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Thread: Ice Dancing PCS Rules 2011-2012

  1. #16
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Exactly. And that's why I was going on about the Shibs, rather than about D&W and V&M for this part of the exercise.


    Now, after I finish up figuring out how to write it up, I'll ask you to turn on the music and look for the timing (and interpretation). Hopefully, I'll finish later this evening.

  2. #17
    Custom Title skateluvr's Avatar
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    Amazing teaching Doris. One only finds such expertise on Golden Skate!

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    Exactly. And that's why I was going on about the Shibs, rather than about D&W and V&M for this part of the exercise.


    Now, after I finish up figuring out how to write it up, I'll ask you to turn on the music and look for the timing (and interpretation). Hopefully, I'll finish later this evening.
    OK, so this time I looked for the points of timing and interpretation. But not only did I listen to the program with the music turned off, I actually listened to the program with the music playing from my iTunes (I happen to have those songs). And by having the music coming from my own speakers as opposed to whatever sound the video feed was feeding it, really made a difference. It made it much more obvious whether their timing was right. In fact, it really highlighted how much they improved in the middle section. The first few rounds of the FD, they seem quite rushed through the dance. In fact, if you look at GPF vs their Finlandia showing (I just played them side by side), you will actually they changed the choreo slightly to slow them down during that section.

    I think the judges were about right -- though I think it's reasonable that they could have been in the low 8s.

  4. #19
    Rooting for the divas with Kwanford Spun Silver's Avatar
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    I'm just beginning to wrestle with skating skills in Ice Dance, but this is a wonderful idea, Doris, and the way you've presented examples is so helpful. This definitely helps me see what I'm looking at better. For example, in the 21st place junior couple, I particularly note the mismatch in that he is much more skilled than she is, with especially gorgeous knee action. He should consider shopping around for a new partner, IMO. In the 17th place couple, I notice increased speed and better unison, they're a better matched couple, but I don't see any other notable reasons for a higher finish. I guess those two teams were pretty close.

    On a non-technical level, it strikes me that the wording difference between the 9-level and 7-level skating skill descriptions is almost negligible. It's almost a sheer matter of style whether one calls great edges "effortless" or "confident," or acceleration skills "easy" or "effortless."

    This is fun. It will take time to plow through, but thank you!

  5. #20
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Interpretation and Timing

    Before we get into the nuts and bolts of interpretation & timing, I think we should take a look at how marking is done:

    Marking Source Rule 611 b, ii

    Program Components are evaluated by Judges, after the completion of a program, on a scale from 0.25 to 10 with increments of 0.25.
    Points given by the Judges correspond to the following degrees of the Components:
    <1 - very poor, 1 - poor, 2 - weak, 3 - fair, 4 - average, 5 - above average, 6 - good, 7 very good, 8 - superior,
    9-10 - outstanding. Increments are used for evaluation of performances containing some features of one degree and some of the next degree.
    and from Communication 1677
    The mark for each Program Component is established at a certain degree according to the majority of Characteristics of Program Component which are met. This mark is further adjusted, if necessary, according to the Adjustments to Program Component.
    I'm quoting these sections here, because Interpretation and Timing have a lot of different requirements. A team only has to have (at least as far as the documents say) the Majority of those sections to be outstanding to rank in the 9 to 10 region for that component. I wonder whether, in fact, the judges really do that; I can't tell you, I'm not a judge. However, if a judge thinks that a team does a poor job of showing "Relationahip between the partners reflecting the character and content of the music," they can still give a mark in the 9 to 10 range if the team has really good timing, picks appropriate music, and skates to that music, and if their motions are in character for the dance they have chosen.

    So when you're judging, if you think a team is lacking in one single area, you may well give them a mark in the 9 to 10 range. As Mr. or Ms. or Mrs. Judge, you can give them 9, 9.25, 9.5, 9.75 or 10. You don't have any other choices, once you have decided they must be in the 9 to 10 region.



