Daisuke Takahashi back to Nikolai Morozov

[Olympia]

That's a great characterization of the way Russians seem to feel about skating. When I first started watching skating in the eighties, the USSR was at the top of the heap in ice dancing and pairs skating (with one or two exceptions from other countries, such as Torvill/Dean). I realized after a while that I almost never resented the Russians' supremacy because they were so wonderful. They weren't just technically superior, they were artistically the best as well. Pairs skating in the West was a perfunctory athletic exercise often done by brother and sister until the Soviets revolutionized the discipline. Ice dancing...well, for a long time they were the only skating power where athletes were allowed to be impassioned about music and artistry without being considered outsiders. In the U.S. or Canada in those days, a boy who skated was likely to get taunted on his way to the practice rink. In Russia, a champion skater was a national hero. As you say, with hearts like this, no wonder they adore Daisuke.

[SkateFiguring]

I don't think adoration of Daisuke's skating or any other skater's needs to be rationalized by nationality.

I wish all choreographers and skaters, especially Morozov and his proteges, would abide by rules laid down by Mary Murphy of So You Think You Can Dance:

1. No booty shaking;

2. No self worthship - self caressing and stroking; and

3. No reaching - with stretched out arms and open hands. (Mostly accompanied by an O face with open mouth.)

[skateluvr]

Just haven't read the tread all through. Just looking for news. As for the above post I first saw the face stroking by MK. I think 'Lyra' at the end was her first brushing her face in program. I do not find it offensive. Just a little flourish by Lori.

Vive le difference between SLC when AFAIK, Niki did Yagudin's SP Winter which I loved, most all lovedit and is a memorable great SP to many folks. Was this his work? The footwork sequence was copied in SOI opening number, full cast. He was King Morozov after he left Tarasova. What has happened?

I know he is very unpopular on boards for his womanizing ways, cheating, divorcing etc. He does not win over the female fans who know all about this. He is darkly handsome. People are happy Miki is done with him. I hated Leonova's LP this year but she won silver at worlds. I'd be interested to know what programs he choreographed that won medals in WC or Olympics. Also very interested to hear what programs he did that people felt were really bad with links. In a decade, his popularity with fans and the respect for his work has done a 180.

It is hard for me to separate someone from what he is to what he does. Other than Leonova (SP and LP) who did he choreograph last season?

He was the David Wilson (ie respected, liked) a decade ago. Based on his work with Leonova and Amodio, I personally hope he does not have a lot of input to the programs. I'd like to see his hits lsited with links and his misses to understand his body of work. Wow, he is so unpopular with the fans nowadays! Deserved?

[DianaSelene]

That's a great characterization of the way Russians seem to feel about skating. When I first started watching skating in the eighties, the USSR was at the top of the heap in ice dancing and pairs skating (with one or two exceptions from other countries, such as Torvill/Dean). I realized after a while that I almost never resented the Russians' supremacy because they were so wonderful. They weren't just technically superior, they were artistically the best as well. Pairs skating in the West was a perfunctory athletic exercise often done by brother and sister until the Soviets revolutionized the discipline. Ice dancing...well, for a long time they were the only skating power where athletes were allowed to be impassioned about music and artistry without being considered outsiders. In the U.S. or Canada in those days, a boy who skated was likely to get taunted on his way to the practice rink. In Russia, a champion skater was a national hero. As you say, with hearts like this, no wonder they adore Daisuke.

Yep. Russians really love Takahashi as well as Lambiel because they pretty much are art on ice.

[blancanieves]

That's a great characterization of the way Russians seem to feel about skating. When I first started watching skating in the eighties, the USSR was at the top of the heap in ice dancing and pairs skating (with one or two exceptions from other countries, such as Torvill/Dean). I realized after a while that I almost never resented the Russians' supremacy because they were so wonderful. They weren't just technically superior, they were artistically the best as well. Pairs skating in the West was a perfunctory athletic exercise often done by brother and sister until the Soviets revolutionized the discipline. Ice dancing...well, for a long time they were the only skating power where athletes were allowed to be impassioned about music and artistry without being considered outsiders. In the U.S. or Canada in those days, a boy who skated was likely to get taunted on his way to the practice rink. In Russia, a champion skater was a national hero. As you say, with hearts like this, no wonder they adore Daisuke.

