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Thread: The season cometh-how do we make it a friendly, really fun place

  1. #16
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    Most of the time I think we do very well. The rest of the time, well, our mods are great and manage to remind us that we are sedate and cultured souls.
    Last edited by Olympia; 08-13-2012 at 07:51 PM.

  2. #17
    Custom Title skateluvr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    There is a bunch of sports where opponents' fans are friendly to each other. The reason is simple- more or less fair judgement. I wonder if it ever will be the case with FS. The rason of unfriendlyness is the corruption of the moder judging system. Naturaly it's kind of naive to ask people to shup up when they see unfairness. It's simply not in human nature.
    That is true...in a judged sport where the rules are massive and confusing for many, inknown to many, and have changed a lot, it is a perfect set up for conflict. But MM's funny example hits the nail on the head of all the fights. We cannot call another poster names. We can't say really mean things about a skater. We can however pick on federations because they are all evil and corrupt. I wish i could remember what page of the guidelines I saw that on....

    Seriously Blubonnet, is there a federation that contests more results and complains more their skaters were robbed than the Russian Federation? Let us recall mens Oly comp 2010. One does not have to go far back. I did say blue that I think most are pretty corrupt but there has been a positive change (because they were forced to change-FS judging) since the SLC scandal. I think the 2006 Oly Podium was fair and so was the 2010 podium. One really must be an insider fly on the wall to see if back room deals are made. In terms of sportsmanship, Russian athletes often come across as "robbed" if they disagree with placement. now, i honestly view it this way and perhaps it is dumb to say this (tho I am one of many with these feelings). It isn't that I want "my country" to win. I want the best to win, whether that is the Russian skater, the USA, the French, or the Canadian.

    With the current system, we are having a hard time as the sport has been REDEFINED in many ways. Right now the trend is to reward basic skating skills, speed, transitions in and out of jumps. One can get points attempting a jump even if it ends in face plant. All this gets argued as what is fair, just and representative of the def. of beautiful skating.

    I will wager right now that Russia will do all to have the best prepared athletes in Sochi, will win many golds justifiably, but skating is so political that the nature is the host country has an advantage. In an Olympics or WC or even GP event, it is common to see a skater held up and medal (Bronze being a popular medal) from the host country. Politics is somewhat like a game of good manners when done well. Think of it. Russia spends a fortune hosting the world-a real fortune probably better spent on pressing social issues, healthcare, education etc. This is the same as we just saw in GBR. In the judged sports, there is room to juggle the scores to have host Athlete take the podium.

    Let us say 2010 was in Sochi- all else was the same- same skaters- the whole thing. Do you think it would be possible, given how close the judged scores were in FS that Evgeni would have a second Gold and not a silver? I think it is entirely possible, even likely, that somehow the judges who are anonymous and who are in fact political beings as we all are, subject to higher powers in the sport, might have found Evgeni's skate a bit better, and simply said, Look at the jumps he attempted and completed and they were worth x.xx. Evan had no quad. Nice skating, but we don't give Olympic gold to quadless men since the 1980's. See my point? In Sochi, there may be a judging scandal in a judged sport. It may be a close result. But to make a stink and file a protest is bad manners with some federations. Culturally, the japanese are less likely to. Would anyone argue that?

    And if the numbers are very close, who can argue with anonymous subjective judges -and who wants to upset the host country who has gone into Debt to welcome the world? That is my point. I am sure someone with good research skills could go back through years of FS and find the nations who have contested the results or who have acted very well, upset/angry/disgusted on camera. It won't be me but it might be an interesting study - FS, Gymnastics, Diving-every sport that is judged going back decades. There is a lot of disagreement. And there is leeway to fix the results. CoP was supposed to make that harder, or impossible by judging every little thing.

    Do people feel it has fixed the fairness in judging problem? I think it looks in the short run IMPROVED, YES, BUT imho far from the answer to the problem. Personally, I think there is no way to fix entirely due to the the who subjectivity/political thing. So it will always be a debate.

    But MM clearly says how to be freindly. And it is hard when some people will personalize, idolize a skater/swimmer/gymnast etc.