    Interpretation and Timing Source Rule 611 b, i

    Definition:
    The personal and creative translation of the rhythm and/or character and content of the music to movement on ice.
    Criteria:
    • Effortless and correct movement in time to the music (Timing)
    • Expression of the music’s rhythm, character, content and style
    • Use of finesse1 to reflect the nuances of the music
    • Relationship between the partners reflecting the character and content of the music
    • Correctness of the rhythm(s) and/or range of tempo of the music chosen (Short Dance)
    • Appropriateness of the Music (Short Dance & Free Dance)
    • Skating primarily to the rhythmic beat for Short Dance and keeping a good balance between skating to the
    • beat and melody in the Free Dance



    1Finesse is the Skaters’ refined, artful manipulation of nuances. Nuances are the personal artistic ways of bringing variations to the intensity, tempo, and dynamics of the music made by the composer and/or musicians.
    To qualify for a mark of between 9.00 and 10.00 in Interpretation and Timing, a team should:

    • skaters/music/nuances as one
    • motivation from “heart”
    • wide range of inspired movements, gestures
    • skaters stay “in character” for the whole program
    • exceptional ability to relate as one and to reflect music, theme
    • superb expression of the music’s style and character
    • timing: 100% correct expression of Rhythms

    To qualify for a mark of between 8.00 and 8.75 in Interpretation and Timing, a team should:

    • skaters and music meld
    • internal motivation
    • very good range of interesting movements/gestures
    • excellent ability to relate as one to reflect music/theme
    • excellent expression of the music’s style and character
    • timing: 100% correct
    • expression of Rhythms (SD): 100% correct
    To qualify for a mark between 7.00 and 7.75 in Interpretation and Timing, a team should:
    • skating/music integrated
    • very good internal motivation
    • skaters stay “in character” for over 75% of program
    • very good partner relationship
    • very good expression of the music’s style and character
    • timing: 100% correct
    • expression of Rhythms (SD): 100% correct
    I'm deliberately not listing marks lower than 7.00, because no team at the Senior GPF got any mark in Interpretation and Timing that was below that range from any judge. Note that all three ranges have 100% perfect timing as a listed requirement. However, if the other stuff is okay, the "Majority" of requirements are satisfied, and a judge may decide to use the range.



    And finally how the teams were ranked for interpretation & timing: as three pairs of teams, tied or nearly tied.

    1 D&W 9.82
    1 V&M 9.82
    3 P&B 8.89
    4 W&P 8.68
    5 B&S 8.11
    6 S&S 7.96

    I probably will talk about the character of dances later in this thread, but at this point, watch the skaters again with the music on. For the last two items, you may well have concentrated most on their feet; now listen to the music and concentrate on the whole effect a team is going for, and whether every beat of the music is reflected in their skating. Are the crescendos highlighted? Do they end when the music ends? Are they one with the music, always dancing, even through the elements? You may also evaluate whether they are both relating to each other as they relate to the music. Do not however get involved in the story they are telling, if you can manage. This PCS bullet is about the music and their relationship to it, and there is no requirement here for a storyline. When they stumble, if they do, of course that oneness with the music is slightly interrupted. Perfect technique is needed before you can give them a perfect mark in this component.

    I'm redoing the links to be British Eurosport because they usually do a good job of synching the audio to the video as any. I'm always rather hesitant to comment on timing "live" on TV because often the feed is not well synched. When you're being an armchair critic, keep in mind that some of your experience of the dancing is shaped by the TV. You are less aware of differences in speed than the judges are, and your perception of timing may be skewed by the poor quality of the feed, and whether the station broadcasting the feed has done anything to fix problems with it. Cup of China had a particularly poor feed this year.

    You might want to hit the pause button at the end of each performance so that your judicial deliberations are not affected by British Eurosport guys. Or not; your choice. (If you're looking for British Eurosport coverage, always check out frida340's channel on youtube. She is not up as quick as NikaQuest who posts the Russian feed, but it is often worth the wait.)

    Davis & White Die Fledermaus 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvF5bIfB2kA
    Virtue & Moir Funny face 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jb-rY...eature=related
    Pechalat & Bourzat Pharoah & His Mummy 8.89
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ibngj...eature=related
    Weaver & Poje Je Suis Malade 8.68
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPPNx...eature=related
    Bobrova & Soloviev Faust 8.11
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6GRd...eature=related
    Shibutani & Shibutani Sun Valley Serenade 7.96
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xdXf...eature=related

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by dorispulaski View Post
    Before we get into the nuts and bolts of interpretation & timing, I think we should take a look at how marking is done:

    Marking Source Rule 611 b, ii



    and from Communication 1677


    I'm quoting these sections here, because Interpretation and Timing have a lot of different requirements. A team only has to have (at least as far as the documents say) the Majority of those sections to be outstanding to rank in the 9 to 10 region for that component. I wonder whether, in fact, the judges really do that; I can't tell you, I'm not a judge. However, if a judge thinks that a team does a poor job of showing "Relationahip between the partners reflecting the character and content of the music," they can still give a mark in the 9 to 10 range if the team has really good timing, picks appropriate music, and skates to that music, and if their motions are in character for the dance they have chosen.

