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Thread: ISU Scale of Values, Levels of Difficulty and Guidelines for GOEs for 2012-13

  1. #16
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    Bleh! Or we get to hear Katy Perry...

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Another proposal is to allow vocal music in singles and pairs after 2014. I don't think I like that so much. I wouldn't want the singing to overshadow the skating.
    I think, it means to say that figure skating is going modern.

  3. #18
    Custom Title Mathman's Avatar
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    ^ I would worry that it would start to be like those pro shows where they have a live singer. The skating is an afterthought.

    That is sometimes the case even with instrumental music. When a skater takes on Bach's Toccata and Fugue I usually find myself thinking, I wish that distraction would get off the ice so I can listen to the sumptuous music. There is a reason why ballet music does not feature singing -- the dance is the thing!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    ^ I would worry that it would start to be like those pro shows where they have a live singer. The skating is an afterthought.
    Let's expect to see who could seduce the audience more effectively. Though it will have little affect on me as I might say good-bye to my hobby on figure skating after Sochi too.
    Last edited by Bluebonnet; 05-04-2012 at 02:08 PM.

  5. #20
    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mskater93 View Post
    Bleh! Or we get to hear Katy Perry...
    Whenever I watch an ISI competition, she seems to be the most overplayed musician. I once heard (no joke) a synchro program that started with Katy Perry, middle section of Chicago, ending with Meditation from Thais. I wanted to tear my eardrums out!

  6. #21
    Celebrating the Excellence of #VirtueMoir golden411's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    @Mirai --Click where it says "click here." The whole pdf is 138 pages long.

    http://www2.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/p...0.html?id=1059
    And now the ISU has published a 14-page pdf for Single and Pair Skating: "Scale of Values, Levels of Difficulty and Guidelines for marking Grade of Execution 2012-2013" (subject to 54th ISU Congress decisions).

    http://www2.isu.org/vsite/vnavsite/p...0.html?id=1060

  7. #22
    At the rink. Again. mskater93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue dog View Post
    Whenever I watch an ISI competition, she seems to be the most overplayed musician. I once heard (no joke) a synchro program that started with Katy Perry, middle section of Chicago, ending with Meditation from Thais. I wanted to tear my eardrums out!
    Yuck! I usually end up judging our club's basic skills competition and I heard "Fireworks" no less than 4 times in a group of six, one program was "Fireworks" cut with the 1812 Overture. Really?! Then, you get the Disney assortment to go with it. Ugh! Maybe we get a Gaga, a Katy Perry, and a Disney program if they allow vocal music. LOL!

  8. #23
    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mskater93 View Post
    Yuck! I usually end up judging our club's basic skills competition and I heard "Fireworks" no less than 4 times in a group of six, one program was "Fireworks" cut with the 1812 Overture. Really?! Then, you get the Disney assortment to go with it. Ugh! Maybe we get a Gaga, a Katy Perry, and a Disney program if they allow vocal music. LOL!
    I went to State Games, and a skater did just that! Her Disney song was Part of Your World from the Little Mermaid, and she had "Love You Like a Love Song" by Selena Gomez. I wanted to cry--why would a coach do that to a student?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    Another proposal is to allow vocal music in singles and pairs after 2014. I don't think I like that so much. I wouldn't want the singing to overshadow the skating.
    good. I have always been wondering why vocal music is allowed for ice dancing but not singles and pairs. so unfair.

  10. #25
    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boeing787 View Post
    good. I have always been wondering why vocal music is allowed for ice dancing but not singles and pairs. so unfair.
    If it passes, will they call this the "Amodio" rule?

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    Quote Originally Posted by blue dog View Post
    If it passes, will they call this the "Amodio" rule?
    lol they might!

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    What caught my first attention are

    1. One foot skating is no more a Level feature for Step Sequence.

    2. GOE guideline for Choreographic sequences:

    1) good flow, energy and execution
    2) good speed or acceleration during sequence
    3) good clarity and precision
    4) good control and commitment of whole body
    5) creativity and originality
    6) effortless throughout
    7) reflecting concept/character of the program
    8) element matched to the musical structure
    Half of the quality points are on "artistry".


