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Thread: Alex Schwazer, Carolina Kostner's boyfriend, disqualified

  1. #46
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    You're right, it's deliberately misleading to say, look at people who zumba classes and yoga/pilates and say - *they* can't run a very specific distance at this speed so it must be an amazing speed. The comparison should be between other people who run long distances and people who racewalk long distances. I'm sure racewalkers are going to come out at the losing end with that one too, but I feel it's their own fault they refuse to pick up their knees. My problem is with racewalking is that it's pointless as a sport. It requires the cadence of sprinting and the stamina of a marathoner, yet provides neither the speed of the former nor the efficient travel of the latter. In fact, one of its "advantages" is that it burns more calories than walking or running at the same speed. Did someone on the Biggest Loser come up with this?

    I suspect Carolina's boyfriend was roiding at Beijing as well, but I don't think the samples will show anything. No steroid has that kind of half life.

  2. #47
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brightphoton View Post
    You're right, it's deliberately misleading to say, look at people who zumba classes and yoga/pilates and say - *they* can't run a very specific distance at this speed so it must be an amazing speed. The comparison should be between other people who run long distances and people who racewalk long distances. I'm sure racewalkers are going to come out at the losing end with that one too, but I feel it's their own fault they refuse to pick up their knees. My problem is with racewalking is that it's pointless as a sport. It requires the cadence of sprinting and the stamina of a marathoner, yet provides neither the speed of the former nor the efficient travel of the latter. In fact, one of its "advantages" is that it burns more calories than walking or running at the same speed. Did someone on the Biggest Loser come up with this?

    I suspect Carolina's boyfriend was roiding at Beijing as well, but I don't think the samples will show anything. No steroid has that kind of half life.
    You responded to the following statement by blue dog:
    Very few people can run ten miles in an hour, let alone WALK it.
    You seem to deliberately be missing the point. Most people, even reasonably fit ones, can't run 10 miles in an hour. That is objectively true and I've no idea why you have any problem with it. And really, go out there, race walk 50k - or even 20k - and tell us how it went. Sure, you can narrow it down so that you only compare race walkers high level distance runners, but that's not blue dog was talking about, and it would be like saying that people who swim 200m breaststroke suck because 200m freestyle swimmers are faster.

    If the only criterion to determine whether something should be a sport is efficiency in getting from point A to point B, we'll have to do away with a lot of events. Butterfly, breaststroke and backstroke would be pointless, as would the medley events, since freestyle is faster. 100/110 and 400m hurdles and the 3000 steeplechase aren't as efficient as running without anything on the track. Throw in decathlon and heptathlon, because they include hurdles. And you know what, slalom and giant slalom in skiing aren't as fast as skiing, so there's that too. So, do we take away everyone's medals, because their sports are not efficient? You do realize how stupid that sounds, right?

    I'm not sure why you insist on missing the point and demeaning the accomplishments of race walkers, but really, I see no point in continuing.

    Since WADA seems to obtain positive results from old samples every other day, I am sure that if Schwazer was doing the same thing in 2008 they will find it.

  3. #48
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    Wait--I missed that part. They keep old samples, and they're checking them? That would be an amazing piece of forensics.

    Can someone tell me, did they ever prove anything against Florence Griffith-Joyner? She always maintained that she was clean. I always wanted to believe her.

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    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    Wait--I missed that part. They keep old samples, and they're checking them? That would be an amazing piece of forensics.

    Can someone tell me, did they ever prove anything against Florence Griffith-Joyner? She always maintained that she was clean. I always wanted to believe her.
    According to the WaPo article I linked to yesterday, they keep samples from the Olympics for eight years. So there isn't going to be a conclusive answer regarding Flo Jo.

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    Thanks, Buttercup. I guess they keep the samples for eight years in case they find better methods of detection, and when they find someone who has transgressed, they go back and review previous samples to see whether this has been going on all along. Then they rescind medals further back.

    I always felt bad over the suspicion against FloJo. Maybe I'm naive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    Thanks, Buttercup. I guess they keep the samples for eight years in case they find better methods of detection, and when they find someone who has transgressed, they go back and review previous samples to see whether this has been going on all along. Then they rescind medals further back.

    I always felt bad over the suspicion against FloJo. Maybe I'm naive.
    If I remember correctly, the suspicions around FloJo continued after she retired and had a baby; then she died (very sadly imo) I think due to a seizure disorder and her husband requested/allowed a complete autopsy. No evidence of long term drug use was found - but again, this is not conclusive proof that some form of doping/enhancement was not used. But, again, she while alive and her husband after her death too always maintained that she had not doped.

  7. #52
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    I do have some sympathy for the predicament that athletes face. The thing about doping is, it works. If you take steroids you will go higher, faster, stronger. If you don't, you will lose to competitors who do.

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    I feel the same way about swimming as well. Why do we have so many strokes, when some are obviously so slow and not at all functional? It's ridiculous that an athlete like Michael Phelps can get so many medals in the same sport. How many medals are there available in swimming? Multiple each stroke by a distance, and you get way too many medals. It should be like track and field - you get a set number of distances, and that's it. There is no 200 m skipping, 200 m grape vining, 200 m potato sack hopping, and then a 200 m freestyle.

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    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    Well, there are hurdles at various distances and speed walking.