    So when you're judging, if you think a team is lacking in one single area, you may well give them a mark in the 9 to 10 range. As Mr. or Ms. or Mrs. Judge, you can give them 9, 9.25, 9.5, 9.75 or 10. You don't have any other choices, once you have decided they must be in the 9 to 10 region.



    Interpretation and Timing Source Rule 611 b, i



    To qualify for a mark of between 9.00 and 10.00 in Interpretation and Timing, a team should:



    To qualify for a mark of between 8.00 and 8.75 in Interpretation and Timing, a team should:



    To qualify for a mark between 7.00 and 7.75 in Interpretation and Timing, a team should:


    I'm deliberately not listing marks lower than 7.00, because no team at the Senior GPF got any mark in Interpretation and Timing that was below that range from any judge. Note that all three ranges have 100% perfect timing as a listed requirement. However, if the other stuff is okay, the "Majority" of requirements are satisfied, and a judge may decide to use the range.



    And finally how the teams were ranked for interpretation & timing: as three pairs of teams, tied or nearly tied.

    1 D&W 9.82
    1 V&M 9.82
    3 P&B 8.89
    4 W&P 8.68
    5 B&S 8.11
    6 S&S 7.96

    I probably will talk about the character of dances later in this thread, but at this point, watch the skaters again with the music on. For the last two items, you may well have concentrated most on their feet; now listen to the music and concentrate on the whole effect a team is going for, and whether every beat of the music is reflected in their skating. Are the crescendos highlighted? Do they end when the music ends? Are they one with the music, always dancing, even through the elements? You may also evaluate whether they are both relating to each other as they relate to the music. Do not however get involved in the story they are telling, if you can manage. This PCS bullet is about the music and their relationship to it, and there is no requirement here for a storyline. When they stumble, if they do, of course that oneness with the music is slightly interrupted. Perfect technique is needed before you can give them a perfect mark in this component.

    I'm redoing the links to be British Eurosport because they usually do a good job of synching the audio to the video as any. I'm always rather hesitant to comment on timing "live" on TV because often the feed is not well synched. When you're being an armchair critic, keep in mind that some of your experience of the dancing is shaped by the TV. You are less aware of differences in speed than the judges are, and your perception of timing may be skewed by the poor quality of the feed, and whether the station broadcasting the feed has done anything to fix problems with it. Cup of China had a particularly poor feed this year.

    You might want to hit the pause button at the end of each performance so that your judicial deliberations are not affected by British Eurosport guys. Or not; your choice. (If you're looking for British Eurosport coverage, always check out frida340's channel on youtube. She is not up as quick as NikaQuest who posts the Russian feed, but it is often worth the wait.) frida340 did not put up the Shibutanis, so I have used the Universal Sports version for them.

    Davis & White Die Fledermaus 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvF5bIfB2kA
    Virtue & Moir Funny face 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jb-rY...eature=related
    Pechalat & Bourzat Pharoah & His Mummy 8.89
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ibngj...eature=related
    Weaver & Poje Je Suis Malade 8.68
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPPNx...eature=related
    Bobrova & Soloviev Faust 8.11
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6GRd...eature=related
    Shibutani & Shibutani Sun Valley Serenade 7.96
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEj7qFr7wBg
    Again, I would have switched B/S and S/S as far as this mark. S/S did a really good job relating to the music. Their moves are actual accents to the music (twizzles as transitions; lifts to end sections, etc.). I feel B/S's attempt to do that with Faust was shallow at best. In fact a bunch of the crescendos came during their twizzle sequence and I feel like they just twizzled through them with no mind of the music. For some reason the judges at CoC overscored those guys in PCS and it seems that the last two judging panels have not been so kind.

    I think I would have put S/S in the low 8s, but not as high as W/P in the mid 8s as I feel they did not look at each other very much. I feel with a swing dance there needs to be a little more connection between the partners and I didn't quite feel like that with those two. It could be the nature of the elements, but at times I felt they were dancing two parts of a swing dance that happened to happen at the same time.