    In Remarks:

    Choreographic Sequences consist of any kind of movements such as steps, turns, spirals, arabesques, spread eagles, Ina Bauers, hydroblading, transitional (unlisted) jumps, spinning movements etc. A Choreographic Sequence for Ladies/Pairs must include at least one spiral (not a kick) of any llenght (by both partners for Pairs). The Sequence commences with the first move and is concluded with the last move of the skater. The pattern is not restricted, but the Sequence must fully utilize the ice surface. If this requirement is not fulfilled, the Sequence will have no value. The Choreographic Sequence is included in Free Skating and for Singles has to be performed after the step sequence. The choreographic Sequence has a base value and will be evaluated by the judges in GOE only.
    I don't find the BV for Choreographic Sequence.

    I wonder how much time a slow skater will need to devote to the Choreo Sequence in order to fully utilize the ice surface.

    3. Positive GOEs are worth more points than negative GOEs in spins. Not sure if this is new.
    Last edited by SkateFiguring; 05-04-2012 at 05:07 PM.

  13. #28
    Skating is art, if you let it be. Blades of Passion's Avatar
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    "Must fully utilize the ice surface" is very vague. If taken literally that means the sequence needs to cover every inch of the ice rink. I very much dislike how the "choreography sequence" MUST come after the leveled step sequence as well.

    The answer to fixing that problem is obvious: don't have a leveled step sequence in the Long Program at all. Only have it in the Short Program and instead have two "Choreography Sequences" in the Long Program (ie - the FREE SKATE, as it is still officially named).

    Here's a good thing about the rule changes: spinning for 8+ revolutions in the same position now only counts as a difficult variation once per program! YAY!!!!

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by SkateFiguring View Post
    What caught my first attention are

    1. One foot skating is no more a Level feature for Step Sequence.
    I guess too many skaters were able to accomplish this, albeit poorly in many cases, for them to want to reward it automatically in the base value. But now where can judges reward it if done well? Under Skating Skills?

    2. GOE guideline for Choreographic sequences:

    Half of the quality points are on "artistry".
    Which seems to be the attempt to get skaters to focus on using this sequence for artistic purposes and not just racking up points.

    Although requiring the choreo sequence to take place after the step sequence does limit the options.

    Again, I'm not sure the way the +GOE bullets are worded that there's any place for judges to reward extra difficulty performed satisfactorily. However, as long as it isn't just going back and doing a 2006-10-style level 4 spiral sequence, hopefully difficulty here would also show some originality and could be rewarded on that criterion.

    I don't find the BV for Choreographic Sequence.
    2.0 base value. It's the last item listed under "Step and Choreographic Sequences" in the singles Scale of Values.

    I wonder how much time a slow skater will need to devote to the Choreo Sequence in order to fully utilize the ice surface.
    Depends what they want to do with it. If they're slow because they don't have many skills, then they can choose a fairly simple end-to-end pattern with shallow edges and/or extra crossovers between every position or edge. Shouldn't take more than 15-20 seconds.

    If they're slow because they're doing complicated edge skills and weaving back and forth, then it will take longer. But if they actually have some skills to showcase, then why not take the time to do so?

    3. It seems all falls in all elements receive -3 GOE points each, regardless of BV.
    Where do you get that from? The GOE error chart hasn't changed as far as falls go. There's a required reduction of -3 from what the GOE would have been otherwise and the final GOE must be negative -- in most cases it will end up being -3 -- and that's prorated according to the Scale of Values. No change from last year.

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    ^^^^ I deleted and changed my third observation when I realized it was GOEs, just as before, not actual points that my dim mind first thought.

    Skaters need to demonstrate good skating skills but not complexity in the Choreo Sequence. I expect some slow but expressive skaters to do quite a bit of acting while going end to end in a straight line, if that counts as fully utilizing the ice surface. If I were a less skilled skater, I would really want that clarified because total element value is on the line.

    All in all, I think the Choreo Sequence is where a skater is supposed to really try to sell the program, especially since it will inevitably be near the end of a program, leaving the last impression. It's the place to score the PCS too.

    I hope the skaters and their choreographers will fully take advantage of the "creativity" bullet for the CS. Everybody, performers and audiences, will enjoy the sport more.
    Last edited by SkateFiguring; 05-04-2012 at 05:38 PM.

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