http://www.usovaplatov.com/news.htm
I'm beginning to think that the split with Sasha was more than Tarasova's health problems.
Lynn
I'm beginning to think that the split with Sasha was more than Tarasova's health problems.
Lynn
Tarasova update
- Thread starter Lynn51
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You mean you bought that excuse in the first place? 
I expected this announcement, but I am surprised it has come so soon. It really makes her credibility look bad. She was ill enough to leave her prized pupil so close to Nationals, yet has recovered enough in just a week so she can make plans to return to the US? Give me a break. The general puplic does not need a reason for the breakup, but if there is going to be one given, at least make it somewhat believable.
I expected this announcement, but I am surprised it has come so soon. It really makes her credibility look bad. She was ill enough to leave her prized pupil so close to Nationals, yet has recovered enough in just a week so she can make plans to return to the US? Give me a break. The general puplic does not need a reason for the breakup, but if there is going to be one given, at least make it somewhat believable.
Lucy25 said:
I don't want to point fingers or start arguments, but if Sasha can say:
"With this one week already behind us we've already made a lot of improvements," Cohen said.
as quoted from the USFSA site in a thread on this board, why should it be any less believable that Tatiana's health can't improve at the same rate?
Just a "what's good for the goose is sauce for the gander" thought.
Nan
I've said it in another post on this subject, but as a similar statement was made, I'll say it again.
"She was ill enough to leave her prized pupil so close to Nationals....."
Um, who's to say that Sasha WAS Tatiana's "prized pupil"? Maybe she never has been, or hasn't been since the apparant undercurrent with Sasha's mother this year? Maybe Tatiana sees a greater potential and future in Griazev, and is preferring to deal with him (and his apparantly mellower attitude/family) than Sasha? Or is that too unbelievable? (No, I am NOT at all a Sasha fan, and don't anticipate I ever will be).
I also agree with whoever pointed out that if Sasha's performances can improve SOOOOO dramatically in one week with Wagner, my bet is on Tatiana's health could improve equally dramatically in one week AWAY from certain stressors!
My wishes for good luck and good health go to Tatiana and Griazev in this one!
Kasey
"She was ill enough to leave her prized pupil so close to Nationals....."
Um, who's to say that Sasha WAS Tatiana's "prized pupil"? Maybe she never has been, or hasn't been since the apparant undercurrent with Sasha's mother this year? Maybe Tatiana sees a greater potential and future in Griazev, and is preferring to deal with him (and his apparantly mellower attitude/family) than Sasha? Or is that too unbelievable? (No, I am NOT at all a Sasha fan, and don't anticipate I ever will be).
I also agree with whoever pointed out that if Sasha's performances can improve SOOOOO dramatically in one week with Wagner, my bet is on Tatiana's health could improve equally dramatically in one week AWAY from certain stressors!
My wishes for good luck and good health go to Tatiana and Griazev in this one!
Kasey
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
What gets me (from the article as written), TT will be working with Andrei (Griazev) and preparing him for the worlds.
Is this wunderkind Griazev that will be much better than Plushenko, Abt, Klimkin, and Timochenko? The Russian Nationals aren't till January 12th. (It's not nice to jump to conclusions, but did she go to Moscow to fix it for Girazev to get on the podium?)
Just a thought.
Joe
Is this wunderkind Griazev that will be much better than Plushenko, Abt, Klimkin, and Timochenko? The Russian Nationals aren't till January 12th. (It's not nice to jump to conclusions, but did she go to Moscow to fix it for Girazev to get on the podium?)
Just a thought.
Joe
Kasey said:
Is that too unbelievable? Yes, I think so. *I* believe Sasha was TT's prized pupil, and the way the media made their relatiionship out confirms my belief. I do not believe that Sasha's improvements under Wagner have been as great as she is playing out any more than I believe TT's "poor health" has improved. But that's just *my* opinion.
- Joined
- Jun 27, 2003
The American media also portrays all male figure skaters as gay, that doesn't mean it's true.
The world would be in a sorry state if the media was actually telling the truth.
The world would be in a sorry state if the media was actually telling the truth.
Joesitz said:
Abt has been inconsistant for some time and may not be a "sure thing" for the podium at Russian Nationals. Timchenko has not had the results this year he had last year. I'm not sure what Klimkin's injury and coaching situation is right now. A friend of mine was at the two JGP events that Andrei won and at the JGP Final where he was placed second by a fairly slim margin and has some very nice things to say about his skating.