    Actually, I think it would have been more interesting competition if C/L had made the final instead of B/S. C/L had the unfortunate chance of facing some tough competition at both their events making their inclusion in the final nearly impossible. I think unless B/S improves some things, I think C/L is more of a threat to the Shibs for top 5.

  7. #22
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Yes, I think B&S were perhaps overgraded in some spots, vis a vis the Shibutanis, but as overall, it didn't affect placing, I'm not overly disturbed about it. I agree that C&L are perhaps better than either of those two teams at this time, although I would like to see them in the same competition. C&L have a long time reputation for skating a step slower with a bit shallower edges than the top teams. This year, at least from TV, they look a lot better to me. I'm curious to know how whether it strikes those that saw them live this year the same way.

    Meanwhile, it's on to the next to the last PCS component:

    Composition and Choreography Source Rule 611 b, i, ISU Communication 1677

    Definition:
    An intentional, developed and/or original arrangement of all types of movements according to the principles of
    proportion, unity, space, pattern, structure and phrasing.

    Criteria:
    • Purpose (idea, concept, vision)
    • Proportion (equal weight of the parts)
    • Unity (purposeful threading)
    • Utilization of personal and public space
    • Pattern and ice coverage
    • Phrasing and form (movements and parts structured to match the phrasing of the music)
    • Originality of purpose, movement and design
    • Shared responsibility in achieving purpose by both
    • Conformity to pattern and stop requirements (Short Dance only)
    As you read through the requirements for the different PCS levels, they might not sound as related as you'd think they should be, but they are. Consider all requirements for the lower levels should be met, but in spades, for the higher levels, if you feel there is a disconnect involved.

    To qualify for a mark between 9.00 and 10.00 in Composition and Choreography, you need

    • wide range of steps, moves, and required elements superbly motivated by music
    • ingenious use of music,space, symmetry
    • memorable highlights distributed evenly
    • change of pace/tempo incorporated seamlessly
    • total utilization of personal and public space
    • choreography gives the feeling of a completely unified dance (SD): 100%

    To qualify for a mark between 8.00 and 8.75 in Composition and Choreography, you need

    • superior choreography, clearly understandable
    • variety of innovative moves that develop theme
    • change of pace/tempo incorporated with ease
    • excellent use of music/space/symmetry
    • choreography gives the feeling of a completely unified dance (SD): 90%

    To qualify for a mark between 7.00 and 7.75 in Composition and Choreography, you need

    • interesting moves derived from theme
    • very good use of music/space/symmetry
    • unity of skaters in use of music content
    • directed to all sides of the rink
    • choreography gives the feeling of a completely unified dance (SD): 80%

    Again, no team at the senior GPF earned below a 7.00 in Composition and Choreography.

    Here's how the teams ranked in composition & choreography

    1 D&W 9.79
    1 V&M 9.79
    3 P&B 9.04
    4 W&P 8.43
    5 B&S 8.39
    6 S&S 7.93

    This time I'm linking the same videos as in timing & interpretation, but watch them in the order that the judges and commentators saw these videos. Instead of focusing on the music and the teams' interaction with it, or their physical links to each other, you should be looking at how the teams use the space of the rink (including how they use the vertical dimension--the lifts should not be at the same place in the rink for example) The step sequences should go to the boards, as nearly as possible. And the highlights should not be crammed together. They should be spaced throughout the routine so that there are no dead spots where you say to yourself, "Ah ha, resting, aren't they!"

    And you should look to see that the skaters use the opportunities that the music provides them. Again, if there is a crescendo, is it reflected in the choreography? If there is a slow part, can you tell by what the team is doing?

    It's almost worth running each routine with the sound off (to concentrate of their use of space and time) and with the sound on (to concentrate on their use of the music), but if you've watched these several times already, I won't inflict that on you again. B&S are up first because of their problems with the SD. When you watch the Shibutanis, did you feel they used the space worse than B&S? The judges did. Faster skaters tend to use more of the rink than slower skaters; it's legitimate for this component to tend to be lower for slower skaters, all things considered.

    Note that it is under Choreography & Composition that the following deductions are taken:

    1. There are no deductions for full stops, unless the full stop is longer than 5 seconds in duration. There are no deductions for an excessive amount of full stops. However, each full stop in the body of the program which is longer than 5 seconds in duration earns a deduction of -.5 per stop.
    2. Excessive separations are also given a deduction. During a legal full stop (under 5 seconds during the program, under 10 seconds during the introduction and conclusion of the program), separations are permitted without regard to how far apart the skaters get. However, if the skaters have separated to perform difficult footwork, not only must the time of separation be 5 seconds or less, they must remain within 2 armlengths of each other.