    No potato sack or egg & spoon races yet though

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mathman View Post
    I do have some sympathy for the predicament that athletes face. The thing about doping is, it works. If you take steroids you will go higher, faster, stronger. If you don't, you will lose to competitors who do.
    That's exactly why I feel strong sympathy for the ones who don't cheat. Most of them never win medals or get famous. But they can proudly get on with their lives knowing that they didn't mess with their bodies and no dangers for future children. I'm so fed up with sob stories from athletes who were caught

    Quote Originally Posted by brightphoton View Post
    I feel the same way about swimming as well. Why do we have so many strokes, when some are obviously so slow and not at all functional? It's ridiculous that an athlete like Michael Phelps can get so many medals in the same sport. How many medals are there available in swimming? Multiple each stroke by a distance, and you get way too many medals. It should be like track and field - you get a set number of distances, and that's it. There is no 200 m skipping, 200 m grape vining, 200 m potato sack hopping, and then a 200 m freestyle.
    I agree with this. For me freestyle swimming would be enough. Luckily there are no disciplines like running backwards or having to use all four limbs etc. I can accept hurdles though. It's like an original way to run in the nature, jumping over logs and stones tripping in water

    IMO, race walking is a pretty stupid sport. The definition is that you always keep one foot on the ground. Lots of referees stand along the track to check that the athletes don't run. 8 walkers out of about 60 were disqualified in this 50 km olympic race.

    Of course, I don't have to watch swimming or race walke if I don't like it. So let it be.

    I think people here wouldn't care about race walk or Schwazer if he wasn't Kostner's boyfriend. Or does everyone here know the famous guys who medaled at the 50 km race in London I'll reveal that the Irish walker Heffer, who was happy to see the back of Schwazer, was fourth.

  11. #56
    Off the ice Buttercup's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snowflake View Post
    For me freestyle swimming would be enough. Luckily there are no disciplines like running backwards or having to use all four limbs etc. I can accept hurdles though. It's like an original way to run in the nature, jumping over logs and stones tripping in water
    I like that there are different disciplines in swimming. My only issue is that I think people have to keep that in mind when comparing the medal counts of swimmers with those of athletes in other disciplines. I was watching the marathon today, and thought that Stephen Kiprotich's win was pretty cool - the first OGM for his country in 40 years. He might not get the chance to compete for more than a couple more medals at the Olympics during his career, but how's that for impact?

    I think people here wouldn't care about race walk or Schwazer if he wasn't Kostner's boyfriend. Or does everyone here know the famous guys who medaled at the 50 km race in London I'll reveal that the Irish walker Heffer, who was happy to see the back of Schwazer, was fourth.
    Of course most of us wouldn't care beyond the usual "doping sucks" comments. Her name is in the thread title and the connection is what makes it interesting to skating fans, because you can also speculate about the effect on Caro (oh please let it be minimal).

    As for Heffernan, he finished 4th in both his events, ouch. I kind of had a feeling that it would end this way. An athlete should focus on his own race, not on the fortunes of his competitors. At least not until he's done with the competition.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buttercup View Post
    As for Heffernan, he finished 4th in both his events, ouch. I kind of had a feeling that it would end this way. An athlete should focus on his own race, not on the fortunes of his competitors. At least not until he's done with the competition.
    True. Focus on yourself is the key. The winners in the future will be the ones who don't twitter, blogs, instagram themselves, facebook or update their webs sites during competitions

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buttercup View Post
    I like that there are different disciplines in swimming. My only issue is that I think people have to keep that in mind when comparing the medal counts of swimmers with those of athletes in other disciplines. I was watching the marathon today, and thought that Stephen Kiprotich's win was pretty cool - the first OGM for his country in 40 years. He might not get the chance to compete for more than a couple more medals at the Olympics during his career, but how's that for impact?


    Of course most of us wouldn't care beyond the usual "doping sucks" comments. Her name is in the thread title and the connection is what makes it interesting to skating fans, because you can also speculate about the effect on Caro (oh please let it be minimal).

    As for Heffernan, he finished 4th in both his events, ouch. I kind of had a feeling that it would end this way. An athlete should focus on his own race, not on the fortunes of his competitors. At least not until he's done with the competition.
    Heffernan seemed pretty cold to me, and I'm not sorry he came in fourth instead of in medal position.

    Yes, wasn't it great that Uganda won a gold? I think the last one who won was probably John Akii-Bua, who won in (goes to check) yes, the 400 meter hurdles in Munich.

    I don't mind that the swimmers have so many events. Yes, some swimmers end up with a lot of medals, but as you say, the single medal of a marathoner or a decathlete doesn't mean any less. Anyway, it's not going to change anytime soon, so I'll just enjoy the athletes doing what they do best. (I do wish that they had a medal for each section in SKATING, though! One for short, one for long. One for school figures from those years, too. And then the overall one. And give them retroactively! Hrrrmph. Although that may mean that school figures specialists like Isabella de Navarre end up with a gold. A small price to pay for watching folk like Debi Thomas, Elizabeth Manley, and Michelle Kwan get honored.)

  14. #59
    Wicked Yankee Girl dorispulaski's Avatar
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    There are so many sports in the Olympics, it's just natural that there will be some that a given person won't appreciate.

    Our friends Jimmy & Sharon were just here, and Jimmy was going on about the ridiculousness of what he had just seen on TV from the Olympics. 5 girls on a mat dancing and throwing dodgeballs. He said he could see that on the street in front of his house any day.

    He then said it would make a good sport if they combined the five girls with balls with 5 skeet shooters shooting at the balls while they were in the air, though.

    Now me, I like team rhythmic gymnastics. "Each to his own taste, as the old woman said as she kissed her cow."

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buttercup View Post
    If the only criterion to determine whether something should be a sport is efficiency in getting from point A to point B, we'll have to do away with a lot of events.
    All events except auto racing.

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