If we assume Plushenko will take the gold, there are stilll two other spots left on the podium. Andrei may not be a "long shot" at Russian Nationals. Tatiana may very well be spending her time where she thinks it will be best served.
Just another thought.
Nan
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2003
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Thank you for that link! I can't believe that stuff with Tatiana! I also haven't seen that website with Usova & Platov before! Sorry about changing the subject, but I miss seeing them!
Joesitz said:
Well, based on more or less neutral men singles reports I have read from Russian Nationals, the winners have mostly been right. Many people though thought that Ilia Kulik should have been the winner against Urmanov in season 1995-1996 already..
There has been though lots of opinions about the silver and bronze medals. The impression I have gotten is that those have sometimes gone to skaters which the Federation believes to skate well e.g. in Europeans and not to skaters who actually would have earned the medal in question at Nationals. (Refering e.g. to Abt in 1997-1998 Nationals...).
Does anyone know which might be the condition of Abt and Klimkin nowadays? Klimkin lost his long-time coach, and that surely has a lot of influence on his skating. On the other hand I would be interested to see something new from him, to see if he is really capable of interpreting the music. It has been too much the same, in my opinion.
Poor Abt, I have understood that many years he kind of suffered because the Federation did not appreciate his coach, and now he has been working with Zhulin for some years, and I have the feeling that his skating (at least the jumping ability) has gone backwards with Zhulin.
Marjaana
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Tonichelle said:
Why?
I have never heard anyone with the opinion that it would be better for us if the press were actually lying. Could you please explain your reasoning behind this?
Any rumours about Sasha's mother seems to have come from the same place as the stories of "TT's failing health, so she must return to Russia" Griazev had stated in an interview just before the GPF that TT was going to be at Russia Nationals with him, so it seems she hadn't planned on being at US Nats with Sasha for quite some time. Now that it would seem she also never really planned on staying in Russia, I can't see where we should believe anything about Sasha that comes from the TT camp. And that includes stories about her mother being trouble. Since all we had ever heard before was that her mother was a caring involved parent. I'm not particularly a Sasha fan either, I just think it would be awful if her mother got some unfair rep. that was planted by someone else that is know to manipulate the media.
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
Don't you just love how people interpret things? 
Anyway, I like Sasha, and I've had a hard time believing things about her mother getting too involved, etc. But that's me; I guess I'll always have a hard time believing things I would never do. From what I've seen, Sasha's mom was always there when I Sasha at a few practices, but I didn't think much of it, since I thought that someone had to drive her to and from the rink, etc. I was shocked to find out Sasha's no longer with Tarasova, but I didn't come to like Sasha, because she was with Tarasova, so I'm hoping for and wishing her the best (give them hell at Nats!). Maybe Tarasova wasn't what the doctor ordered, after all.
I like Tarasova, too, but never bought "I'm going to stay in Russia and withdrew from active work," sorry! I've been just sitting patiently and waiting for her return. That wasn't exactly the first time she said something like that. She is quite an emotional person, who sometimes says things in the heat of the moment. It's like people say "I'm going to kill you!", and you really don't expect them to do it. Anyway, I'll spare you my theory about what happened in the Tarasova camp. We have enough of those, already.
As for Joe's conspiracy theory, let's play: Piseev said that only first two places will get a ticket to Worlds. The person who's in third place may or may not go to Worlds. If they decide someone else has better chances at Worlds, they'll choose someone else. The plot thickens! No one's going to challenge Plushenko. I don't know about Griazev's chances against Abt or Klimkin, everything depends on their quads (or lack thereof), and the rest of their jumps. And I wouldn't count out others, like Shubin. If Griazev's fourth, I'll be happy enough (but I'm hoping for third). We'll see. Maybe he'll decide to debut his quad there.
As for Griazev being a wunderkind. Well, like I already wrote in another thread, I still remember that Mishin said he's going to be next Plushenko.
A few days ago I read an old interview of Mishin and when answering the question if he was ever wrong about his students - with his usual candor and self-confidence - he said: Never. So take it what you will from it.
-----
I must say that, for some reason, I've been quite enjoying the whole brouhaha about the whole thing.