    Note that subsequent to ISU Communication 1686, that the "Uplifting Music" deduction is taken globally, rather than as part of one of the components.

    THE MUSIC DOES NOT HAVE AN UPLIFTING EFFECT: - 1.0 TO - 2.0 [points]
    Note: violation of music restrictions mentioned in Rule 609, paragraph
    1.c) are not penalized under Interpretation/Timing but as a specific
    deduction (see Rule 353, paragraph 1.n) (ii))

    While it is a great dance, worthy of the standing ovation it received, do you feel that Je Suis Malade has an uplifting effect.

    (It did lift the audience out of their seats, though )


    Bobrova & Soloviev Faust 8.11
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6GRd...eature=related

    Shibutani & Shibutani Sun Valley Serenade 7.96
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xdXf...eature=related

    Weaver & Poje Je Suis Malade 8.68
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPPNx...eature=related

    Pechalat & Bourzat Pharoah & His Mummy 8.89
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ibngj...eature=related

    Virtue & Moir Funny face 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jb-rY...eature=related

    Davis & White Die Fledermaus 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvF5bIfB2kA

  8. #23
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    GENERAL REQUIREMENTS FOR THE FD

    General Requirements for the Free Dance, source ISU Communication 1677, Rule 610, § 1

    a) Free Dance is the skating by the Couple of a creative dance program blending with dance steps and movements expressing the character/rhythms(s) of the dance music chosen by the Couple;

    The Free Dance must contain combinations of new or known dance steps and movements including Required Elements composed into a well balanced, whole unit displaying excellent skating technique and the personal creativity of the couple in concept, arrangement, and expression. The program including Required Elements must be skated in time and phase with the music. The couple should skate primarily in time to the rhythmic beat, and not to the melody alone. The choreography should clearly reflect the dance character, accents and nuances of the chosen dance music, demonstrating a close relationship between partners with obvious, distinct changes of mood and pace with variations in speed and tempo. The program must utilize the whole ice surface. The Free Dance must not have the concept of a Pair or show program;

    b) The duration of the Novice Free Dance must be 3 minutes, the duration of Junior Free Dance must be 3 minutes 1/2 minutes and the duration of the Senior Free Dance - 4 minutes. The Couple is allowed to finish their program within ten seconds plus or minus the required time. The time must be reckoned from the moment when one of the Couple begins to move or skate until arriving at a complete stop at the end of the program;

    c) The music for Free Dance must be suitable for Ice Dance as a sport discipline and must have the following characteristics:

    i) The music must have an audible rhythmic beat and melody, or audible rhythmic beat alone, but not melody alone, and may be vocal. The music may be without an audible rhythmic beat for up to 10 seconds at the beginning or end of the program and up to 10 seconds during the program.

    ii) The music must have at least one change of tempo and/or expression. This change may be gradual or immediate, but in either case it must be obvious.

    iii) All music including classical music must be cut/edited, orchestrated or arranged in a way that it creates an interesting, colorful, entertaining dance program with different dance moods or a building effect.

    iv) The music must be suitable for the couple's skating skills and technical ability. Free Dances that do not adhere to these guidelines will be severely penalized;

    d) All steps and turns are permitted. Deep edges and intricate footwork displaying skating skill, difficulty, variety and originality that constitute the distinct technical content of the dance must be included in the program and performed by both partners. In the interest of the public in the arena, programs should be choreographed to all sides of the arena and not only focused to Judge’s side;

    e) All elements and movements are permitted provided that they are appropriate to the character of the music and to the concept of a Well Balanced Program and are in accordance with the definitions in Rule 604;

    f) Pair skating elements as defined in Rule 519 (excluding spirals, spins and step sequences) are not allowed;

    g) The number of separations to execute intricate footwork is not restricted. The distance between partners should not exceed two arms lengths. The duration of each such separation must not exceed 5 seconds. The separations at the beginning and/or end of the Free Dance may be up to 10 seconds in duration without restrictions on the distance of separation;

    h) All changes of hold are permitted. Many and varied holds increase the difficulty of the program and therefore, should be included. Skating face to face is considered to be more difficult than skating side by side, hand in hand, separately or one after the other;

