State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season | Page 42 | Golden Skate

State of American Ladies: 2012-13 Season

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
The only World and Olympic events Sasha would have won with everyone skating their best in all programs was the 2004 Worlds and 2006 Worlds, and the latter only since there was none of the top skaters there except for her. 2002, 2003, 2005 Worlds she wasnt ever beating the eventual winner those years even had she skated cleanly.

I was referring to 2006 Worlds, as that is the event Meissner won that Sasha should have. We agree for once.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Yes I am sure Sasha would have won 2006 Worlds even with her Olympic LP and the two falls. They would have given her huge PCS and a score over 120 (remember scoring was MUCH higher at Worlds than the Olympics) and that would have been easily enough to win overall, even if she lost the LP to Meissner.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
It would be intriguing how Czisny is scored if she skates very well. Especialy not knowing how the others will skate, especialy the people the USFSA probably wants to make the team this year- Wagner, Gold, and Nagasu.

Traditionally Czisny has been given rather generous scores, especially when she skates decently. Yes, it would be interesting to see what happens...

Don't be surprised to see her in the final FS group though.
 

Icey

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 28, 2012
Alissa won't be skating at the Detroit club event this week-end. She was expected to.
 

kwanatic

Check out my YT channel, Bare Ice!
Record Breaker
Joined
May 19, 2011
Traditionally Czisny has been given rather generous scores, especially when she skates decently. Yes, it would be interesting to see what happens...

Don't be surprised to see her in the final FS group though.

I think the only way Alissa will make it on that podium is if she earns it. No gifts.

Alissa's last performance was an EPIC FAIL, on the world stage no less. She's had surgery, hasn't competed all season long...she's a huge question mark this year. I don't think the judges will turn their backs on her as quickly as they did Rachael last year but I don't think she'll score the way she's scored the last two years. Final group? Maybe. But given the state her skating was in the last time she skated halfway decently (nationals last year) I don't think she'd beat out Mirai, Gracie or even Gao right now unless the judges help her...
 

Layfan

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
With the revolving door of US skaters over the past 8 years, why does everybody assume that Wagner will win?

I've heard similar things said about other skaters and they ended up falling from grace.

Everyone knows that it's figure skating and that anything can happen. It goes without saying that the favorite might lose. As for Ashley, she's the clearest favorite in years. Even if she wasn't the defending champion she'd probably be the favorite because of the way she has been skating this season compared to the other ladies. Does that mean the others don't stand a chance for gold? Course not.
 

kwanatic

Check out my YT channel, Bare Ice!
Record Breaker
Joined
May 19, 2011
Does that mean the others don't stand a chance for gold? Course not.

It just means it will be easier for Ashley to win and slightly harder for her to lose. Likewise, it will be harder for others to win. As long as she skates close to as well as she did on the GP, she'll win here.

With Alissa last year, if she'd had two strong skates like she did in 2011 she would have won. But Alissa had problems in the SP and even more problems in the LP...Ashley had two great programs and was the obvious winner that night but if Alissa had skated better than she did (ie. if it had been a close competition) the favor would have gone Alissa's way.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I guess the question for Czisny is first how she skates. Then how will she be judged based on how she skates and relative to how her competitors skate. Will the scores indicate:

1. She is still a judges pet who will be gifted over superior performances from others (hugely unlikely IMO).
2. She will be marked fairly and now blackballed like Flatt last year (quite possible IMO, but even in this case I think even with a good competition she would need major help from others to make the team this year).
3. She will be blackballed ala Flatt last year and slammed by the judges (quite possible also IMO).
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
It just means it will be easier for Ashley to win and slightly harder for her to lose. Likewise, it will be harder for others to win. As long as she skates close to as well as she did on the GP, she'll win here.

With Alissa last year, if she'd had two strong skates like she did in 2011 she would have won. But Alissa had problems in the SP and even more problems in the LP...Ashley had two great programs and was the obvious winner that night but if Alissa had skated better than she did (ie. if it had been a close competition) the favor would have gone Alissa's way.

