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Thread: Ashley or Gracie?

  1. #16
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    I think the National title is really up in the air the season for the ladies. I don't think Alissa will be fully back to form by January, so I'd be surprised if she won, but the podium certainly isn't out of the question. Ashley and Gracie both had fantastic 2011-2012 seasons, and we'll have to see how they deal with having more attention, pressure, and expectations placed on them this season while trying to push the envelope technically with 3-3s in SP and FS (for Ashley), and Rippon lutz and two 3-3s in the FS (for Gracie). Mirai and Agnes were hot and cold last season but both seem to have made a lot of improvements and changes in their life and seem to be in a good place now, we will see how they fair this fall, but I definitely wouldn't count either out because Mirai has it all when she hits and Agnes is just a hugely talented jumper who's steadily improving in other areas. Caroline was the comeback kid last year, I don't think she'll win Nationals this season, but who knows, podium is definitely possible, especially with her killer 3lo-3lo and adding the 3s back into her programs. On the same note, Samantha Cesario seemed strong at Liberty, and also reportedly has 3lo-3lo, her jumps are Volchokovan in size, she has said she's aiming to medal at Nationals this season, and if she stays healthy, who knows. Rachael and Christina are both strong skaters and both balancing skating with really rigorous full-time college courseloads (at Standford and Harvard!!) this season which is obviously a tall order, so I'd be shocked if either won, but the podium is not out of the question, Rachael has experience on her side and knows how to compete and Christina is a great jumper and can use her willowy body to her advantage when she's on form.

    Those are the main podium contenders I would identify for now, but that could change later on, you never know. Hannah Miller, Vanessa Lam, Yasmin Siraj, Leah Keiser, Courtney Hicks, Angela Wang, etc. could all start skating really well and mix things up, especially because the last 3 girls in that list come armed with difficult 3-3s which could give them an edge. I'd definitely be surprised if any of them won, but medaling is an entirely different story and there's more room for a skater with no/little reputation to sneak onto the podium in 3rd or 4th place IMO. So as of right now, the main contenders for the title I'd say are Courtney, Gracie, Agnes, and Mirai, then medal contenders add in all the other girls I mentioned. But yeah, pretty large and talented field, it should be exciting to watch!
    Last edited by silverlake22; 09-01-2012 at 01:49 PM.

  2. #17
    Custom Title Cherryy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    Just curious, why does everyone thing that Gracie Gold or Ashley Wagner will be at the top?

    And about Gracie Gold - I am not denying her successful last season, but Caroline Zhang has similar successful season (or several seasons) a few years ago...
    They both were good at nationals, worlds and WTT. Ashley also won 4cc. Who can really challenge them? Maybe Caroline, that's true, but Mirai is a bit unpredictable, just like Alissa, Zawadzki seems not to be able to perform under pressure. Flatt and Gao are going to concentrate on school rather than skating. Probably. Apart from Caroline, maybe Mirai. If she could do the same thing this season like Caroline did the past one :D.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    You summed it up very well.....

    Here is Gracie's new SP .....(remember, it is early in the season).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IAHHpRcsuI

    Watching the winner of the first JGP this season I see little in common in the level of maturity Gracie shows here.

    Not a problem if iGracie is not up to Kwan-Yuna standards yet - but still a heck of alot more mature looking than the newest Russian baby whose skating makes Tara look like a mature Grand Dame skater

    But hey, the Russian girl is great but only 13. She looks and skates like a 13 year old.
    I would like to point out that you are comparing a fresh junior (junior at her debut) with someone who is going to compete as a senior! Of course Radionova looks like 13 years old, because she is 13 years old. That is the reason why she skate at junior grand prix (and why she is allowed to skate there only from this season). Whereas Gold is going to be competing at seniors. And as you mentioned the 'Russian babies', I would like to point out that one of them beat Gracie at Junior worlds 2012 and another beat Gracie at World team trophy...

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    My gosh, I admit she is a great 13 year old skater but posters who say Gracie is still a junior need to watch a little closer.
    Juniorish may not be the right word, because she is better than a lot of seniors in aspects of her skating some of us perceive as weak. I think she may come across that way because her jumps are so much better than anything else she does.

    I think Ashley will repeat this year as National champ, primarily because she jumps well enough to keep her scores close to Gracie, and will do far better on PCS.

  5. #20
    Custom Title christinaskater's Avatar
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    Ashley has some of the best jumps in the biz. Her skating is one of the best and her artistry has improved vastly.

    I reckon she will be a World Champion soon if she keeps making a name for herself with her consistency and the overall level of her skating.

    With the return of Ando, Kim and who knows a renewed fire in Asada it's going to be one heck of a year.

    I am also excited for Kostner and Suzuki. I do hope Akiko is going to kill it this season.

    Tuktamysheva will certainly be in the mix together with Gracie.

    Caroline is looking ferosh lately, so it's going to be exciting.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by christinaskater View Post
    Ashley has some of the best jumps in the biz. Her skating is one of the best and her artistry has improved vastly.

    I reckon she will be a World Champion soon if she keeps making a name for herself with her consistency and the overall level of her skating.

    With the return of Ando, Kim and who knows a renewed fire in Asada it's going to be one heck of a year.

    I am also excited for Kostner and Suzuki. I do hope Akiko is going to kill it this season.

    Tuktamysheva will certainly be in the mix together with Gracie.

    Caroline is looking ferosh lately, so it's going to be exciting.
    And I expect Adelina to be in the mix if not to win Wolrds ths season.