    i) Full stops (up to 5 seconds), in which the Couple remains stationary on the ice while performing body movements, twisting, posing and the like are permitted;

    j) The program must be developed through skating quality rather than through non-skating actions such as sliding on one knee, or use of toe steps which should be used only to reflect the character of the dance and underlining rhythm and nuances of the chosen music. Touching the ice with the hand(s) is not permitted. Kneeling or sliding on two knees, or sitting on the ice is not allowed and it will be considered by the Technical Panel as a fall.
    The reason I'm posting the general requirements for the FD is that they throw some light on what the components are supposed to reward:

    When I see that free dance should not look like a pairs program or a show program, I think of Pechalat and Bourzat who have deliberately reworked an old show program into their Free Dance. How can judges not be reminded of this?

    Here is their Mummies exhibition from 2009 Europeans. It amuses me to hear commentators say how creative the program is when they have repurposed the exhibition:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JiH5nDSZvo

    Furthermore, they do their handstand lift here:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JiH5nDSZvo#t=1m25s

    It also is clear that toe steps, posing, and tap dancing are OK, but aren't really going to earn you any points for anything other than developing the character of the piece, and probably should be kept to a minimum. A team should be spending their program time doing things that would add to their transitions mark.

    On the other hand, Bobrova & Soloviev's lift where he is in a knee slide, while legal, perhaps should not get top GOE, when I consider the disapproval in the general requirements for knee slides.

    Both judges and commentators are not wholly consistent with what these documents say.

    I wanted to get this in there before we discuss the last part of Free dance Program Component Score, Performance and Execution.

  9. #24
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    Does Je Suis Malade have a "audible rhythmic beat" at the beginning?

  10. #25
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    c) The music for Free Dance must be suitable for Ice Dance as a sport discipline and must have the
    following characteristics:
    i) The music must have an audible rhythmic beat and melody, or audible rhythmic beat alone, but
    not melody alone, and may be vocal. The music may be without an audible rhythmic beat for up
    to 10 seconds at the beginning or end of the program and up to 10 seconds during the program.
    The beat seems to start at about 10 secs from when they start moving (which is the beginning of the program), so they are OK on that one, I think?

  11. #26
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    And so we come to the last of the Free dance Program component scores rules:

    PERFORMANCE AND EXECUTION





    Performance and Execution Source Rule 611 b, i

    Definition:
    Performance – The involvement of the Couple physically, emotionally and intellectually as they translate the intent of the music and the choreography.

    Execution - The quality of movement and precision in delivery. This includes harmony of movement.

    Criteria:
    • Physical, emotional and intellectual involvement;
    • Carriage
    • Style and individuality/personality
    • Clarity of movement
    • Variety and contrast
    • Projection
    • Unison and “oneness”
    • Balance in performance between partners
    • Spatial
    To qualify for a mark between 9.00 and 10.00 in Performance and Execution, you need

    • move as one, superb matching
    • elegant /sophisticated style
    • refined line of body and limbs
    • precise execution of body movements
    • both spellbinding
    • projection exceptional (to audience or in themselves if music requires)

    To qualify for a mark between 8.00 and 8.75 in Performance and Execution, you need

    • coordinated movements, excellent matching
    • superb carriage and lines
    • effortless change of difficult holds
    • project strongly

    To qualify for a mark between 7.00 and 7.75 in Performance and Execution, you need

    • move as couple, matched with ease
    • easy use of change of all holds
    • excellent carriage/lines
    • both project most of time


    Here's how the teams finished for Performance & Execution


    1 D&W 9.75
    1 V&M 9.68
    3 P&B 8.82
    4 W&P 8.57
    5 B&S 8.14
    6 S&S 7.93

    Note that D&W scored higher than V&M in this component, although not by much. When you watch the videos, watch them in order, and this time listen to the commentary by British Eurosport. Listen to how the words they use of the couples reflects the language of this section.


    Bobrova & Soloviev Faust 8.11
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6GRd...eature=related

    Shibutani & Shibutani Sun Valley Serenade 7.96
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xdXf...eature=related

    Weaver & Poje Je Suis Malade 8.68
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPPNx...eature=related

    Pechalat & Bourzat Pharoah & His Mummy 8.89
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ibngj...eature=related

    Virtue & Moir Funny face 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jb-rY...eature=related

    Davis & White Die Fledermaus 9.82
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvF5bIfB2kA

    So any questions class?

