine in practices and did look trained?

That is PRACTICE though. If it's not fully in muscle memory, once pressure of competition kicks in, most (if not all) goes out the window. Something similar happened to me a while back.
 
Joined
Mar 14, 2006
Mirai's practices at Nationals were perfect and skated with emotion. But when it came time for the performance, all the energy and emotion was gone and she skated like a robot. Mirai CAN do it, but she just doesn't do it when it counts.
But he was talking about practices at Nationals and "skated with emotion" sounds like he means run-throughs. I don't know - it just strikes me that many people are making judgments and issuing advice (like "quit") when they have little real knowledge of the situation. I would prefer people to say "it looks like she's undertrained" rather than "she is undertrained" and so on. Or give their evidence.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
...it just strikes me that many people are making judgments and issuing advice (like "quit") when they have little real knowledge of the situation. I would prefer people to say "it looks like she's undertrained" rather than "she is undertrained" and so on. Or give their evidence.

This is what I said:

But all this is a distraction from the main issue, and I think that is that she was undertrained for Nationals, for whatever reason.

In other words I THINK that contributed to her poor performance. Of course we don't know 100% but if commentary was restricted just to those who DO know, there'd be no GS or FSU, and for that matter, no reporters & analysts, right?
 
Joined
Mar 14, 2006
You're right. I didn't really mean to single you out. There has been a lot of free-floating advice and judgment aimed at Mirai this season and it gets to me. Nothing like kicking someone when they're down.

And the poster above who opined that Frank Carroll should watch tapes of young MK ... ludicrous!
 

Pikachuusb

On the Ice
Joined
Sep 27, 2005
I see that alot on here. When a skater is doing well, that person is everyone's favorite. When they are doing poorly, everyone instantly wants them to quit. Its easy for everyone to jump on & off the bandwagon when you are an armchair critic. Ive seen it with numerous skaters depending on how the season is going: Czisny, Zhang, Mirai, Wagner, Zawadski etc. Everyone has up & down seasons. Did I like the music or choreography Mirai had this year? No. Will I continue to support her 100%? Yes. Im a fan thru thick and thin for whomever I like. Great & poor seasons alike.

As for Mirai, I hope this upcoming year she finds the spark she needs, gets some great music & choreography and fixes the training situation. She is an amazing talent and needs to find what works for her. Obviously treking back and forth to Palm Springs isnt helping her cause. I wish her the very best in the upcoming season.
 

tulosai

Record Breaker
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
I see that alot on here. When a skater is doing well, that person is everyone's favorite. When they are doing poorly, everyone instantly wants them to quit. Its easy for everyone to jump on & off the bandwagon when you are an armchair critic. Ive seen it with numerous skaters depending on how the season is going: Czisny, Zhang, Mirai, Wagner, Zawadski etc. Everyone has up & down seasons. Did I like the music or choreography Mirai had this year? No. Will I continue to support her 100%? Yes. Im a fan thru thick and thin for whomever I like. Great & poor seasons alike.

As for Mirai, I hope this upcoming year she finds the spark she needs, gets some great music & choreography and fixes the training situation. She is an amazing talent and needs to find what works for her. Obviously treking back and forth to Palm Springs isnt helping her cause. I wish her the very best in the upcoming season.

:rock: THIS.
 
Joined
Mar 14, 2006
Ditto! Well said, pikachuusb.

I agree with you about bringing race into it, RD. Mirai does not look like every other Asian-American skater, for heaven's sake. No one else has her charm or regal carriage. But you do know Carroll was MK's coach? I don't think he needs to be told what to look for in her performances.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
I know, it just seemed tame compared to the race discussion, that's all.
 
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