    But I hate to make predictions coz when it comes to skating....ice is slippery
    Last edited by janetfan; 09-01-2012 at 06:25 PM.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    And I expect Adelina to be in the mix if not to win Wolrds ths season.

    But I hate to make predictions coz when it comes to skating....ice is slippery
    What do you think makes Adelina a strong contender?

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by krenseby View Post
    What do you think makes Adelina a strong contender?
    Talent....I think she has it all. Athleticism. artistry, expression ......

  9. #24
    I got your program components right here. Pepe Nero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    Here is Gracie's new SP .....(remember, it is early in the season).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IAHHpRcsuI
    Thanks for sharing this link, janetfan. Gold reminds me in almost every way, down to the costume, of Agnes Zawadzki. I hope Gold will be able to skate clean LPs, which I don't think Zawadzki has yet done even once at the senior level. I don't think Gold's SP looks junior-ish, but I would be shocked if she were able to get 7s or higher in any of the PCS categories with it.

    I think Nationals is likely to play out in a way that will belie most of our predictions. But if I had to put money on it, I'd say Wagner will win again. She will have a PCS advantage over Gold to help her even if she makes mistakes. In my fantasies, Czisny wins the gold or the silver.
    Last edited by Pepe Nero; 09-01-2012 at 10:38 PM.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by krenseby View Post
    What do you think makes Adelina a strong contender?
    She has medaled in every event she has entered the last two years, and even with some weak programs. She could be unbeatable in a few years when she skates clean.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pepe Nero View Post

    I think Nationals is likely to play out in a way that will belie most of our predictions. But if I had to put money on it, I'd say Wagner will win again. She will have a PCS advantage over Gold to help her even if she makes mistakes. In my fantasies, Czisny wins the gold or the silver.
    In your dreams and mine, Pepe! Alissa is such a joy to watch that I always hope for her to excel. I fear it's not to be this year, but we can always cross fingers and aspire.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    You summed it up very well.....

    Here is Gracie's new SP .....(remember, it is early in the season).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IAHHpRcsuI

    Watching the winner of the first JGP this season I see little in common in the level of maturity Gracie shows here.

    Not a problem if iGracie is not up to Kwan-Yuna standards yet - but still a heck of alot more mature looking than the newest Russian baby whose skating makes Tara look like a mature Grand Dame skater

    But hey, the Russian girl is great but only 13. She looks and skates like a 13 year old.

    Gracie is looking stunning but there is something about her arms..reminds me a bit about Kimmie Meissner in her early days.
    I hope she will work on it as she has everything else.
    It is refreshing to see an American lady going for a harder technical content and it seems like others are following with Wang/Hicks
    attempting 3/3 on the JGP circuit..

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    If Radionova beat a clean Gracie I would probably stop watching figure skating.

    Like I said Radionva makes Tara look like the "Queen of all figure skating."

    My gosh, I admit she is a great 13 year old skater but posters who say Gracie is still a junior need to watch a little closer.
    Janetfan, I struggle to understand why when you want to lift Gracie up, you have a need to kick someone's success down. Especially a success of 13 year old girl. As I said, you are comparing incomparable. Radionova cannot beat Gold this season because Gold will be competing in seniors, whereas Radionova is just old enough to compete in juniors. If you really want to compare Gold to someone from Russian youngsters, compare her to Sotnikova, Tuktamysheva and Lipnitskaya. Or, if you still insist on comparing her to Radionova, make the comparison fair - Radionova is 13, what were Gracie's results when she was 13? Radionova was 5th at the seniors nationals (in a very strong field) and 3rd at the junior nationals. As far as I am aware, Gracie did not qualify to compete at senior or junior nationals when she was 13. I do agree with you that Gracie is a good skater, but there really is no need to try to reduce someone's else's results. In year or two, when Radionova can skate in seniors, we will see which of them will be better.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by hanca View Post
    I would like to point out that you are comparing a fresh junior (junior at her debut) with someone who is going to compete as a senior! Of course Radionova looks like 13 years old, because she is 13 years old. That is the reason why she skate at junior grand prix (and why she is allowed to skate there only from this season). Whereas Gold is going to be competing at seniors. And as you mentioned the 'Russian babies', I would like to point out that one of them beat Gracie at Junior worlds 2012 and another beat Gracie at World team trophy...
    I did not bring up who beat who but for some reason you felt it necessary.

    Glad you agree that Radionova, as wonderful as she is looks and skates like a 13 year old.

    I was commenting on Gracie's level of maturity. She just turmed 17 last week so hopefully she would look and skate with more maturity.

    Nobody here is claiming she is a wunderkind. We might even call her a late bloomer of sorts.

    Here is Radionova's impressive debut at the JGP.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpQrgiMV3eM&feature=plcp

    I think she skated better as the program went on and easy to see her great potential. I was surprised that her posture seems a little weak, other than that she is a phenom.
    Last edited by janetfan; 09-02-2012 at 08:01 AM.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by janetfan View Post
    You summed it up very well.....

    Here is Gracie's new SP .....(remember, it is early in the season).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IAHHpRcsuI

    Watching the winner of the first JGP this season I see little in common in the level of maturity Gracie shows here.

    Not a problem if iGracie is not up to Kwan-Yuna standards yet - but still a heck of alot more mature looking than the newest Russian baby whose skating makes Tara look like a mature Grand Dame skater

    But hey, the Russian girl is great but only 13. She looks and skates like a 13 year old.
    Well, actually you did bring her up first, not me. All I did was remind you that comparing a senior to junior (4 years younger) is unfair. What a surprise that 17 years old looks more mature than 13 years old! Hallelujah!

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