Very true. Last years Nationals was always Czisny's to lose. Things can change alot in just a year though in this sport. Last year Wagner needed help from Czisny, and possibly even Zawadzki (after the SP) and Nagasu to win, however this his years Nationals is clearly Wagner's to lose, even more than Czisny's last year. Meanwhile Czisny's spot on the podium, let alone the World team, is likely for other people to lose and even open the opportunity for her to win this year.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
I think if Alissa skates well she will get PCS marks in the Mirai/Gracie range, and below Ashley's. The USFSA should be pleased with Ashley's results in the last year and it makes sense that they will want to send her to 4CC and/or Worlds as the clear favorite amongst the American women. Obviously we need to see what happens at Nationals, but I think any close results are going to go Ashley's way because she is our most reliable competitor (currently) by a mile.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
I think if Alissa skates well she will get PCS marks in the Mirai/Gracie range, and below Ashley's. The USFSA should be pleased with Ashley's results in the last year and it makes sense that they will want to send her to 4CC and/or Worlds as the clear favorite amongst the American women. Obviously we need to see what happens at Nationals, but I think any close results are going to go Ashley's way because she is our most reliable competitor (currently) by a mile.

Well if that is the case then she (Alissa) obviously wouldnt make it if they all skate well, as if her all skate well her technical is the weaker than Gold (by alot) and a bit weaker than Nagasu too. Her PCS would have to be higher to compensate, to even have chance at 2nd or 3rd.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Well if that is the case then she (Alissa) obviously wouldnt make it if they all skate well, as if her all skate well her technical is the weaker than Gold (by alot) and a bit weaker than Nagasu too. Her PCS would have to be higher to compensate, to even have chance at 2nd or 3rd.

She does get more points on the other TES elements and probably better GOE on the jumps she does land because her flow into and out of (successful) jumps is impressive. It is rare that we see most of the top skaters skate their best so i think Alissa has as good a chance of silver as anyone else, especially after seeing her SP yesterday.
 

pangtongfan

Match Penalty
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
She does get more points on the other TES elements and probably better GOE on the jumps she does land because her flow into and out of (successful) jumps is impressive. It is rare that we see most of the top skaters skate their best so i think Alissa has as good a chance of silver as anyone else, especially after seeing her SP yesterday.

On spins and spirals she gets more points than alot of skaters, but Nagasu can match her there. Her jumps get better GOE than others you think, sorry I think the reverse, her jumps always get little GOE even when at her best compared to other top skaters.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
Czisny competed her short program this week at a local competition - check it out:

http://www.fox11online.com/dpp/spor...sny?ref=scroller&categoryId=10001&status=true

(This may have been posted in the Czisny thread, but it is relevant here too.)

____

She tightened up a bit on that first jump and came up short, but other than that - looks like she hasn't missed much of a beat. She'll probably want to pick up some speed though. Again, remember that this is only the SP...the FS will show her REAL endurance and ability.
 

R.D.

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 26, 2003
There was a video posted (it has since been taken down) that showed her, WAY on the other side of the rink (from the camera view), going down on a jump, possibly a 3F, and unable to get back up again. After a few moments she was approached on-ice by staff and then the video ends. No word on whether she was able to get up on her own power or whether they had to carry her out on a stretcher.

Not clear exactly HOW she got injured but perhaps her knee/hip twisted funny when she went down. Perhaps UR and then twisted it on the ice. Ouch, sounds painful

Doesn't look good for Nationals - or the future of her competitive career for that matter. Fortunately for her, she is the type of skater who can entertain without needing to do jumps, so perhaps she might have a future in show skating.
 

Snoopy15

On the Ice
Joined
Feb 27, 2012
There was a video posted (it has since been taken down) that showed her, WAY on the other side of the rink (from the camera view), going down on a jump, possibly a 3F, and unable to get back up again. After a few moments she was approached on-ice by staff and then the video ends. No word on whether she was able to get up on her own power or whether they had to carry her out on a stretcher.

Not clear exactly HOW she got injured but perhaps her knee/hip twisted funny when she went down. Perhaps UR and then twisted it on the ice. Ouch, sounds painful

Doesn't look good for Nationals - or the future of her competitive career for that matter. Fortunately for her, she is the type of skater who can entertain without needing to do jumps, so perhaps she might have a future in show skating.

You are correct, it was, indeed, a Triple Flip. It's caused her problems in the past, and it just wasn't her day :(
I've heard rumours that she had to be carried out on the stretcher. This doesn't bode well.
Your suspicions are correct. It was under-rotated, and because she still had momentum from the rotations, her blade, although sideways, kept going. The result, a painful one.
 
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