    I find myself wondering now after reading articles on doping, how clean swimming was. I want to believe we have seen a great athlete over four games who was simply the best at what he does. But now that I have read these articles and have seen the idols fall I just don't know what to think, even in sports where it should be easy to judge "the best." Somewhat OT of this post, but you get my point.

    And as I said to Seniorita in forum and off, I love Plush, Artur and many Russian skaters, as well as their amazing culture. Over time though, which Federations behave badly? Perhaps I need to be much more politically correct, but what fun is discussion if you answer every question like a politician? My name isn't Hillary. and world peace doesn't hinge on skating contests, thank God.
    Last edited by skateluvr; 08-13-2012 at 08:08 PM.

  3. #18
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    Let me remind you that there is only one fs federation whose whining and complaints ended up in the second OGM. And no one went so far.

    That was when the evil a.k.a. modern judging system started.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    But to make a stink and file a protest is bad manners with some federations. Culturally, the japanese are less likely to. Would anyone argue that?
    What?! The Olympics has just ended on Sunday. And you've already forgotten its men's team gymnastics?! I'm not saying whether the protest was right or wrong. I feel funny you said this because it was no other but Japanese team protested. In women's balance beam, US team protested. (Though they were correct to make the protests and succeeded.)

    I think a host country does get some advantages in their favor. Like British diver Tom Daley got the second chance to redo a dive and got bronze in the end. Like British lady gymnast Elizabeth Tweddle's uneven bar bronze. Did British Federation politick in this game? I don't know but I don't think so. I think it's a common curtesy that the judges chose to do things in favor of the host country and their athletes, like Daisuke Takahashi's sky high marks in 2012 team event in Japan. It's not the host country who did any evil politicking or anything like that. US got such advantages too in numerous hostings. It's not just Russians.

    Quote Originally Posted by let`s talk View Post
    Let me remind you that there is only one fs federation whose whining and complaints ended up in the second OGM. And no one went so far.

    That was when the evil a.k.a. modern judging system started.
    Sure. Only the evil Canadians. Who else would do such a thing! But please tell me, why did they listen and change the result and add a gold medal? It must be clear that it was ISU who went that far, not Canadians.



    (To make myself clear, I hated the decision of adding a gold medal and I loved the Russian pairs the best.)
    Last edited by Bluebonnet; 08-14-2012 at 08:41 AM.

  5. #20
    Trixie Schuba's biggest fan! blue dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skateluvr View Post
    LoL. I love the part where it says ."And in the interest of lively discussions, we encourage all to be HONEST and not worry about being PC all the time, as we pride ourselves as being the "funnest" FS forum on the net! P_AR_T_Y!!!!!! " Thems are great guidelines!
    LOL What message board has that rule?

  6. #21
    Custom Title skateluvr's Avatar
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    Maybe every federation has its day. I wonder what Federation has contested the most over time in FS? How would anyone find that even?

  7. #22
    Figure Skating Is A Dangerous Sport Dee4707's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olympia View Post
    Most of the time I think we do very well. The rest of the time, well, our mods are great and manage to remind us that we are sedate and cultured souls.
    Olympia, the mods are good but what I've really enjoyed over the past years is when Paula has to reprimand us. It's been few and far between but it has happened.

    I haven't seen real blood baths here since Michelle & Sasha were skating. I got into a few of those myself...it was great!!!

  8. #23
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Paula's gone more to PMing

  9. #24
    Figure Skating Is A Dangerous Sport Dee4707's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    Paula's gone more to PMing
    Currently, I have been a good girl so Paula doesn't need to PM me.

  10. #25
    I like pie. Tonichelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dee4707 View Post
    Currently, I have been a good girl so Paula doesn't need to PM me.
    ha ha, that probably has something to do with KW being AWOL... I miss her.

  11. #26
    Figure Skating Is A Dangerous Sport Dee4707's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tonichelle View Post
    ha ha, that probably has something to do with KW being AWOL... I miss her.
    Me too. She always added a little spice to things...uh just enough to keep us on our toes.

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