08-01-2012, 07:47 AM
If Hanyu likes it, he is entitled to it. He does get to choose what he skates. Just saying that most everyone else on the planet has figured out that the EX was garbage. We get to choose what we like and it is fair comment. He may get to choose what he skates, but he doesn't get to choose what other people like.
Originally Posted by Kalina
I never implied that it was a career breaker. Hanyu skates everything, even the garbage, better than anyone else. No one can deny his talent no matter what he skates.
If Orser hadn't figured out Hanyu before he took on the job of coaching him, then he should not have taken on the job. That is basic. This is a podium skater. Expectations are reasonably high. If he doesn't know Hanyu by now, he should be fired or step aside.
Conspiracy theory is garbage. Orser needs Hanyu to do well, and I don't think it a stretch to say that Orser took on Hanyu with the intention of putting him on the top so that his rink will enhance its prestige. Canada is not a one rink town. It is not a stretch to surmise that Orser cares more about himself than he does about Patrick Chan and he isn't going to kill his own career by screwing one of his own skaters. He will do anything he can to put Hanyu on the top. Let's give him that. Where people have issues is in wondering whether he has the ability and judgment to do it, and whether he is a good fit as coach for a skater of Hanyu's temperment.
But no one, including Orser and (this may surprise you) the Canadian public generally wants to see Hanyu skate anything less than his best. That standing ovation he received in Montreal last season after his performance was heartfelt. Once Canada figures out this kid is here training, it is only going to enhance their support of him.
08-01-2012, 08:05 AM
I have no intention of devaluating their work, I just said that he went to them with the music and an outline and they worked on that. That's what happened, and IMO they did a excellent job, but it wasn't their job alone. And yes, I'd already seen that video.
Saying that people can't have a civil discussion means just that. Doesn't mean that I said you aren't civil in other matters. Doesn't mean that I am, for that matter I just wouldn't ridicule other people's opinions like that. But of course you are free to express yourself as you wish. Let's just agree to disagree.
I'm sorry, I posted and I didn't see you. Writing in english takes me a long time
I was just referring to those who believe the conspiracy theory: I actually agree with what you said and I don't think the Canadian public wishes to see him skate badly, or Orser, Kurt, JSF etc. I remember the standing ovation he received in Quebec. Same with the career breaker thing. I might have gotten carried away while explaining myself, so I don't know if I accidentally offended you, but if that's the case, I'm sorry.
About Orser I don't know much about how he coaches, as I never followed Yuna's career closely nor their breakup after the Olympics. I basically have no preconceptions about him. That may be why I find some of the things I'm reading so baffling.
Last edited by Kalina; 08-01-2012 at 08:21 AM.
08-01-2012, 09:40 AM
Calling people uncivil in the context of the discussion means just that either. But of course if name calling is your way to disagree with the opponent, feel free to do that. Btw, no need to repeatedly appologize for your English skills when I am the one who has to google your vocabs. Your English is just fine.
Originally Posted by Kalina
Nobody said that Hanyu's progs last season was B&B work alone. B&B was never even listed as his choreographers. Everyone here knows that. Choosing the music and making a basic outline is not what made Hanyu explode the ice. B&B could figure out what they boy need much faster than Orse&Kurt. Which means one and the same thing- either the said Canadians don't want to work hard with the guy or they don't know how. In both cases they shouldn't coach him.
08-01-2012, 11:21 AM
It's always interesting to see folks carry on about an exhibition program... it's not the best thing out there, nor is it the worst, and it's not going to cause anyone to lose or gain ground...
in the words of the Joker: "why so serious?"
08-02-2012, 04:30 PM
I, on the other hand, always feel the exhibition programs tell so much about who the skater truly is. They show the moves that skater feels most comfortable with, the music the skater wants to express, and what the skater thinks the audience wants to see. It does affect my perception of a skater, when it turns out he thinks I want to see him interpret some insipid pop song, lip sync, shake his booty or throw his shirt into the audience. Sometimes they even imagine we want some sweaty kid to reach over the boards and give us a smooch. It isn't too serious, it's too hilarious.
08-06-2012, 04:00 PM
I think skaters have a good sense to understand that they can present different sides of themselves, depending on the context. Competition vs. Exhibition. And even, Exhibition A vs. Exhibition B, depending on who the audience is. I think it does give insight into a skater's personality (naturally) but wouldn't really go so far as to draw conclusions about how their training is going, what the coaching/choreographic teams are thinking when it comes to competitive programs, etc. Frankly, a lot of skaters come up with their own material and the coaches never even coach it or see it. Not the same level of investment usually, and thus, I think, inappropriate to draw vast conclusions.
08-08-2012, 02:38 AM