Anyway, I like Sasha, and I've had a hard time believing things about her mother getting too involved, etc. But that's me; I guess I'll always have a hard time believing things I would never do. From what I've seen, Sasha's mom was always there when I Sasha at a few practices, but I didn't think much of it, since I thought that someone had to drive her to and from the rink, etc. I was shocked to find out Sasha's no longer with Tarasova, but I didn't come to like Sasha, because she was with Tarasova, so I'm hoping for and wishing her the best (give them hell at Nats!). Maybe Tarasova wasn't what the doctor ordered, after all.
I like Tarasova, too, but never bought "I'm going to stay in Russia and withdrew from active work," sorry!
I've been just sitting patiently and waiting for her return. That wasn't exactly the first time she said something like that. She is quite an emotional person, who sometimes says things in the heat of the moment. It's like people say "I'm going to kill you!", and you really don't expect them to do it. Anyway, I'll spare you my theory about what happened in the Tarasova camp. We have enough of those, already.As for Joe's conspiracy theory, let's play: Piseev said that only first two places will get a ticket to Worlds. The person who's in third place may or may not go to Worlds. If they decide someone else has better chances at Worlds, they'll choose someone else. The plot thickens!
No one's going to challenge Plushenko. I don't know about Griazev's chances against Abt or Klimkin, everything depends on their quads (or lack thereof), and the rest of their jumps. And I wouldn't count out others, like Shubin. If Griazev's fourth, I'll be happy enough (but I'm hoping for third). We'll see. Maybe he'll decide to debut his quad there. As for Griazev being a wunderkind. Well, like I already wrote in another thread, I still remember that Mishin said he's going to be next Plushenko.
A few days ago I read an old interview of Mishin and when answering the question if he was ever wrong about his students - with his usual candor and self-confidence - he said: Never. So take it what you will from it. -----
I must say that, for some reason, I've been quite enjoying the whole brouhaha about the whole thing.
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
Yes. I didn't have one where he's sucking his thumb, lolMathman said:
(if you read it my sig).Well...Griazev was 5th as a Senior at last year's Russian National Championships...with some of the "big names" seeming "iffy" for this year's championships, he could well be a possible medal contender this year. If silver and bronze are rather "assigned" based on how someone is expected to do at Worlds, as someone suggested...well, Russia gets two skaters this year...so bronze would be up for grabs, huh?
For whoever it was who took offense at what I said about Sasha's mom, well, I'm just saying that hyperactive stage mom's aren't unheard of, any more or less than publicity crazy coaches. And I stand by what I said, in light of what has happened...who is saying, Tatiana or other, that Sasha WAS her prize student? Maybe Tatiana saw better potential in Andrei all along? Or, if she had to choose between the two, would have chosen him all along. Right now, I'm just saying that no one hears Tatiana talking about losing her "star student"....maybe she was past thinking of Sasha that way (if she ever did at all).
And Windspirit....I LOVE the pic, and the quote!! TOOOO cute!
Kasey
For whoever it was who took offense at what I said about Sasha's mom, well, I'm just saying that hyperactive stage mom's aren't unheard of, any more or less than publicity crazy coaches. And I stand by what I said, in light of what has happened...who is saying, Tatiana or other, that Sasha WAS her prize student? Maybe Tatiana saw better potential in Andrei all along? Or, if she had to choose between the two, would have chosen him all along. Right now, I'm just saying that no one hears Tatiana talking about losing her "star student"....maybe she was past thinking of Sasha that way (if she ever did at all).
And Windspirit....I LOVE the pic, and the quote!! TOOOO cute!
Kasey
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
Windspirt - You have an "in" with the Russian figure skaters and maybe the Federation, too. I'm envious. Fabulous to read much of what you add to this story on the Men's Nats.
As for conspiracy theories, in general, I find people enjoy putting these theories down yet so often at least one of these conspiracy theories is correct, so I am not against them in general. I do get bored with them when there are too many like Sasha, her molther, and TT. Of course, probably one of them is correct.