    Would you have S&S ahead of B&S or the reverse on PCS?

    How about Weaver and Poje vs. Pechalat and Bourzat?

    And any words of wisdom to help Scott Moir understand PCS marks? His problem is not that he needs to be higher (they're getting 10's)..

  12. #27
    On the Ice
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    Professor Dorispulaski you have taught me so much about PCS. Now if only the judges could be more informed. What does it take to be a judge? Are their continuing education ice dancing scoring classes? And if so, what and how do they learn about the scoring. If not, I elect you as Dean of Ice Dance Scoring.

    You bring up great points like the GOE on the B/S's knee-slide lift should be lower because kneeling/sliding (on 2 knees not 1) is looked down on. Also, with B/S shouldn't their PCS in Execution and Performance be much lower based on her poor carriage???

  13. #28
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    The question is whether they meet the other 3 bullets to get a majority of the bullets at the 8 to 8.75 level (with the understanding that they are fast enough to qualify for that level):

    •coordinated movements, excellent matching
    •superb carriage and lines
    •effortless change of difficult holds
    •project strongly
    He is bent over to match her, so they match. They do project decently. However, the bent-overness impedes their efforts to do close & difficult holds effortlessly. So for me, they don't have a majority of the points at 8. I'd probably give them 7.75; maybe 7.50.

    Here's what the different judges gave them:

    The last item in each row is the average of the previous numbers.
    Skating Skills
    7.75 8.50 8.00 8.25 8.00 8.00 8.25 8.00 7.75 8.04
    Linking Footwork / Movement
    7.75 8.50 7.75 8.25 7.25 8.25 7.75 7.75 7.50 7.86
    Performance
    8.00 8.50 7.75 8.50 8.00 8.25 8.25 8.25 7.50 8.14
    Choreography
    8.25 8.75 7.75 8.50 8.00 8.50 8.50 8.50 8.50 8.39
    Interpretation / Timing
    8.00 8.75 7.75 8.00 7.75 8.25 8.25 8.00 8.50 8.11

  14. #29
    skating philosopher
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xdXf...eature=related <---- Doris, turns out that poster did upload the Shibutanis' FD on Eurosport.

    This is actually the one category where I would put B/S ahead of the Shibs. Despite the bad posture on her part, I think they do a good job meeting the other bullets and they do a good job performing this FD. I would lower their score to reflect some of the points you made Doris, but I would also lower the Shibs to reflect this adjustment.

    I think the Shibs are doing too much of a textbook lesson swing dance rather than an actual "night on the town" swing dance. I agree with the Eurosport commentator that the Shibs, Alex in particular, is doing too much staging for the judges as opposed to dancing with Maia. Maia is a lot better at performing the dance,but she can improve here too. I think the relatively low PCS scores are a message from the judges "We love that you are polished and got the tech now, now work on the packaging!" And they have the basics already, it's just a matter of nuances at this point. They scored a 95 for this dance, just shy of their 96 at Worlds last year.

    I think I would have W/P in front of P/B. I really feel that W/P is performing the heck out of this dance. I think their body language and expressions are so projected you can see it from the back row of the arena! I think P/B do a good job performing this FD, but I feel theme of the dance really limits their ability to project themselves to the audience. They do fulfill the bullets OK though, so I'd keep them in the mid 8s.

    Let's face it, we're pulling hairs with D/W and V/M. But I think I agree with the slight nod for D/W here. While V/M does a GREAT GREAT GREAT job performing this dance, I'm not sure if they necessarily have the projection that D/W has. I think that D/W has moves (i.e. those amazing lifts) that really projects the character of the dance to the audience and the ease at getting into and out of those lifts are a bonus. V/M have a beautiful program in FF, but I just don't think the current choreo doesn't quite give that crispness that D/W is giving right now. Again, I'm really pulling hairs here.

    So if I was going to score for just performance:

    D/W 9.75
    V/M 9.7
    W/P 8.8
    P/B 8.65
    B/S 7.95
    S/S 7.90

    Thanks for this exercise, Doris. It was very educational and fun to review the dances with a fresh eye!

  15. #30
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    Mar 2009
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    Yes, thanks Doris for this very informative thread. Kudos to the judges for being able to watch the performance and immediately give scores....it would take me 24 hours at least!

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