Funny thing is: did the Russian supremacy ever really go away? The nationality of the winning skaters may have changed but the coaching that has been producing medalists continues to be of Russian origin. I don't think there can be a legitimate power shift until a different nation produces a superior school of coaches.

[chloepoco]

Yeah funny how big $$$ can change someone's attitude. I am sure Miki's WC bonus to her coach team awarded by JSF can't hurt either.

First Hanyu goes to Orser, then Daisuke goes to Morozov. More example of JSF and friends' attempt lobbying for an OGM while trying to 'kit' their top contenders with the 'name' team. Less to do with the quality of work on the ice than about establishing what looks good on paper. Easily exploiting IJS, who's judges are conditioned to study more on the past than judging what is right infront of them due to a default weakness of a human judging system and latency effect, with a scale of value that is entirely elementary and easily manipulated.

Who says money and politics can't buy winners? This sport and the tactics by its most successful federations and winners in the past 2 years at least proves it can, or certainly it wouldn't stop people blatantly trying. People who had been disillusioned with the sport before and think it is corrupted and fixed, things like this just makes it easier to believe so.

So which federation are you accusing of buying winners?

[evangeline]

First Hanyu goes to Orser, then Daisuke goes to Morozov. More example of JSF and friends' attempt lobbying for an OGM while trying to 'kit' their top contenders with the 'name' team. Less to do with the quality of work on the ice than about establishing what looks good on paper. Easily exploiting IJS, who's judges are conditioned to study more on the past than judging what is right infront of them due to a default weakness of a human judging system and latency effect, with a scale of value that is entirely elementary and easily manipulated.

Who says money and politics can't buy winners? This sport and the tactics by its most successful federations and winners in the past 2 years at least proves it can, or certainly it wouldn't stop people blatantly trying. People who had been disillusioned with the sport before and think it is corrupted and fixed, things like this just makes it easier to believe so.

I highly doubt that the JSF is involved in this decision of Daisuke working together with Morozov. Morozov has publicly said some nasty things about the JSF in the past that indicated some falling-out between them and it looks like he has fallen off the JSF's list of favoured foreign coaches. For instance, the JSF heavily pressured Miki to leave Morozov for ages and have long stopped sending Japanese skaters to him for coaching and choreography. For better or for worse, this looks like it was entirely Daisuke's decision. If the JSF wasn't able to successfully force Daisuke to go to a foreign coach in 2009 (and apparently they did try very hard to do so), I doubt they would succeed now when Daisuke is older and even more successful.

[LuCN]

Yep. Russians really love Takahashi as well as Lambiel because they pretty much are art on ice.

according to the reports and the fans number ,I think Russian love Johnny Weir most.much more than Dai and Lambiel,though I love Dai more...

[evangeline]

I think Johnny is probably the most popular foreign skater for Russian fans in general, but I've seen videos of Russian fan meetings with Stephane and Daisuke and they both seem well-loved and popular in Russia based on the enthusiasm and number of fans in them.


BTW the International Figure Skating magazine Facebook page claims that Lori Nichol is indeed going to choreograph Daisuke's programs next season and that Daisuke confirmed this information yesterday. Are there any other sources confirming this?

[Serious Business]

I think Lori has a real opportunity here to create an indelible masterpiece with Daisuke. I know Lori gets crap for her ubiquitous programs, quite a few of which are not as inspired as they could be. And rightfully so. But she still comes up with amazing, genius combinations of music + skater + choreography now and then, like having Mao skate a mesmerizing piece to a patriotic hymn sung by a choir of British boy sopranos. I think Daisuke is quite possibly the best canvas for an artist at this level of competitive skating. I'm excited to see Lori make the most of it.

[DianaSelene]

according to the reports and the fans number ,I think Russian love Johnny Weir most.much more than Dai and Lambiel,though I love Dai more...

They love him so much partly because he loves Russia and Russian fans and Russian people and Russian culture (not necessarily because of the skating). Why would they not love him?

[demarinis5]

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Inter...g/278550292537

Here is the link to the IFS FB page regarding Lori, scroll down. I have not come across a direct quote from Dai or his team yet, but I
think it is probably true.

[SkateFiguring]

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Inter...g/278550292537

Here is the link to the IFS FB page regarding Lori, scroll down. I have not come across a direct quote from Dai or his team yet, but I
think it is probably true.

I can't find it. What does it say exactly?

[Macassar88]

I can't find it. What does it say exactly?

Lori is doing his programs

[SkateFiguring]

Programs?