As for the Russian boys. I do not have any theory - conspiratorial or otherwise - just a query. I'm not privy to such information. I'm just thinking out loud on what was said about TT and her connection to the Russian Federation. That is not my statement. It was said some time ago by a Russian-fan poster, and no one has come to say she has no such a connection. The question that some theorists have is that TT was sick and going back to Russia for health reasons, yet she was going to train Griazev while she is there. I'm not making this up. This was in the threads. As my Sherlock Holmes instinct came alive, I came up with the query - would TT be there to fix the Russian Nationals? Of course, I wasn't serious. I would have no right to be serious but I enjoy poking around the little gray cells as my Poirot instincts come alive.
In all seriousness, though, Klimkin is one of my top ten of present day skaters. The guy is damn good skater and I'd like to see him skate his best. I would be sad if Griazev gets to Worlds and Klimkin does not. If anyone could imitate the famed Polish dancer, Njinsky, it would be Ilia Klimkin. So I guess I do have ulterior motive, but I'm ok with myself.
Joe
As for conspiracy theories, in general, I find people enjoy putting these theories down yet so often at least one of these conspiracy theories is correct, so I am not against them in general. I do get bored with them when there are too many like Sasha, her molther, and TT. Of course, probably one of them is correct.
As for the Russian boys. I do not have any theory - conspiratorial or otherwise - just a query. I'm not privy to such information. I'm just thinking out loud on what was said about TT and her connection to the Russian Federation. That is not my statement. It was said some time ago by a Russian-fan poster, and no one has come to say she has no such a connection. The question that some theorists have is that TT was sick and going back to Russia for health reasons, yet she was going to train Griazev while she is there. I'm not making this up. This was in the threads. As my Sherlock Holmes instinct came alive, I came up with the query - would TT be there to fix the Russian Nationals? Of course, I wasn't serious. I would have no right to be serious but I enjoy poking around the little gray cells as my Poirot instincts come alive.
In all seriousness, though, Klimkin is one of my top ten of present day skaters. The guy is damn good skater and I'd like to see him skate his best. I would be sad if Griazev gets to Worlds and Klimkin does not.
If anyone could imitate the famed Polish dancer, Njinsky, it would be Ilia Klimkin. So I guess I do have ulterior motive, but I'm ok with myself. Joe
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Maybe Sasha use to be TT's prize pupil until personal issues came along. I remember TT saying that Sasha was in her heart now. I wonder if that is still true. I hope but I'm not really seeing that since Sasha doesn't even know if TT has gone to Russian. It's pretty obvious that neither one has spoken. They had a going away party so was Sasha even there. Just thinking out loud I guess.
Whatever it means, there is this line from Usova/Platov's site:
"Maya says that Tatiana is feeling better now that she does not have so much pressure."
They don't specify what the pressure was. US Nationals with Sasha, now a non-issue? Continuing to coach and travel with Sasha? Something with one of her other students?
I don't know, of course, but in my experience, most break-ups, whether business, personal, artistic, athletic, or some combination, are usuall due to a combination of factors that are difficult to untangle.
I wish Tarasova, Sasha, and Robin Wagner the best.
Rgirl
"Maya says that Tatiana is feeling better now that she does not have so much pressure."
They don't specify what the pressure was. US Nationals with Sasha, now a non-issue? Continuing to coach and travel with Sasha? Something with one of her other students?
I don't know, of course, but in my experience, most break-ups, whether business, personal, artistic, athletic, or some combination, are usuall due to a combination of factors that are difficult to untangle.
I wish Tarasova, Sasha, and Robin Wagner the best.
Rgirl
- Joined
- Jul 28, 2003
- I consistently said on this board that TT is not going to stay in Russia. She's talked about leaving before, and never has. I also agree that Galina seems to be a convenient scapegoat for the whole thing.
- I do believe that Sasha has seen good improvement with Robin, and not because Robin is a better coach than TT. Having a new approach is always good. It's the same as in medicine -- a new medication often brings good immediate results just because of a change. A week later, though, a patient may be back to where they started. (Though I do hope that Sasha and Robin can have a good partnership)
- I do think Sasha was TT's prized pupil. However, now that she no longer is, why wouldn't TT go with her other students to the Russian Naitonals? It's not just Griazev either; it's also her dance team(s).
- As for Griazev's chances... As someone else mentioned, he was 5th at last year's Nationals, so he might actually have a fair shot.
- Finally, TT can have plenty of reasons to want to go to Russia. Her elderly mother is there, her sister, most of her friends, her husband, though he lives in Germany most of the time, could be there as well, etc....
